British Gas still using intimidatory tactics for smart meter appointments

Spoonie_Turtle

matt_drummer said:

mmmmikey said:

matt_drummer said:

mmmmikey said:

matt_drummer said:

gbhxu said:

jackieblack said:

gbhxu said:

OFGEM state that you don't have to have a smart meter installed unless you don't want one.

🤔 Huh? 🤔🤷🏻‍♀️

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/information-consumers/energy-advice-households/getting-smart-meter

Do I have to have a smart meter?

Unless there is a good reason not to, suppliers must install a smart meter if they are:

• replacing a meter
• installing a meter for the first time, such as in a new property. 

You can choose not to accept an offer to have a smart meter fitted. You can also request to have one at a later date without being charged. Choosing not to have a smart meter might mean you have a limited choice of energy tariffs. Some smart tariffs could be cheaper.

So that is very clear.

You can decline an offer to have smart meters fitted early, but when the meters are eventually replaced you must have smart meters unless there is a good reason not to.

Once the meters are required to be replaced, you must have smart meters, there is no choice.

I don't know what constitutes a good reason not to fit them, but I doubt it is any of the common objections posted on this website.

I think I read somewhere that Bill Gates is planning to use the smart meter network to activate the tracking devices he arranged to have injected into us as part of the covid "fake news" vaccination programme after his plan to do this via the 5G network was foiled by vigilant internet users. This is so he can tell his friend Elvis (who isn't dead but is living on the far side of the moon assembling an army of flesh eating zombies) where we are when the attack comes.

Or something like that.

I'll be OK because I've made myself a hat out of tin foil (there's lots of good advice on the internet on the best way to do this) but I'm really concerned that vulnerable 80 year old ladies may fall victim to this wicked scam.

THIS SMART METER ROLL OUT MUST BE STOPPED!!!!!!

(Is that a good enough reason for you ?)

I don't think it'll wash!

In any case, whether you are joking, which I am sure you are, or if you don't want smart meters, it is not me that you would need to have a good enough reason for. I am not an energy supplier and I don't fit smart meters.

I truly cannot think of a good reason that would satisfy the people that fit the meters, but would be interested to hear them if anybody knows.

The meters are not ours and the only truly plausible good reason I can think of is that a customer no longer wanted to be supplied with the energy being metered.

Yes, agree with everything you are saying. If you don't want to use the smart features then fine, but if you refuse to have one installed you should accept that your costs will go up to reflect the cost of manual meter readings, lack of access to off peak discounts and so on.

`I don't want them' will not qualify as a good reason, I suspect.

I don't know what constitutes a good reason not to fit smart meters, I would love to know the valid reasons that would prevent the installation of smart meters.

As it stands with some shortages, I guess there could be a situation where someone has wiring needing a specific type of meter and the supplier can't get hold of one - so not a reason to never fit one, but a reason they can't at that point in time.  Or not physically having space on the backboard, we've had a post about that before, and IIRC it's the DNO's responsibility to move the meter or fit a bigger backboard, something along those lines.

Completely agree that 'I just don't want one' is highly unlikely to be valid.

matt_drummer

Spoonie_Turtle said:

As it stands with some shortages, I guess there could be a situation where someone has wiring needing a specific type of meter and the supplier can't get hold of one - so not a reason to never fit one, but a reason they can't at that point in time.  Or not physically having space on the backboard, we've had a post about that before, and IIRC it's the DNO's responsibility to move the meter or fit a bigger backboard, something along those lines.

Completely agree that 'I just don't want one' is highly unlikely to be valid.

I suspect it will always be an installation issue, I can't see any objection from a customer being accepted as a `good reason not to'

dealyboy

I think there is a lot of conflation in this thread which is essentially a diversion from the topic.

- it is not a discussion about smart meters and their efficacy
- it is not a discussion about the required replacement of an out of date meter

It is a discussion about the authoritarian approach of a private organisation in support of a public policy. It is a 'strong nudge' tactic to engender fear if the implication of the message is not followed. It is just one of a number of behavioural modification techniques used in recent years to manipulate the public to the desired outcome of the government.

The right approach is to inform the customer, provide the positive reasons for a smart reader and to ask, and provide the means by which, the customer if they wish can make an appointment, which if broken may attract a penalty.

mmmmikey

Changing tack slightly, my crystal ball is telling me that we are on the cusp of seing a much wider range of TOU tarriffs and that in order to gain traction the energy suppliers are likely to make those very attractive initially, creating very obvious, immediate financial benefits to having a smart meter. I wouldn't be surprised if we see the situation in a few years time where suppliers are required to fit a smart meter within so many weeks or offer compensation if that's not possible.

Some people will take longer than others to recognise the benefits of smart meters and move forward and take advantage of them. And there will always be the die-hard core who need to be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century of metering but I expect that core will become smaller and smaller until it fizzles out and becomes irrelevant. At that point when spurious objections are raised we'll be able to relax, smile, tell the objectors they're probably right and then completely ignore them.

matt_drummer

dealyboy said:

I think there is a lot of conflation in this thread which is essentially a diversion from the topic.

- it is not a discussion about smart meters and their efficacy
- it is not a discussion about the required replacement of an out of date meter

It is a discussion about the authoritarian approach of a private organisation in support of a public policy. It is a 'strong nudge' tactic to engender fear if the implication of the message is not followed. It is just one of a number of behavioural modification techniques used in recent years to manipulate the public to the desired outcome of the government.

The right approach is to inform the customer, provide the positive reasons for a smart reader and to ask, and provide the means by which, the customer if they wish can make an appointment, which if broken may attract a penalty.

Threads evolve, I see no issue with that.

I reread the OP's post and it clearly said that they didn't want smart meters fitted.

Eventually suppliers will have to `force' the issue, and that is what the topic is about.

BG have taken a proactive approach, maybe a little heavy handed for some but what should they do, keep accepting `no thanks, I don't want them'?

We all have to comply with the will of governments from taxation to motoring offences, it is how a law abiding society behaves.

A smart meter has no influence on your behaviour, it is just a device to measure how much energy you have consumed, they are just the latest version of what homes have had fitted for decades.

There can't be that much fear from a £30 fine, that you would probably not be charged in any case, it's £30, not life imprisonment!

The meters belong to the energy network, not only do they have a right to change their meters, but OFGEM insists that when meters are changed they must be smart meters.

Customers shouldn't and cannot be allowed to evade the installation just because they don't want them, they don't have a choice, it's not their equipment and they agreed to having meters fitted when they agreed their energy contracts.

Mstty

mmmmikey said:

Changing tack slightly, my crystal ball is telling me that we are on the cusp of seing a much wider range of TOU tarriffs and that in order to gain traction the energy suppliers are likely to make those very attractive initially, creating very obvious, immediate financial benefits to having a smart meter. I wouldn't be surprised if we see the situation in a few years time where suppliers are required to fit a smart meter within so many weeks or offer compensation if that's not possible.

Some people will take longer than others to recognise the benefits of smart meters and move forward and take advantage of them. And there will always be the die-hard core who need to be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century of metering but I expect that core will become smaller and smaller until it fizzles out and becomes irrelevant. At that point when spurious objections are raised we'll be able to relax, smile, tell the objectors they're probably right and then completely ignore them.

I agree Time Of Use tariffs instead of historical fixes would be a logical move for many suppliers. Especially those that have taken on the Kraken system.

Somniac

mmmmikey said:

Changing tack slightly, my crystal ball is telling me that we are on the cusp of seing a much wider range of TOU tarriffs and that in order to gain traction the energy suppliers are likely to make those very attractive initially, creating very obvious, immediate financial benefits to having a smart meter. I wouldn't be surprised if we see the situation in a few years time where suppliers are required to fit a smart meter within so many weeks or offer compensation if that's not possible.

Some people will take longer than others to recognise the benefits of smart meters and move forward and take advantage of them. And there will always be the die-hard core who need to be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century of metering but I expect that core will become smaller and smaller until it fizzles out and becomes irrelevant. At that point when spurious objections are raised we'll be able to relax, smile, tell the objectors they're probably right and then completely ignore them.

If and when BG offer a financial incentive such as lower tariffs with the installation of a smart gas meter, I shall be happy to reconsider.However, they have not done so. Also it is a puzzle to me, why they are not made manditory by the Government.

Alnat1

BG are dinosaurs and likely to be one of the last to offer TOU tariffs. They can't even manage E7 with smart meters yet.

silverwhistle

Somniac said:

If and when BG offer a financial incentive such as lower tariffs with the installation of a smart gas meter, I shall be happy to reconsider.However, they have not done so. Also it is a puzzle to me, why they are not made manditory by the Government.

Just out of interest how much do you pay per unit (kWh) for gas? I currently pay 4.52p which is contingent on me having a smart meter. Similarly my two rate electric works out at less than 18p a unit, again accessible because I have a smart meter.

This is not aimed at you but I do get the impression on these boards that the  customers suspicious about smart meters are often the ones who also don't know how much energy they use, complain about how much they are paying and are generally not so well informed as to why smart meters have been mandated by Ofgem. 

Zandoni

The thing that really annoys me with smart meters is that they are replacing perfectly good dumb meters before they have finished there useful life. We are all paying for this and I doubt it will ever be cost effective.