Ticketed less than 2 mins for unloading (Won at IAS Stage!)

BikingBud

diystarter7 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Changes nothing albeit never block a door (I doubt you blocked people getting in or out?).

Hi

"blocking" has a different meaning to different people, EG in the event of an emergency/fire etc, most able-bodied people could easily walk out quickly. However, someone with a walking aid and or walking aids, pram with kids, someone in a wheelchair -
when a fire  etc happens, people often panic and the last thing you want is a suv in from of a any door never mind a communal entrance. I'm with the HA on this one. Why should someone with a pram, or .wheelchair have to negotiate obstacles when there is no need for it to be there?

OP, people don't often think and I'm sure you have seen others do it, but sorry, I am now with the HA

Ask the HA for more signs, clearer signs, may be?

Good luck


Thanks

This would be covered by the risk assessment which would discuss the issue of blocked and limited access fully and identify a safe system with appropriate mitigation (allowance) for residents and delivery activities.

Oh wait a minute, maybe they haven't done that or perhaps given the suggested 5 min leeway they have accepted that the likelihood of a blocking event occurring is extremely remote, although you could surmise that different tenants could follow on for their own 5 mins leading to perpetual blocking. But again a well considered RA would cover this and perhaps prompt the installation of posts/bollards directly around the door area to prevent blocking of exits.

We don't know for sure but it all sounds weak to me.

diystarter7

BikingBud said:

diystarter7 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Changes nothing albeit never block a door (I doubt you blocked people getting in or out?).

Hi

"blocking" has a different meaning to different people, EG in the event of an emergency/fire etc, most able-bodied people could easily walk out quickly. However, someone with a walking aid and or walking aids, pram with kids, someone in a wheelchair -
when a fire  etc happens, people often panic and the last thing you want is a suv in from of a any door never mind a communal entrance. I'm with the HA on this one. Why should someone with a pram, or .wheelchair have to negotiate obstacles when there is no need for it to be there?

OP, people don't often think and I'm sure you have seen others do it, but sorry, I am now with the HA

Ask the HA for more signs, clearer signs, may be?

Good luck


Thanks

This would be covered by the risk assessment which would discuss the issue of blocked and limited access fully and identify a safe system with appropriate mitigation (allowance) for residents and delivery activities.

Oh wait a minute, maybe they haven't done that or perhaps given the suggested 5 min leeway they have accepted that the likelihood of a blocking event occurring is extremely remote, although you could surmise that different tenants could follow on for their own 5 mins leading to perpetual blocking. But again a well considered RA would cover this and perhaps prompt the installation of posts/bollards directly around the door area to prevent blocking of exits.

We don't know for sure but it all sounds weak to me.

Oh, wait a minute, the highlighted bit, "risk assessment" - wait a minute and this is why the ticketing people handed out the ticket.

because the parking breached the "risk assessment" you are referring to, yes!

thankfully we do not and have never lived in an apartment but I've visited many clients in the past that were fed up with people parking as they wished. I recall one time someone had parked in front of the communal doors and the car then would not open and was there for a few days until the owner decided to get it opened by a lock person and the residents there were livid.

Thanks

Coupon-mad

this is why the ticketing people handed out the ticket. 

No it isn't.  Private parking firms hand out (or issue by post) PCNs like confetti and that lurking ticketer will have taken a photo at a skewed angle in order to try to extort money from motorists.

It is all about the money.  No risk assessment.

Mouse007

I don't know about anybody else but I am completely confused about the irrelevant DIY clap trap above. Remind me, wft did the sign say about risk assessment which overrides the leaseholders rights as confirmed by Jopson v Homeguard?

BikingBud

diystarter7 said:

BikingBud said:

diystarter7 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Changes nothing albeit never block a door (I doubt you blocked people getting in or out?).

Hi

"blocking" has a different meaning to different people, EG in the event of an emergency/fire etc, most able-bodied people could easily walk out quickly. However, someone with a walking aid and or walking aids, pram with kids, someone in a wheelchair -
when a fire  etc happens, people often panic and the last thing you want is a suv in from of a any door never mind a communal entrance. I'm with the HA on this one. Why should someone with a pram, or .wheelchair have to negotiate obstacles when there is no need for it to be there?

OP, people don't often think and I'm sure you have seen others do it, but sorry, I am now with the HA

Ask the HA for more signs, clearer signs, may be?

Good luck


Thanks

This would be covered by the risk assessment which would discuss the issue of blocked and limited access fully and identify a safe system with appropriate mitigation (allowance) for residents and delivery activities.

Oh wait a minute, maybe they haven't done that or perhaps given the suggested 5 min leeway they have accepted that the likelihood of a blocking event occurring is extremely remote, although you could surmise that different tenants could follow on for their own 5 mins leading to perpetual blocking. But again a well considered RA would cover this and perhaps prompt the installation of posts/bollards directly around the door area to prevent blocking of exits.

We don't know for sure but it all sounds weak to me.

Oh, wait a minute, the highlighted bit, "risk assessment" - wait a minute and this is why the ticketing people handed out the ticket.

because the parking breached the "risk assessment" you are referring to, yes!

thankfully we do not and have never lived in an apartment but I've visited many clients in the past that were fed up with people parking as they wished. I recall one time someone had parked in front of the communal doors and the car then would not open and was there for a few days until the owner decided to get it opened by a lock person and the residents there were livid.

Thanks

Thanks @diystarter7 as you will be aware many contributors on here like to offer advice and guidance to those that have been caught out by overzealous extortionists, so by sharing the RA (that you have obviously seen in order to offer such comments) those minded to provide accurate and effective advice, can.

I would dare to wager that there is and never has been a RA just some twaddle about H&S spouted by someone who:

1. Thought they were being clever.
2. Has no knowledge of risk assessments, how they are completed and should be communicated.
3. Was not aware of the practicalities of unloading and the rights of tenants and homeowners.
4. Didn't want to have an adult discussion about the issues, real or percieved, of tenants unloading vehicles.
5. Wanted to escape from the embarrassing situation. 

Pick a number or perhaps go for the clean sweep, I'm confident that other contributors may think of more excuses. 

Unsure what you last paragraph means, both google and babelfish were unable to decrypt, I understand other services are available but it's late now and time for my bed. 

diystarter7

BikingBud said:

diystarter7 said:

BikingBud said:

diystarter7 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Changes nothing albeit never block a door (I doubt you blocked people getting in or out?).

Hi

"blocking" has a different meaning to different people, EG in the event of an emergency/fire etc, most able-bodied people could easily walk out quickly. However, someone with a walking aid and or walking aids, pram with kids, someone in a wheelchair -
when a fire  etc happens, people often panic and the last thing you want is a suv in from of a any door never mind a communal entrance. I'm with the HA on this one. Why should someone with a pram, or .wheelchair have to negotiate obstacles when there is no need for it to be there?

OP, people don't often think and I'm sure you have seen others do it, but sorry, I am now with the HA

Ask the HA for more signs, clearer signs, may be?

Good luck


Thanks

This would be covered by the risk assessment which would discuss the issue of blocked and limited access fully and identify a safe system with appropriate mitigation (allowance) for residents and delivery activities.

Oh wait a minute, maybe they haven't done that or perhaps given the suggested 5 min leeway they have accepted that the likelihood of a blocking event occurring is extremely remote, although you could surmise that different tenants could follow on for their own 5 mins leading to perpetual blocking. But again a well considered RA would cover this and perhaps prompt the installation of posts/bollards directly around the door area to prevent blocking of exits.

We don't know for sure but it all sounds weak to me.

Oh, wait a minute, the highlighted bit, "risk assessment" - wait a minute and this is why the ticketing people handed out the ticket.

because the parking breached the "risk assessment" you are referring to, yes!

thankfully we do not and have never lived in an apartment but I've visited many clients in the past that were fed up with people parking as they wished. I recall one time someone had parked in front of the communal doors and the car then would not open and was there for a few days until the owner decided to get it opened by a lock person and the residents there were livid.

Thanks

Thanks @diystarter7 as you will be aware many contributors on here like to offer advice and guidance to those that have been caught out by overzealous extortionists, so by sharing the RA (that you have obviously seen in order to offer such comments) those minded to provide accurate and effective advice, can.

I would dare to wager that there is and never has been a RA just some twaddle about H&S spouted by someone who:

1. Thought they were being clever.
2. Has no knowledge of risk assessments, how they are completed and should be communicated.
3. Was not aware of the practicalities of unloading and the rights of tenants and homeowners.
4. Didn't want to have an adult discussion about the issues, real or percieved, of tenants unloading vehicles.
5. Wanted to escape from the embarrassing situation. 

Pick a number or perhaps go for the clean sweep, I'm confident that other contributors may think of more excuses. 

Unsure what you last paragraph means, both google and babelfish were unable to decrypt, I understand other services are available but it's late now and time for my bed. 

Hi
Many thanks for your post and alert, @BikingBud
The last paragraph, the highlighted bit is self-explanatory for those that do not park in front of communal doors and where they are not supposed to park as per rules etc. (I'm talking generally now and not the OP) I can only speak for myself and my family/friends who would not park somewhere that may cause an obstruction as per my detailed post you quoted.
I've met many via work visits that complained about "inconsiderate parking. I for one would not want our drive blocked in part or full. Up until 10 yrs or so ago I had family in Fulham. When we visited them we always had to park several streets away as there was just not space in front of the property as taken up. Mt family that lived there often even with permits had to walk from another road with bags of shopping or plan ahead, and drop of shopping on the pavement.

I had to consult "Babelfish" and similar about your  points  1 to 5 and the sites crashed. However,I knew the answer would not be there regarding several of your points I did so out of courtesy.

I am confident of my stance about parking and driving and have made it clear why people should not park where they are not supposed to. I stand by that and as an excellent driver of around 40 years that has never had a ticket of any type, I am fully aware of my rights to park and when I could be given a ticket as I do not take chances. I am aware that there are private parking firms/individuals that may try it on and for that reason, I park extra carefully. ( None of my post is aimed at the OP, other than the bit I have stated before, ie if OP felt there was no clear signs and the company has not followed the rules, good luck and I hope you are treated fairly.)

Conclusion: There is nothing you can say to change my mind about my general comments about parking & obstructing entrances as I am fully aware that some parking co's will try it on but my  MO is park where I'm 100% sure I can park within the rules and if not, DON'T .

Enjoy your day


 

Trainerman

Conclusion: There is nothing you can say to change my mind about my general comments about parking & obstructing entrances as I am fully aware that some parking co's will try it on but my  MO is park where I'm 100% sure I can park within the rules and if not, DON'T

It is a very interesting debate, if a little off piste for the OP. However, there is a real difference between unloading and parking ( as allowed for in Jopson). None of us would endorse parking inconsiderately and leaving the vehicle, but unloading awkward items, staying near the vehicle AND moving it straightaway is different

diystarter7

Trainerman said:

Conclusion: There is nothing you can say to change my mind about my general comments about parking & obstructing entrances as I am fully aware that some parking co's will try it on but my  MO is park where I'm 100% sure I can park within the rules and if not, DON'T

It is a very interesting debate, if a little off piste for the OP. However, there is a real difference between unloading and parking ( as allowed for in Jopson). None of us would endorse parking inconsiderately and leaving the vehicle, but unloading awkward items, staying near the vehicle AND moving it straightaway is different

Hi

@Trainerman

The "near bit" and "unloading awkward items" I'd agree if the vehicle was in your sight at all times and it was heavy items but not shopping. I may be wrong but the OP's apartment is not on the ground floor judging by a picture they posted here,

However, if there are signs and I've seen them on council and HA estates where they pain a very big yellow box, 'no parking, emergency vehicles on' then you will agree with me it is not the case.  If signs are clear on an estate. 'park within designated, marked bays, to me that is clear, ie no paring outside marked bays.

Thankfully we have never lived on an estate of any type, but as I said in another post, residents often complained to me re other's inconsiderate parking. I also said that me, family etc when visiting family have to park a couple of streets away having driven around for 30/50 mins at times and those that live there are luck to get a parking spot on their street, never mind outside their front door.

I've never had a parking ticket or speeding, it is not luck but paying attention to and practicings my obligations. 
Indeed, people can make mistakes, genuine ones and at times parking signs could be more clear/etc but too many times
I've seen just stop their car anywhere and pop off (not referring to OP)

A new and growing risk is the increase in the number of parking machines that request your registration number - I quadruple check but I am aware when people are under stress, in a rush, particularly at hospitals mistakes can be made and scenarios like that should allow appeals to easily succeed unless its a serial offender.

Thank you

Coupon-mad

The new Code already covers all keying errors and eliminates such PCNs, which must always be cancelled in future.  Not that this case is about that.

This case is about stopping non-instructively to unload at the person's own home. Perfectly allowable and already tested at appeal with persuasive case law.

KXL88

Coupon-mad said:

We have been told by our management that there is a 5 min ‘grace period’ for the purposes of loading/unloading at or near our door. This has recently been confirmed also by our housing management that in the contract between LINK parking and it’s in the contract (5 mins). 

I sincerely hope your idiot housing management team HAVEN'T gone and signed up with another parking firm? Surely not?

We will have the pleasure of being monitored with National Parking Enforcement Ltd starting Jan 9th. CCTV only enforcement. Surely can't be as bad as Link?