EV Discussion thread

Reed_Richards

Maybe it's different where you live, but I rarely see the commercial chargers fully occupied.  So a charging company that broke ranks and charged less per kWh might be able to make up for this by achieving a higher occupancy.  

JKenH

Reed_Richards said:

Maybe it's different where you live, but I rarely see the commercial chargers fully occupied.  So a charging company that broke ranks and charged less per kWh might be able to make up for this by achieving a higher occupancy.  

Might that not lead to a race to the bottom and cause more charging network operators to go under? I would suggest that the overall market for public charging is, in the short term, inelastic - people, generally, only use public chargers when they cannot charge at home and so the overall demand for public chargers will, in the short term be unaffected by price. All that will happen is the overall revenue to the sector will fall and only the strongest will survive. 

In the longer term it might be argued cutting public charging costs may increase the market (for instance, attracting new drivers to EVs who previously ruled them out because they don’t have home charging) but if price cuts are not in the long term economically viable they will creep back up once the weaker competitors have been squeezed out of the market. 

MikeJXE

Once there are enough EVs on the road someone will come up with the idea of Just Charge 

As they did with just Park and Rent My Drive

QrizB

MikeJXE said:

Once there are enough EVs on the road someone will come up with the idea of Just Charge
As they did with just Park and Rent My Drive

Already exists!
Eg. https://co-charger.com (not a recommendation, just a search result).

MikeJXE

There you go 

4 charging points near me at a main road garage installed about 6 months ago and rarely anyone using even 1 of them 

Reed_Richards

JKenH said:

Reed_Richards said:

Maybe it's different where you live, but I rarely see the commercial chargers fully occupied.  So a charging company that broke ranks and charged less per kWh might be able to make up for this by achieving a higher occupancy.  

Might that not lead to a race to the bottom and cause more charging network operators to go under? I would suggest that the overall market for public charging is, in the short term, inelastic - people, generally, only use public chargers when they cannot charge at home and so the overall demand for public chargers will, in the short term be unaffected by price. All that will happen is the overall revenue to the sector will fall and only the strongest will survive. 

In the longer term it might be argued cutting public charging costs may increase the market (for instance, attracting new drivers to EVs who previously ruled them out because they don’t have home charging) but if price cuts are not in the long term economically viable they will creep back up once the weaker competitors have been squeezed out of the market. 

Well yes, but that's business for you.  The stronger companies will survive and buy-up the infrastructure of the weaker companies on the cheap as those companies go under.  With only a few companies remaining, they can set the price, possibly to something higher than it is already.  

QrizB

Once you get past the first few pages, there's a lengthy and well-informed discussion of public charging currently ongoing in this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6604283/person-tripped-over-my-outside-cable-cover-whilst-charging-car/p1

Martyn1981

QrizB said:

Once you get past the first few pages, there's a lengthy and well-informed discussion of public charging currently ongoing in this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6604283/person-tripped-over-my-outside-cable-cover-whilst-charging-car/p1

Does anyone mention the troughs that can be installed (flush) into the pavement to run the cable through? The troughs themselves are very cheap, but I've no idea how easy (or not) it is to get permission from the LA.

QrizB

Martyn1981 said:

QrizB said:

Once you get past the first few pages, there's a lengthy and well-informed discussion of public charging currently ongoing in this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6604283/person-tripped-over-my-outside-cable-cover-whilst-charging-car/p1

Does anyone mention the troughs that can be installed (flush) into the pavement to run the cable through? The troughs themselves are very cheap, but I've no idea how easy (or not) it is to get permission from the LA.

Yes they get a mention, plus there's a £350 Government grant towards installation costs.

The gloomier end of the poster spectrum then point out that they're only really useful if you're guaranteed a parking space.

Grumpy_chap

JKenH said:

So a fantastic performance by all those new car salesmen particularly at PSA who put Tesla to shame. 

I wonder to what extent the PSA group had end of month discounting to seek targets.
Tesla do discount, but not in the same methodology as the legacy car brands have done historically.  
Of the legacy brands, PSA have often been a high discount brand and pitch one dealer against another rather blatantly.

Reed_Richards said:

Maybe it's different where you live, but I rarely see the commercial chargers fully occupied.  So a charging company that broke ranks and charged less per kWh might be able to make up for this by achieving a higher occupancy.  

Oddly, that is how it needs to be to make the system work.  Drivers need to have the confidence that they can access a charger when they need to. 

Around our way, though, the high-speed on-street chargers are always empty but also often faulty and remain faulty for months on end.  The operators seem to have no urgency about fixing faulty pods.  One assumes the operators are aware because the systems all seem to have telemetry back to a central location.

More recently, the Council have been installing charge connectors into lampposts and these seem to be more popular.  Slower charge.  Cheaper charge.  No over-stay penalty.  People can come home from work, park, plug in and leave the car to do its thing while they sleep and go out at their convenience in the morning to unplug and make their next journey. 
From a practical perspective on many occasions that is easier for the driver than a high speed charger that might finish charging and interrupt your evening to unplug and move the car just as you are putting the children to bed or at the critical scene in a thriller movie or whatever.