EV Discussion thread

EricMears

Reed_Richards said:

I had to look-up "frunk".  Surely it should be a "froot"?

It's an Americanism !  (as indeed is everything else on a Tesla)

Hence "FRont trUNK"  rather than "FRont bOOT"

JKenH

michaels said:

Not sure on the epedal on the leaf, you do get used to it pretty quickly but also occasionally forget if you have driven a bit without having to use the braking. It comes on in reverse too which makes no sense so then you turn it off and then don't bother to turn it back on suggesting it is not a definite win. In the leaf it also feels a bit clumsy if you do end up having to use the brake pedal as you are still braking quite hard as you go from the brake back onto the gas.

Also had the emergency assist cut in once unexpectedly on the leaf when I braked a bit late for a roundabout, surprised both drivers and passengers.

I thought e-Pedal was one of the best features of the Leaf as it would hold the car on any gradient without the need for the brake and, with sufficient anticipation, gave true one pedal driving. Some people hate it though. 

My wife always drove the Leaf with e-Pedal on except when manoeuvring (parking etc) as it makes the pedal application too jerky. I really liked e-Pedal around town and also on a brisk drive on twisty roads as a lift (of the pedal) in the right place just seemed to scrub off the right amount of speed for the corner. When I first test drove a 30kWh and 40kWh Leaf back to back I didn’t like e-Pedal but after a while you get to appreciate it, as I am sure one would with one pedal driving in the TM3.

Using e-Pedal all the time is, though, an inefficient way to drive (as is B mode) as for efficient driving you need to maximise coasting. (I never noticed any difference in deceleration between Dand B modes when e-Pedal was selected.) The dash display on the Leaf is great for balancing the throttle downhill or decelerating to keep it in that sweet spot where neither white (power) nor blue (regen) is showing. 

My son never uses e-Pedal and achieves 4.4 mpk average.

EricMears

I very seldom use "eco", "B" or "e-pedal" believing that they're all there to try & improve efficiency for drivers unable to appreciate how to do that for themselves.  Intelligent anticipation and a gentle right foot will give better results every time.

My exceptions are when descending a hill when "eco" or  "B" (dependent upon gradient) will control speed with forced regeneration  and driving in a traffic jam - when you really do need to frequently alternate between accelerating & braking.

Grumpy_chap

silvercar said:

There is something to be said for muscle memory - I've set the Leaf up to default to e-pedal and I engage in B rather than D to mimic this, though its braking isn't quite as effective as in the Tesla. You do get used to it very quickly.

I am not sure I understood that.

Martyn1981 said:

PS - @GC, the glovebox can also be set to require PIN code, so that you can lock stuff away when car is being serviced, borrowed etc etc.. Fort Knox has nothing on a Tesla glovebox! 

I don't understand why I would leave something that valuable (and very small) in the car while it is in for service.
It is very likely that I would say something like "Please could you pass me a tissue / mint from the glovebox" to my wife while driving...

JKenH said:

for efficient driving you need to maximise coasting. 

That would be my thoughts.  Seems as though Elon disagrees.


I am not sure that an EV is going to be possible, but I've gone back to one last basic definition of what a car has to do:

1. It has to be desirable and simply "work" as a car.  I will set a fairly low bar - at least as good as my 2007 Focus that I gave to my Nephew at the end of last year.
2. It has to be "affordable".  I will set a high bar to maximise inclusion - list <£51k and good used examples from <£35k. Both of those are absurdly high numbers
3. It has to be safe.  EURO NCAP 4 star minimum.
4. It has to have a good real world range in any weather, so minimising the number of times I need to use charging away from home.  Minimum 70 mile each way (140 mile total) commute.
5. There has to be enough public access charging that longer journeys can be achieved without excessive inconvenience.
6. Insurance has to be no more than 4 times the cost of my ICE, i.e. annual premium <£1k

Note - I have left out all the "nice to have" criteria that I initially started with, like any kind of comfort features you'd expect with a modern car.

Mrs G-C says I am being too fussy and that is not possible and to just get a Tipo.  Cheap one locally £7k with 50k miles.
Do you experts have any ideas I need to consider?

OR, I could buy a Tesla and give it to my Nephew in exchange for my Focus back...

JKenH

Just get a Golf, you won’t regret it. 

This Match Edition spec has all the goodies you need including a CD player (and SD card slot, both in glovebox plus android auto and CarPlay) and you should have no trouble getting 50-60mpg and 500+ miles range. And as this is a Mk7.5, it still has proper knobs for the HVAC. 16 inch wheels, so ride is really good especially over speed bumps. Cheap insurance. Just a shame they are so expensive to buy in London.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202303095083274

michaels

Grumpy_chap said:

silvercar said:

There is something to be said for muscle memory - I've set the Leaf up to default to e-pedal and I engage in B rather than D to mimic this, though its braking isn't quite as effective as in the Tesla. You do get used to it very quickly.

I am not sure I understood that.

Martyn1981 said:

PS - @GC, the glovebox can also be set to require PIN code, so that you can lock stuff away when car is being serviced, borrowed etc etc.. Fort Knox has nothing on a Tesla glovebox! 

I don't understand why I would leave something that valuable (and very small) in the car while it is in for service.
It is very likely that I would say something like "Please could you pass me a tissue / mint from the glovebox" to my wife while driving...

JKenH said:

for efficient driving you need to maximise coasting. 

That would be my thoughts.  Seems as though Elon disagrees.


I am not sure that an EV is going to be possible, but I've gone back to one last basic definition of what a car has to do:

1. It has to be desirable and simply "work" as a car.  I will set a fairly low bar - at least as good as my 2007 Focus that I gave to my Nephew at the end of last year.
2. It has to be "affordable".  I will set a high bar to maximise inclusion - list <£51k and good used examples from <£35k. Both of those are absurdly high numbers
3. It has to be safe.  EURO NCAP 4 star minimum.
4. It has to have a good real world range in any weather, so minimising the number of times I need to use charging away from home.  Minimum 70 mile each way (140 mile total) commute.
5. There has to be enough public access charging that longer journeys can be achieved without excessive inconvenience.
6. Insurance has to be no more than 4 times the cost of my ICE, i.e. annual premium <£1k

Note - I have left out all the "nice to have" criteria that I initially started with, like any kind of comfort features you'd expect with a modern car.

Mrs G-C says I am being too fussy and that is not possible and to just get a Tipo.  Cheap one locally £7k with 50k miles.
Do you experts have any ideas I need to consider?

OR, I could buy a Tesla and give it to my Nephew in exchange for my Focus back...

Leaf 62 would do what you need, very equivalent to a focus, start at about 16k now.

silvercar

"I am not sure I understood that."

Two cars on the drive, one Tesla and one Leaf. By using B and the e-pedal I am making driving the leaf mimic driving the Tesla as much as I can. 

Grumpy_chap

michaels said:

Leaf 62 would do what you need, very equivalent to a focus, start at about 16k now.

I was not aware there was a larger battery Leaf available.

Just looked, but didn't find a range calculator on the Nissan website.  What real world range will it achieve in the worst of winter motorway driving?

What is public charging like really?

shinytop

I am not sure that an EV is going to be possible, but I've gone back to one last basic definition of what a car has to do:

1. It has to be desirable and simply "work" as a car.  I will set a fairly low bar - at least as good as my 2007 Focus that I gave to my Nephew at the end of last year.
2. It has to be "affordable".  I will set a high bar to maximise inclusion - list <£51k and good used examples from <£35k. Both of those are absurdly high numbers
3. It has to be safe.  EURO NCAP 4 star minimum.
4. It has to have a good real world range in any weather, so minimising the number of times I need to use charging away from home.  Minimum 70 mile each way (140 mile total) commute.
5. There has to be enough public access charging that longer journeys can be achieved without excessive inconvenience.
6. Insurance has to be no more than 4 times the cost of my ICE, i.e. annual premium <£1k

I sometimes have to re-read EV prices to confirm just how expensive they are.  It's worse if you say it out loud.  Fifty. Thousand. Pounds. 

Your bar is, as you say, absurdly high for price but it's also absurdly low for everything else. 

Just think how good a £50k car was in pre-EV days.                 

Grumpy_chap

shinytop said:

Just think how good a £50k car was in pre-EV days.                 

Ahhhh, yes.
But you forget that if I had a £50k EV, even though I am currently sitting on a train, I would be able to open (but not close) the glovebox using an app on my phone.
That has to be worth another £30k.
Think of the hours of fun it could be....