EV Discussion thread

Martyn1981

Grumpy_chap said:

michaels said:

Leaf 62 would do what you need, very equivalent to a focus, start at about 16k now.

I was not aware there was a larger battery Leaf available.

Just looked, but didn't find a range calculator on the Nissan website.  What real world range will it achieve in the worst of winter motorway driving?

What is public charging like really?

It might not give you the cold weather range you were looking for - EV-Database

Not sure how restrictive the CHAdeMO charging is, but lots of people on here with Leafs.

thevilla

We have a 62kwh Leaf.  In winter I'd say 150 miles mixed driving.  Less for short journeys with heating on (just like ICE).  I looked at our stats for 2022 and we averaged 200 miles per 56kwh which I believe is the usable capacity.  Of course you'd be brave to go from 100% to zero every time. Motorway speeds impact range but how many motorways are 70mph?!

We've only rapid charged maybe 20 times and had no significant issue on that limited experience.  Chademo is generally still added to the new charger network although sometimes fewer than CCS on the same site.

Leaf wasn't first choice but the price clinched it with a zero % PCP.

Edit: only one issue was the clicking driveshaft fixed under warranty.

JKenH

Martyn1981 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

michaels said:

Leaf 62 would do what you need, very equivalent to a focus, start at about 16k now.

I was not aware there was a larger battery Leaf available.

Just looked, but didn't find a range calculator on the Nissan website.  What real world range will it achieve in the worst of winter motorway driving?

What is public charging like really?

It might not give you the cold weather range you were looking for - EV-Database

Not sure how restrictive the CHAdeMO charging is, but lots of people on here with Leafs.

But neither would a 2019/2020 standard range Tesla  https://ev-database.org/uk/car/1177/Tesla-Model-3-Standard-Range-Plus

Martyn1981

Possibly worth a quick reminder that there's a difference between the standard range TM3, simply called the TM3, and the older 'TM3 standard range +'.

GC, as I understood it, you were looking for a cold weather range of 160 miles, hence the TM3 LR, with an estimate of 215miles, and I've previously suggested to you that the TM3 might be just enough for your needs with a range of 170miles.

1961Nick

The base model 3 (60kWh) has a WLTP range of 305 miles so that should be 200 miles on a very cold winter's day at motorway speeds. It also has the advantage of charging to 100% without additional battery degradation (LiFePo). New ones were being offered for £38K at the end of March so the same may happen at the end of June.

Martyn1981

1961Nick said:

The base model 3 (60kWh) has a WLTP range of 305 miles so that should be 200 miles on a very cold winter's day at motorway speeds. It also has the advantage of charging to 100% without additional battery degradation (LiFePo). New ones were being offered for £38K at the end of March so the same may happen at the end of June.

I would also guess at 200 miles, since the EV-Database uses -10C for its cold figure.

However, I seem to remember something about LFP being impacted by cold a bit more. But in all honesty, I may have that back to front, and upside down.

But either way I think the TM3 would work for GC, whereas I seem to remember him discounting the SR+ a year or two back.

Sorry GC to talk about you like this, hope I've gotten it all roughly correct, been a long time since we started chatting about your needs.

Grumpy_chap

I think the TM3 SR might well suffice but, if going for a TM3, I'd probably just go for the LR because it offers more flexibility and I'd quite likely regret it if I settled for the SR.

Sadly, the TM3 did not impress as a good car at the weekend 😠

The aspiration, therefore is a good car with long range at accessible charging infrastructure.

Currently looking like it will end up being a Fiat Tipo (or a Golf, as a couple of people suggested).  😥

1961Nick

Martyn1981 said:

1961Nick said:

The base model 3 (60kWh) has a WLTP range of 305 miles so that should be 200 miles on a very cold winter's day at motorway speeds. It also has the advantage of charging to 100% without additional battery degradation (LiFePo). New ones were being offered for £38K at the end of March so the same may happen at the end of June.

I would also guess at 200 miles, since the EV-Database uses -10C for its cold figure.

However, I seem to remember something about LFP being impacted by cold a bit more. But in all honesty, I may have that back to front, and upside down.

But either way I think the TM3 would work for GC, whereas I seem to remember him discounting the SR+ a year or two back.

Sorry GC to talk about you like this, hope I've gotten it all roughly correct, been a long time since we started chatting about your needs.

I also remember the article about LFP batteries being impacted by cold weather but I'm certain it referred to Canada where -10C to -20C is pretty normal. Preheating in those conditions would be extremely beneficial as it can easily save 3kWh in the UK on a sub zero winter morning.

The 90% charged range of the performance model is actually about the same as the 100% charged range of the 60kWh standard range car.

Martyn1981

Heard about this, and found an article, where Renault seem to be saying 'they get it". More a discussion point than news, but I think Renault's thoughts on the Tesla price cuts, and the impact on the industry are positive, in the sense that they can see a big transition is ahead.

Not sure I agree with Elon, when he says:

We’re not “starting a price war”, we’re just lowering prices to enable affordability at scale.

I think he may have missed the point. Yes, they are lowering prices as costs fall, to expand the demand market, but intentionally or not, they absolutely have started a price war. Personally I think that's great for the BEV market from the buyers point of view, but of course, it's really hard on the legacy ICEV manufacturers, who need as much time as possible to transition. Ideally they want a slow transition, with ICEV profits to pay for a BEV expansion. With hindsight, starting 5-10yrs sooner would have helped them, but tbf even optimists like me, didn't spot how quick things would change till about 5-6yrs ago.

Tesla’s price cuts are a challenge to automakers, says Renault CEO

Tesla’s recent further price cuts should be taken as a “warning” for other automakers amid what some see as an “EV price war,” says Renault CEO Fabrice Cambolive.

Since the start of the year, Tesla has adjusted its pricing many times, including two significant price drops across its entire lineup.

The aggressive price drops have led other automakers to reduce the prices of their electric vehicles – leading some to believe that Tesla might have started a price war.

Following the most recent price drop in Europe last week, Fabrice Cambolive, the head of the Renault brand, said that he believes automakers should take Tesla price cuts as a “warning” (via Reuters):

It’s clear that (Tesla cutting prices) is a challenge, starting with the cost side of things. It’s a warning that we are looking at.

Martyn1981

@GC - Good news / bad news!

I know you weren't that impressed with the TM3, but you might find that a longer test drive (Tesla usually let you take the car away for ~1hr), settles you in.

Only mention this because there are rumours that Tesla will be launching the RWD LR TM3 in the UK. This will be priced about midway between the TM3 and the TM3 AWD LR.

Bad news, is that the rumour is that they will only be for business customers, but who knows?


Edit - Should have searched for news first. Looks like it's a stron(ish) rumour:

Tesla launches Model 3 Long Range RWD variant for commercial customers

A Tesla Account Manager in the United Kingdom (UK) recently announced the launch of a Model 3 Long Range RWD variant, specifically catering to the needs of commercial customers. 

The Tesla Model 3 Long Range RWD variant will be available for B2B fleets with a starting price of £46,990 ($58,358.15). Tesla’s Senior Key Account Manager in the UK, Karen Bowen, announced the Model 3 LR RWD through LinkedIn a few days ago.