The big fat Electric Vehicle bashing thread.

dipsomaniac

Lol £600 pm for a ice car.  Petrol costs me £25 per month on my £200 focus I bought 2.5 yrs ago and spent approx £400 on maintenance in that time

Martyn1981

Thought a price comparison might be useful I've chosen the Hyndai IONIQ for two reasons. Firstly I have an older IONIQ BEV with the 28kWh battery and 130-150 miles of range (the new model has a 38kWh battery and ~200 miles of range), and can recommend it. Secondly they use a shared platform, so a straight comparison is possible between the petrol*, PHEV and BEV.

*The petrol is actually a HEV (1.56kWh battery), but with fuel economy standards rising, it won't be long before all new ICEV's are HEV, or at least MHEV (mild HEV).

So the petrol model has 3 trims ranging from £24.4k to £28.6k.
The PHEV comes in 2 trims ranging from £30.8k to £32.8k.
The BEV also comes in 2 trims ranging from £32k to £34k. [Includes the £1.5k plug-in-grant.]

Benny2020

When i see youtube reviews of EVs they are normally favourable but when you see long term tests its not the same as EVs do not appear to be good winter cars or towing cars, one recent review likened winter driving in an EV to driving a petrol car with a hole in the tank.

Martyn1981

Benny2020 said:

When i see youtube reviews of EVs they are normally favourable but when you see long term tests its not the same as EVs do not appear to be good winter cars or towing cars, one recent review likened winter driving in an EV to driving a petrol car with a hole in the tank.

That's weird, not seen anything like that. Probably get a 10-20% drop in range in the UK if it's really cold, just like you'd get a drop in fuel economy for a petrol or diesel. Also the older BEV's used resistive heating for the cabins, which sucked up some battery juice, but in my old Leaf, I just used the seat and steering wheel heaters, which are far better, actually managed a 60 mile journey, in a 70 mile range car, in freezing weather, but had to stick to 65mph on the motorway. Some of the latest BEV's now use heatpumps, so less than 1kWh of battery consumption per hour (yeah I know that's a terrible leccy description kWh per hr).

If the BEV is in a garage, then it won't be so bad as the vehicle/batts won't be as cold on set off. Plus if it's really bad, then you could pre-heat/pre-condition the batteries before setting off, thus using mains leccy, rather than running the batt down a bit more.

Edit - But to be clear, for folk driving BEV's in extreme conditions, like Canada, Alaska, Scandinavia (where BEV's are very popular) in temps of -10C, even -20C or lower, then yes batts are hit harder. These are the sort of locations where the petrol/diesel cars will be plugged in too to heat up the engine block before a journey to ensure it will start, and also to reduce some of the cold weather damage on the ICE.

Grumpy_chap

dipsomaniac said:

Lol £600 pm for a ice car.  Petrol costs me £25 per month on my £200 focus I bought 2.5 yrs ago and spent approx £400 on maintenance in that time

The beauty of this forum is that it is open to all and that will include a very many different cases.

I suspect your case is far rarer than the car at £300 per month PCP / lease / car allowance plus £300 fuel. At £1.50 per litre and 50 mpg, that £300 buys around 2.2k miles per month.  Not an exceptional mileage for a travelling sales person or someone with a longish daily commute.

Your £25 fuel will mean around 200 miles per month which the other case was doing in a couple of days.  Either way, your 6k miles in 2.5 years with only £400 maintenance is quite likely to soon require some higher maintenance expenditure as the tyres , brakes etc will all need doing sometime.

Many of the cases where mileage is as low as 2k miles per year will be second cars and the other partner will have a newer car on PCP that get most of the use and most of the money.

Ibrahim5

If you buy a new EV and manage to sell it at 8 years when the battery warranty finishes for top price you are laughing. Low depreciation, low fuel, VED, servicing. Low risk. If you buy a second hand car after 8 years the range is falling, repairs are potentially incredibly expensive so you may just have to scrap it. Are the new car owners trying to whip up demand for old ones by telling them how much they can save? Potentially quite crooked. Anyone buying an old EV should be very careful. I wouldn't buy an old EV unless it went for a bargain price. The risk is too great.

grumiofoundation

Ibrahim5 said:

If you buy a new EV and manage to sell it at 8 years when the battery warranty finishes for top price you are laughing. Low depreciation, low fuel, VED, servicing. Low risk. If you buy a second hand car after 8 years the range is falling, repairs are potentially incredibly expensive so you may just have to scrap it. Are the new car owners trying to whip up demand for old ones by telling them how much they can save? Potentially quite crooked. Anyone buying an old EV should be very careful. I wouldn't buy an old EV unless it went for a bargain price. The risk is too great.

You seem to be under the impression the 8 years is some kind of magical cliff after which battery range suddenly plummets. You are right that you should be careful, but that goes for buying anything. 

Although maybe you are right, a tiny number of posters on mse forum control the second hand EV market ssshh careful they might get you in their silent cars

dipsomaniac

Grumpy_chap said:

dipsomaniac said:

Lol £600 pm for a ice car.  Petrol costs me £25 per month on my £200 focus I bought 2.5 yrs ago and spent approx £400 on maintenance in that time

The beauty of this forum is that it is open to all and that will include a very many different cases.

I suspect your case is far rarer than the car at £300 per month PCP / lease / car allowance plus £300 fuel. At £1.50 per litre and 50 mpg, that £300 buys around 2.2k miles per month.  Not an exceptional mileage for a travelling sales person or someone with a longish daily commute.

Your £25 fuel will mean around 200 miles per month which the other case was doing in a couple of days.  Either way, your 6k miles in 2.5 years with only £400 maintenance is quite likely to soon require some higher maintenance expenditure as the tyres , brakes etc will all need doing sometime.

Many of the cases where mileage is as low as 2k miles per year will be second cars and the other partner will have a newer car on PCP that get most of the use and most of the money.

The £400 includes discs and pads all round and one tyre. It also includes a new battery and a few other service parts

Herzlos

dipsomaniac said:

Lol £600 pm for a ice car.  Petrol costs me £25 per month on my £200 focus I bought 2.5 yrs ago and spent approx £400 on maintenance in that time

How many miles do you do? Into the London congestion zone?

My commute (80ish miles) is costing me about £250/month in diesel.  

I could potentially pay about £200/month for an MG5 and save about £200/month on fuel, but we're a 1 car household and need a 7 seater.

It sounds like you barely use yours, maybe 100-150 miles/month? So obviously an EV wouldn't make any sense. 

Grumpy_chap

Herzlos said:

dipsomaniac said:

Lol £600 pm for a ice car.  Petrol costs me £25 per month on my £200 focus I bought 2.5 yrs ago and spent approx £400 on maintenance in that time

How many miles do you do? Into the London congestion zone?

My commute (80ish miles) is costing me about £250/month in diesel.  

I could potentially pay about £200/month for an MG5 and save about £200/month on fuel, but we're a 1 car household and need a 7 seater.

It sounds like you barely use yours, so obviously an EV wouldn't make any sense. 

Might make sense, if there is a partner with PCP car, for the next PCP car to be EV with the back up of the Focus for those rare occasions when an EV is not suitable for the journey.  I doubt the mileage on the Focus would increase any faster than it does currently.