Telecom Plus Discussion Area

Smartasss

PaulS43, instead of pointlessly arguing on this Board that your company always sends out quotes before allowing a customer to sign up, why don't you ask your Office the procedure when they discover a prospect is getting a cheaper deal than T+ can offer. (I have already posted that your Mr Wolpert sends out a standard letter saying you can't offer any savings, but you seem to have chosen to ignore this)

There are far more important concerns raised in this thread about the way T+ operates, but none of these ever get addressed!

PaulS43

Smartass

You said in your post above :

But Telecom+ do advertise - their ads have been brought to the attention of the ASA who have adjudicated against them.

For the recent complaints which have been upheld see:

(and then you go on to give links to ASA Adjudications).

I regret to advise, again, Smartass, that Telecom Plus themselves DO NOT ADVERTISE. If you ring the freephone number mention in the second adjudication which you cite, you'll see that that freephone number goes directly to an INDEPENDENT DISTRIBUTOR's voicemail box. It DOES NOT go to Telecom Plus directly.

Whilst I don't dispute that the ASA will have adjudicated over what appears to have been a leaflet distributed by the individual concerned; that leaflet WAS NOT distributed by Telecom Plus itself. I would invite you to ring the 0800 number mentioned and get whoever's voice-box it is to call you and ask them yourself.

Now, I don't know as an Independedt Distributor myself whether or not the individual cited by the ASA was disciplined by Telecom Plus (the company itself) or not at all; nor do I know whether Telecom Plus HQ are even aware that the ASA will have pulled this particular individual up over what is contained in his leaflet....

In a further post you say:

PaulS43, instead of pointlessly arguing on this Board that your company always sends out quotes before allowing a customer to sign up, why don't you ask your Office the procedure when they discover a prospect is getting a cheaper deal than T+ can offer. (I have already posted that your Mr Wolpert sends out a standard letter saying you can't offer any savings, but you seem to have chosen to ignore this)

Sorry, Smartass, I thought I actually had addressed this by saying that none of my prospective customers had ever brought such a letter to my attention. I am certainly NOT ignoring what you have said, that's for certain, so please don't malign me by saying that I have! Can I have some resepect, please?

Lisyloo:

I am alarmed at one of your posts. You have made a statement that Telecom Plus is £50 as a best guess dearer than the absolute best for gas or electric. Please will you be kind enough to furnish full details of how you have arrived at this figure because if it is true (specifically, if you haven't made a large error in your calculations), then I must review my own involvement in the company. I don't buy into the "if it's a penny dearer" argument BUT fifty quid isn't a few quid more, it is actually a great deal of money - so please give the specific example showing where you get the £50.

I ask again, especially of Smartass, let's respect each other, eh? Being discourteous or questioning the ultimate motives of other posters is not conducive to harmony. I respect your rights to your opinions and actually agree with some of the points raised. Please respect me too and we can remain friends, even if we remain in disagreement.

Take care, people

Smartasss

You say T+ don't advertise.

Perhaps you could comment on their website which does advertise that they supply "the UK's cheapest electricity and gas" in defiance of the ASA rulings against them making those claims.

I note that you say you are in agreement with some points raised.

Which areas of concern are the ones you agree with?

cash99

A comparison site said I could save £180 by switching from Basic Power to T+. I checked the savings and they were correct.( I use 12000 kwh per year Southern region if anyone wants to check). As a good moneysaver I found this thread and studied it before making a move.

With such partisan views expressed I was more cautious than usual.

My first contact with T+ was not good. When I applied on line I was asked to supply my bank details to order an application pack. The on line order form covers all of their services, so I am sure this is due to the fact that it is actually an order form for services such as telephone as opposed to application form for Electricity and gas. However I don't usually give these details unless I am actually buying.

From here on it gets better however. I emailed them explained my reluctance to part with my bank details at this stage and asked them to post me an application form.

The form duly arrived in a couple of days, I returned it and got a confirmation letter soon after saying, I could save by switching, and asking me to sign an application form.

I have just sent the completed application form back and await developments.

I did not get hassled by a T+ distributor.

Their literature did claim they were the cheapest electricity supplier, which for me is not true, as Atlantic were. ( I did not use them as the difference was small and it was cashback rather than upfornt).

The point of this post, if anyone has got this far and is still interested.

I think T+ are a one of the cheapest suppliers of electricity. There business model of MLM means they can generate lots of business paying virtually nothing in terms of marketing. Most of the T+ distributors will make very little. A few that got in early and built their networks like crazy will do very well. This is the story of MLM. The end result is that the companies costs and consequently prices are lower.

Their business practices seem no better or worse than any other company selling services.

At the end of the day if you are spending your money make some effort to understand what you are buying ( or get help if you need it), then you are less likely to spend more than you need.


I am not a T+ distributor nor do I want to become one. I do want to save £180 a year and I am prepared to make an effort to do so.

Axeman_2

Popped my head in, never been for a while. Wow still busy in here.

For the likes of Smartass ( Hi ) this is a snippet from the latest info sheet for distributors ( I'm a distributor ( nearly forgot ))

“UK’s Cheapest Gas and Electricity”
We have decided to clarify exactly what is
covered by this claim to avoid confusion by our
customers. This clarification is being included in
our new tariff guide and multi-service brochure,
both of which are currently being reprinted.
The claim is based on a comparison at the Ofgem
defined consumption levels for low, medium and
high users, between our direct debit prices and
the equivalent standard direct debit tariffs
available from all the other major licensed
suppliers (covering around 98% of all UK
households).

There are certain circumstances where our
energy prices may not be cheaper:-
I. For customers with either very low or very
high usage.
II. For prepayment customers.
III. For non-direct debit customers.
IV. For customers looking for an “internet only”
tariff with no customer service support.
V. For elderly customers currently on a
“staywarm” package.
VI. For customers who signed a fixed price
contract when energy prices were lower,
and whose contract has not yet been
completed (after which much higher prices
will generally apply).

Hope this helps discussion and allows people to move on.

But probably not LOL

I'll pop back in six months to see how things have developed. TA TA

lisyloo

Well done to Tplus for coming clean.

However that's a reasonably long list of situations in which they might not be the cheapest.

Smartasss

Presumably the Distributors already knew the truth about the misleading "cheapest" claims, and didn't need an "info" sheet to confirm what they have been able to read here!

New prospects who visit their websites don't know their advertising is misleading - and that remains unchanged and still in defiance of the ASA.

(And surprisingly not "clarified" as per this "leaked" distributors info sheet!)

They do seem to take a long time to toe the line (the first recorded ASA adjudication against them for using the misleading "cheapest" claims was in 2002 when the ASA advised them to amend their claims!)

See ASA 2002 adjudication HERE

PaulS43

Lisyloo:

I am still waiting for you to furnish the example where "Telecom Plus are at least £50 more than the cheapest supplier".

Smartass:

I don't quite know what you get out of your abrasive posts; perhaps you are inadequate in other parts of your life?

By all means pass "constructive criticism" or your point of view, but glib comments which malign a broad swath of people, including ME or suggest or impute that we all somehow know we're 'conning' people I find incredibly offensive.

I would respectfully suggest that you read back what you are saying about people you don't actually know (including ME) before you press the 'send' button.

For the third time of asking: Can we have some respect please?

lisyloo

"I am still waiting for you to furnish the example where "Telecom Plus are at least £50 more than the cheapest supplier".

I have not claimed this and I don't recall seeing where you asked for an example.
I also said the amount was irrelavent.
It's either a truthful claim or it's not.
If it's 1p more expensive then the claim is false.
Please tell me why the amount is important.
You are either the cheapest or you are not. Why is £50 an important amount?

I am sure if I had enough life then I could find you an example.
Unfortunately I have to work and don't have enough time.

However it looks like your own company have saved you the trouble, as they have published the cirucmstances in which they may not be the cheapest.
To save you the trouble looking, here it is:

There are certain circumstances where our
energy prices may not be cheaper:-
I. For customers with either very low or very
high usage.
II. For prepayment customers.
III. For non-direct debit customers.
IV. For customers looking for an “internet only”
tariff with no customer service support.
V. For elderly customers currently on a
“staywarm” package.
VI. For customers who signed a fixed price
contract when energy prices were lower,
and whose contract has not yet been
completed (after which much higher prices
will generally apply).

I am sure it would be reasonably easy to find an exmaple on the staywarm tarrif.

PaulS43

Lisyloo,

I think I said - a long time ago - that I accepted that we weren't always absolutely the cheapest possible supplier in every single instance. I advocated that at most, however, over the course of a year we would certainly be in the cheapest group if not the absolute cheapest on every occasion.

For the sake of not arguing over pennies or a few pounds when considering annual expenditure of many, many hundreds or possibly thousands of pounds, I invited you to agree with my broad statement that in the instances where we aren't the absolute cheapest, then we aren't any more than a few pounds at most dearer.

It seemed at first you accpeted this. Then you made a statement that my claim to be in the cheapest group could (I repeat COULD) be incorrect too. I asked you to say how much dearer because if more than a few pounds (which I can live with and sleep with and not feel I am doing anyone a dis-service with) then I wrote "I will need to reconsider my position within the company".

You said it could be as much as £50 a year. Well, before I fall upon my sword and hand in my resignation from Telecom Plus, I invite you to put your money where YOUR mouth is and furnish evidence that TP can be as much as £50 more than the cheapest METERED supplier (I don't and can't count "Staywarm" - because they charge a fixed amount then all the lights and heating could be left on like mental - but also someone could still be very, very frugle yet still pay the same amount - Staywarm can't be used as a club to beat me with because it's only open to OAPs and not every memeber of the public).

Well, Lisyloo, you've spouted a load of stuff often enough about Telecom Plus not being able to substantiate the claim to be the cheapest in every single instance yet you seem to want to make ludicrous unsubstantiated statements about Telecom Plus being £50 dearer than the cheapest suppliers but when challenged to give an example you bemoan about not having enough time to substantiate your own claims...

Hmmmmm. You expect other people to reach and maintain standards you're not prepared to strive for yourself, Lisyloo. I put it to you that you are being rather disingenuous about Telecom Plus and can only surmise that there are other ulterior motives in your notional claims about Telecom Plus's "dishonest" marketing.

I have never said, nor do I believe TP have claimed that every single time TP will always be at least 1p cheaper than the rest... No, I accept that although we are cheapest in around 98% of cases, in the other 2%, we may be up to a few quid more - but still within the "reasonable licence" to call ourselves the cheapest domestic gas and electricity suppliers in the country (METERED, that is {ie what's available to Jo Public}).

You refute this and say we're £50 dearer. Substantiate your claims please, or withdraw them and accept my view on matters.
I am calling your bluff, Lisyloo - time for you to produce rather than chide.