Electric car charging points to be installed at ALL new properties

[Deleted User]

user1977 said:

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

Ectophile said:

With the exception of some town/city centre areas, dedicated parking spages are pretty much a requirement for new homes.  Without them, the development won't get planning permission.  So requiring EV chargers isn't a problem there.

Does the combination of the Local Authority "car-free" requirement plus the Government "EV charger" requirement mean that houses will be built with a charge point but no parking????

Like I said above, if they're deemed to be for the occupation of non-car-owners, why would they need charging points?

  Because - At the moment, there are many 100,000's of people living in flats and other homes without dedicated parking spaces (in fact, I know of several with no parking at all) that still own cars, that they are forced  to park some distance from their homes - just leaving the cars parked by the side of the road - since the cars run on a liquid called petrol, which is simple and almost instantaneous to refill with at a petrol station, this is done without difficulty - now, in perhaps 15 years time - five years after the last IC engined car has been produced and more and more people will be looking to buy their replacement transport - no one will have any options any longer - so what will these residents do for transport and more importantly - how will they refuel their EVs at reasonable cost ?

I live in an area where almost nobody has off-street parking, and have noticed quite a few residents already have EVs, so they obviously manage already - in 15 years' time, how many more charging facilities do you think there'll be? I really don't get the notion that EVs are unmanageable unless you can charge them at home.

And it's also the sort of neighbourhood where the planners can reasonably argue that residents don't need their own car at all, like I said above - so it's perfectly feasible to manage with other modes of transport, if need be hire a car (pick one up from the city car club spaces nearby) on occasions where it would be useful.

I agree that there will be many more charging stations - but would you want to have to leave your expensive new motor plugged in and walk away from it for x hours ?

Or would you be happier sittting in it - whilst it charges for the same length of time ?

Whatever the next decades of driving holds for us - the "golden days of motoring" are behind us all !

And as for alternatives - one bus a week to take me to my local town (20 miles away) is on offer here - how does that stand as an option ?

user1977

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

Ectophile said:

With the exception of some town/city centre areas, dedicated parking spages are pretty much a requirement for new homes.  Without them, the development won't get planning permission.  So requiring EV chargers isn't a problem there.

Does the combination of the Local Authority "car-free" requirement plus the Government "EV charger" requirement mean that houses will be built with a charge point but no parking????

Like I said above, if they're deemed to be for the occupation of non-car-owners, why would they need charging points?

  Because - At the moment, there are many 100,000's of people living in flats and other homes without dedicated parking spaces (in fact, I know of several with no parking at all) that still own cars, that they are forced  to park some distance from their homes - just leaving the cars parked by the side of the road - since the cars run on a liquid called petrol, which is simple and almost instantaneous to refill with at a petrol station, this is done without difficulty - now, in perhaps 15 years time - five years after the last IC engined car has been produced and more and more people will be looking to buy their replacement transport - no one will have any options any longer - so what will these residents do for transport and more importantly - how will they refuel their EVs at reasonable cost ?

I live in an area where almost nobody has off-street parking, and have noticed quite a few residents already have EVs, so they obviously manage already - in 15 years' time, how many more charging facilities do you think there'll be? I really don't get the notion that EVs are unmanageable unless you can charge them at home.

And it's also the sort of neighbourhood where the planners can reasonably argue that residents don't need their own car at all, like I said above - so it's perfectly feasible to manage with other modes of transport, if need be hire a car (pick one up from the city car club spaces nearby) on occasions where it would be useful.

I agree that there will be many more charging stations - but would you want to have to leave your expensive new motor plugged in and walk away from it for x hours ?

I don't see why not. It's hardly any more hazardous than leaving it parked on the inner city street where it normally lives. And are public chargers going to take "hours" in the future, when they don't necessarily take hours now?

And as for alternatives - one bus a week to take me to my local town (20 miles away) is on offer here - how does that stand as an option ?

In relation to what? Are you saying there are new affordable housing developments being approved in such an area with no private parking spaces?

[Deleted User]

user1977 said:

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

Ectophile said:

With the exception of some town/city centre areas, dedicated parking spages are pretty much a requirement for new homes.  Without them, the development won't get planning permission.  So requiring EV chargers isn't a problem there.

Does the combination of the Local Authority "car-free" requirement plus the Government "EV charger" requirement mean that houses will be built with a charge point but no parking????

Like I said above, if they're deemed to be for the occupation of non-car-owners, why would they need charging points?

  Because - At the moment, there are many 100,000's of people living in flats and other homes without dedicated parking spaces (in fact, I know of several with no parking at all) that still own cars, that they are forced  to park some distance from their homes - just leaving the cars parked by the side of the road - since the cars run on a liquid called petrol, which is simple and almost instantaneous to refill with at a petrol station, this is done without difficulty - now, in perhaps 15 years time - five years after the last IC engined car has been produced and more and more people will be looking to buy their replacement transport - no one will have any options any longer - so what will these residents do for transport and more importantly - how will they refuel their EVs at reasonable cost ?

I live in an area where almost nobody has off-street parking, and have noticed quite a few residents already have EVs, so they obviously manage already - in 15 years' time, how many more charging facilities do you think there'll be? I really don't get the notion that EVs are unmanageable unless you can charge them at home.

And it's also the sort of neighbourhood where the planners can reasonably argue that residents don't need their own car at all, like I said above - so it's perfectly feasible to manage with other modes of transport, if need be hire a car (pick one up from the city car club spaces nearby) on occasions where it would be useful.

I agree that there will be many more charging stations - but would you want to have to leave your expensive new motor plugged in and walk away from it for x hours ?

I don't see why not. It's hardly any more hazardous than leaving it parked on the inner city street where it normally lives. And are public chargers going to take "hours" in the future, when they don't necessarily take hours now?

And as for alternatives - one bus a week to take me to my local town (20 miles away) is on offer here - how does that stand as an option ?

In relation to what? Are you saying there are new affordable housing developments being approved in such an area with no private parking spaces?

Yes exactly that 

DrEskimo

TELLIT01 said:

I read today that the intention is for all new chargers to automatically cut off during peak power usage periods.

They aren't automatically cut off. Every smart charger has a timer so you can set when you want your car to charge.

The first thing I did when I had my charger installed was set the timer to only charge the car between 00:30-04:30. Why? Because I'm on a tariff that means my electricity is £0.05/kWh rather than the standard £0.15/kWh.

Why on earth would I want to charge the car during peak hours when I can do it over night for a 1/3rd of the cost.

Of course you can have it set to charge whenever you want.

shinytop

DrEskimo said:

TELLIT01 said:

I read today that the intention is for all new chargers to automatically cut off during peak power usage periods.

They aren't automatically cut off. Every smart charger has a timer so you can set when you want your car to charge.

The first thing I did when I had my charger installed was set the timer to only charge the car between 00:30-04:30. Why? Because I'm on a tariff that means my electricity is £0.05/kWh rather than the standard £0.15/kWh.

Why on earth would I want to charge the car during peak hours when I can do it over night for a 1/3rd of the cost.

Of course you can have it set to charge whenever you want.

They sort of are...

"Under regulations that will come into force in May, new chargers in the home and workplace will be automatically set not to function from 8am to 11am and 4pm to 10pm. Public chargers and rapid chargers, on motorways and A-roads, will be exempt."

but

"...although the owner will be able to override this default setting."

And like you, everyone is going to fiddle with it and set their own times as soon as they get it.  Not much of a story really.  

shinytop

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

Ectophile said:

With the exception of some town/city centre areas, dedicated parking spages are pretty much a requirement for new homes.  Without them, the development won't get planning permission.  So requiring EV chargers isn't a problem there.

Does the combination of the Local Authority "car-free" requirement plus the Government "EV charger" requirement mean that houses will be built with a charge point but no parking????

Like I said above, if they're deemed to be for the occupation of non-car-owners, why would they need charging points?

  Because - At the moment, there are many 100,000's of people living in flats and other homes without dedicated parking spaces (in fact, I know of several with no parking at all) that still own cars, that they are forced  to park some distance from their homes - just leaving the cars parked by the side of the road - since the cars run on a liquid called petrol, which is simple and almost instantaneous to refill with at a petrol station, this is done without difficulty - now, in perhaps 15 years time - five years after the last IC engined car has been produced and more and more people will be looking to buy their replacement transport - no one will have any options any longer - so what will these residents do for transport and more importantly - how will they refuel their EVs at reasonable cost ?

I live in an area where almost nobody has off-street parking, and have noticed quite a few residents already have EVs, so they obviously manage already - in 15 years' time, how many more charging facilities do you think there'll be? I really don't get the notion that EVs are unmanageable unless you can charge them at home.

And it's also the sort of neighbourhood where the planners can reasonably argue that residents don't need their own car at all, like I said above - so it's perfectly feasible to manage with other modes of transport, if need be hire a car (pick one up from the city car club spaces nearby) on occasions where it would be useful.

I agree that there will be many more charging stations - but would you want to have to leave your expensive new motor plugged in and walk away from it for x hours ?

Or would you be happier sittting in it - whilst it charges for the same length of time ?

Whatever the next decades of driving holds for us - the "golden days of motoring" are behind us all !

And as for alternatives - one bus a week to take me to my local town (20 miles away) is on offer here - how does that stand as an option ?

I bet people said that when speed limits, driving test, seat belts, MOTs, etc., etc.  were introduced.  Most will get over it and adapt. 

Dr_Crypto

I wouldn’t trust those petrol stations. What if they run out of petrol? It’ll take ages to fill your car. 

No, sire, you just stick with these tested horses. Coaching inns never close or run out of hay! 

Car_54

Deleted_User said:

TELLIT01 said:

I read today that the intention is for all new chargers to automatically cut off during peak power usage periods.

And why is that ?

Because the grid can't cope with the additional load - which is exactly what I said to start with

No, as above the NG have said this is not an issue. It is possible there may need to be local restrictions, but those peaks are unlikely to be caused by EV charging.

If every EV used its full range every day, and had to be recharged at the same time, then of course there would be problems. But the average user will probably need one hour a night, if that, and that can easily be done during the quiet hours.

Think of the chaos that would occur if all of the 30 million plus ICE vehicles on the road all needed refulelling at the same time. It just doesn't happen.

Norman_Castle

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Deleted_User said:

user1977 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

Ectophile said:

With the exception of some town/city centre areas, dedicated parking spages are pretty much a requirement for new homes.  Without them, the development won't get planning permission.  So requiring EV chargers isn't a problem there.

Does the combination of the Local Authority "car-free" requirement plus the Government "EV charger" requirement mean that houses will be built with a charge point but no parking????

Like I said above, if they're deemed to be for the occupation of non-car-owners, why would they need charging points?

  Because - At the moment, there are many 100,000's of people living in flats and other homes without dedicated parking spaces (in fact, I know of several with no parking at all) that still own cars, that they are forced  to park some distance from their homes - just leaving the cars parked by the side of the road - since the cars run on a liquid called petrol, which is simple and almost instantaneous to refill with at a petrol station, this is done without difficulty - now, in perhaps 15 years time - five years after the last IC engined car has been produced and more and more people will be looking to buy their replacement transport - no one will have any options any longer - so what will these residents do for transport and more importantly - how will they refuel their EVs at reasonable cost ?

I live in an area where almost nobody has off-street parking, and have noticed quite a few residents already have EVs, so they obviously manage already - in 15 years' time, how many more charging facilities do you think there'll be? I really don't get the notion that EVs are unmanageable unless you can charge them at home.

And it's also the sort of neighbourhood where the planners can reasonably argue that residents don't need their own car at all, like I said above - so it's perfectly feasible to manage with other modes of transport, if need be hire a car (pick one up from the city car club spaces nearby) on occasions where it would be useful.

And as for alternatives - one bus a week to take me to my local town (20 miles away) is on offer here - how does that stand as an option ?

Rural buses have diminished because of the ease and low cost of car ownership. If electric vehicle remain comparatively expensive to own bus routes will become viable again. Private car co operatives could also work well for some. A few years ago I remember a commercial car club with cars parked at various locations. These may become more viable if car ownership becomes too expensive.

coffeehound

troffasky said:

We've averaged over 200000 a year for the past 5 years [and targets are for >300000 new homes per year], so affordable housing is not a majority, or even near it.

https://www.knightfrank.com/wealthreport/2020-11-26-net-additional-dwellings-rise-1-in-20192020-before-covid-impact-

Thanks troffasky, that has lanced my assumptions  . .