Staying local

silvercar

Here it is, for anyone that’s wants to read the original, rather than people’s interpretation:
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2021/364/made

Torry_Quine

Davesnave said:

Torry_Quine said:

Davesnave said:

Torry_Quine said:

Davesnave said:

Torry_Quine said:

Sea_Shell said:

"Stay local", is a woolly and open to interpretation phrase.

We have one set of parents that live only 5 miles away, but over the county border, and the others are in the same local authority as us, but are just over 20 miles away!!!

To me, these could both be argued to be "local".

  They had to use the one in the same council even though it wasn't as close.

You say 'had to,' but what would have happened if they'd taken a more pragmatic view?

They'd be in trouble if caught. Knowing the employer that would have been an issue too.

Are lots of people being caught for going a few miles less far, and if they are, would prosecutions be successful?

I'm very aware of persons coming to the West Country from far away during lockdown as I live on one of the rat runs into the area of the county known for surfing. I see the camper vans going past with the bikes and boards and it's obvious they aren't locals.  These people are often stopped, and I've witnessed that too, but I wouldn't expect to be quizzed myself going about my normal business.

It says something if people only do what they've been told is the right thing because they think there's a chance of getting caught. 
What happened to doing the right thing and we're all in this together?

It was you who said "they'd be in trouble if caught," not me.

My response was to suggest that nobody is looking to catch people going about their daily business in a sensible and measured way, using their own good judgement. That could be more 'right' than whatever the 'rules' say. Apparently, in your world people can't be trusted at all; they must behave like automatons. The rules are mostly meant as guidance.

My example highlighted people who blatantly break the rules. Rightly, they're held to account. However, despite some videos posted on social media,where the police behaved wrongly and overreacted, we're not living in a police state yet.

As for "we're all in this together" that's only true in the narrowest of senses. Someone like Piers Morgan could fly his family to Antigua for Christmas. You couldn't. Someone like Professor Neil Ferguson could break the very rules he devised and still remain employed, but according to you, your friend couldn't. Even as a modestly remunerated pensioner, I've been far better off during the past year than the majority of others, especially those stuck in flats and urban areas of deprivation.

Davesnave said:

Torry_Quine said:

Davesnave said:

Torry_Quine said:

Davesnave said:

Torry_Quine said:

Sea_Shell said:

"Stay local", is a woolly and open to interpretation phrase.

We have one set of parents that live only 5 miles away, but over the county border, and the others are in the same local authority as us, but are just over 20 miles away!!!

To me, these could both be argued to be "local".

  They had to use the one in the same council even though it wasn't as close.

You say 'had to,' but what would have happened if they'd taken a more pragmatic view?

They'd be in trouble if caught. Knowing the employer that would have been an issue too.

Are lots of people being caught for going a few miles less far, and if they are, would prosecutions be successful?

I'm very aware of persons coming to the West Country from far away during lockdown as I live on one of the rat runs into the area of the county known for surfing. I see the camper vans going past with the bikes and boards and it's obvious they aren't locals.  These people are often stopped, and I've witnessed that too, but I wouldn't expect to be quizzed myself going about my normal business.

It says something if people only do what they've been told is the right thing because they think there's a chance of getting caught. 
What happened to doing the right thing and we're all in this together?

It was you who said "they'd be in trouble if caught," not me.

My response was to suggest that nobody is looking to catch people going about their daily business in a sensible and measured way, using their own good judgement. That could be more 'right' than whatever the 'rules' say. Apparently, in your world people can't be trusted at all; they must behave like automatons. The rules are mostly meant as guidance.

My example highlighted people who blatantly break the rules. Rightly, they're held to account. However, despite some videos posted on social media,where the police behaved wrongly and overreacted, we're not living in a police state yet.

As for "we're all in this together" that's only true in the narrowest of senses. Someone like Piers Morgan could fly his family to Antigua for Christmas. You couldn't. Someone like Professor Neil Ferguson could break the very rules he devised and still remain employed, but according to you, your friend couldn't. Even as a modestly remunerated pensioner, I've been far better off during the past year than the majority of others, especially those stuck in flats and urban areas of deprivation.

Actually as the person below you said it was law in Scotland.  I was merely pointing out that many people behave without considering the risk of being found out. It's not about behaving like an automaton.
After the scenes in Bristol it's clear there are many who don't consider what they're doing.
I didn't say they'd lose their job just that the employer wouldn't be happy.

Torry_Quine

silvercar said:

Here it is, for anyone that’s wants to read the original, rather than people’s interpretation:
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2021/364/made

For England. 

leopoldo_2

silvercar said:

On another forum people are saying the stay local rule for England is going, replaced by not staying overnight and only meeting people outdoors. No mention of staying local.

While the stay local element is supposed to be remaining, this suggests that in cases such as mine, I will be able to travel outside my area, so I guess that my question has been answered:
https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/march-29-covid-19-lockdown-changes-explained-7838804 

Davesnave

Yes, that looks a very clear explanation, leopoldo.

I'm was unaware about the status of lockdown legislation in Scotland but sheramber is a reliable poster, so I would expect what they said to be the case.

I know the petty cases that have come before the courts in England have been thrown out, sustaining many people's faith in the independence and good sense of the judiciary. That would not include actions like those in Bristol at the weekend, which appear to have been the work of far left activists, not ordinary people opposed to further lockdowns. As at least one national newspaper has stated this week, there is a case for questioning the supposed benefits of lockdowns, but this isn't the place for discussing that.

justworriedabit

JamoLew said:

The definition of “Local” has been published .

” Your village,town or part of a city where you live”

Currently 17miles is unlikely to be classed as local

Would you care to direct me and others to the information you claim to have been "published" that defines "local"?
Birmingham, Manchester, London etc are big cites and i may be wrong buy it is more than 17 miles one to the other end.
We too want to travel a few miles to the beach, so it would help.


TIA

elsien

It hasn't been legally defined however the associated guidance from the DoH says 

However, people should be sensible about this - if you do leave home for a permitted reason, you should stay local in the village, town, or part of the city where you live - unless there is a justifiable reason not to do so (for example, you need to travel further for work or to avoid harm).

JamoLew

justworriedabit said:

JamoLew said:

The definition of “Local” has been published .

” Your village,town or part of a city where you live”

Currently 17miles is unlikely to be classed as local

Would you care to direct me and others to the information you claim to have been "published" that defines "local"?
Birmingham, Manchester, London etc are big cites and i may be wrong buy it is more than 17 miles one to the other end.
We too want to travel a few miles to the beach, so it would help.


TIA

See the reply/quote by elsien or just use Google like I did

justworriedabit

JamoLew said:

justworriedabit said:

JamoLew said:

The definition of “Local” has been published .

” Your village,town or part of a city where you live”

Currently 17miles is unlikely to be classed as local

Would you care to direct me and others to the information you claim to have been "published" that defines "local"?
Birmingham, Manchester, London etc are big cites and i may be wrong buy it is more than 17 miles one to the other end.
We too want to travel a few miles to the beach, so it would help.


TIA

See the reply/quote by elsien or just use Google like I did

I can't see or find the legal definition of it. As you already know, kindly provide the link that clearly states what "local" is. It was you that tried to define the meaning but as I said, I can't see it anywhere.
TIA

elsien

It's about as clear a definition as your "a few miles" to the beach, which could potentially cover a multitude of sins.