I believe I have evidence of an estate agent creating fake bids

Crashy_Time

"Fake Bids" would not surprise me TBH, but people also often choose to overpay for whatever reason.

Crashy_Time

ALWAYS aim to underpay, it can protect you from these sorts of issues.

JGB1955

Surely the situation you have found yourself in is only the same as the vendor turning down each of your offers, one at a time, and saying "Sorry - try harder/higher"?  No need to introduce a 'fake bidder' - just keep turning down your offers until you caved in.  The result was the same - you were bitten and the agent/vendor could slowly pull in the line.

Doozergirl

Lonely_willow said:

Jeepers_Creepers said:

Hi Lonely-Willow.

I have to say I am surprised by the majority of comments on here. Only teachfast seems to feel that - if what you suspect is true - it is highly improper.

I also have to say, tho', that virtually every suspicion you listed in your first post barely warrants a second thought; please try and dismiss them. The one and only thing that does legitimately raise suspicion is IF the other bidder's name was the actual name of the property owner. Sadly, you have difficulty recalling if it was similar or the exact same, and that makes taking action very difficult.

If it were absolutely certain it was the same name, then I would personally pursue this. If I wasn't sure, I'd probably let it lie. It is very easy to see a name that makes a connection, perhaps because the other name was already in your head, and you wonder if it was the same - it just 'rings a bell'. A Sue or a Sarah or a Sadie jumps out as "I've seen that name before" just because you had a Sophie on your mind.

If the EA was in cahoots with the vendor, would this be illegal? I haven't a clue - but it certainly should be.

Don't know what to suggest, L-W; this has to be your call. You either - if you are 95% certain the names were the same, contact the EA ombudsman and ask their advice, or - if less than that - let it go.

Don't worry about the legal issue of having been shown the bidders' names - that's entirely on the EA's head; all you did was 'ask'.

Well the vendor was a landlord and the house I bought was rented out for many years with the estate agent. There is a good chance the vendor and agent had a working relationship and it could raise the likely hood of them working together to create the fake bids. Having the name matching from the estate agents point of view would not have mattered as I was never going to see the names anyway. It just so happens I reared my head 2 years later and pressured him into showing me the book and never raised my suspicions about the fake bidder.

Sadly I would put my suspicions of the names matching at 80%. I also do not view the ombudsman favourably they are hardly fully impartial as the estate agents pay for their upkeep.

Let me get this straight. 

The estate agent is a criminal. 

The surveyor you hired had no idea what they were doing and didn't do the job you paid them for, despite downvaluing the property... 

The vendor was in absolute cahoots with the criminal estate agent.  

There is such a thing as a real 'bidding book' for imaginary bidders.  

You can deem to decide why other people buy houses.  Property investors aren't interested in houses for renovation and extension, as you did, they only want houses to rent to long term individual tenants - in a street full of Air BnBs and student lets? 

All of this, but the person who can get a little too focussed on the wrong things bears no responsibility?  

You've just told us that you were bidding with no upper limit and disregarded the survey valuation from the person you paid to protect YOUR interests.  

Lonely_willow

JGB1955 said:

Surely the situation you have found yourself in is only the same as the vendor turning down each of your offers, one at a time, and saying "Sorry - try harder/higher"?  No need to introduce a 'fake bidder' - just keep turning down your offers until you caved in.  The result was the same - you were bitten and the agent/vendor could slowly pull in the line.

That is only true if the estate agent told the vendor that they had me hooked in. I guess the estate agent would reveal this to the vendor. Fair point.

Lonely_willow

Doozergirl said

Let me get this straight. 

The estate agent is a criminal. 

The surveyor you hired had no idea what they were doing and didn't do the job you paid them for, despite downvaluing the property... 

The vendor was in absolute cahoots with the criminal estate agent.  

There is such a thing as a 'bidding book' for imaginary bidders.  

Property investors only want houses to rent to long term individual tenants - in a street full of Air BnBs and student lets?  

But the person who can get a little too focussed on the wrong things bears no responsibility?  

Those are all very valid points. I guess I had taken advice from some local people and they all listened to my story and said fake bids. Maybe I should have not listened to them so much.

davidmcn

Lonely_willow said:

AdrianC said:

Struck off what?

Let me put something hypothetical to you. If it is found the other bidders name and ID documents matched the Vendor would this be a police matter due to fraudulent activity on part of the estate agent?

You've already found out that the police aren't interested. You can't force them to investigate everything which might technically constitute a crime (even if you had evidence that it was).

RelievedSheff

Lonely_willow said:

RelievedSheff said:

Lonely_willow said:

RelievedSheff said:

I'm not quite sure what you are expecting to gain here. Are you?

Personally I would just stop worrying about what other people have paid for their houses and enjoy your home. 

Well I want the estate agent struck off. That is what I want to gain.

Struck off for what exactly?

You can't even be sure or provide any evidence that they have done anything wrong.

This could just be another one of your mistakes.

Why has it taken you two years to decide you would like them struck off?

It is only recently that I got to see the bidding book. I have had no potential evidence before. Now I have the potential of the bidder who I bid against matching the name of the vendor. Though my recognition of the names is not 100% sadly.

As has been pointed out to you already, even if the names do match there is not necessarily any suspicious activity. Lots of people share the same names.

You are really on a highway to nowhere here.

Perhaps time to focus your efforts on more important things like enjoying the home that you have bought. 

deannagone

I read the first four or five pages and jumped to the end.  Sorry if I missed something.

I am on the spectrum too.., and yes there are people who take advantage because you focus on one thing and miss something else that you should also be keeping an eye on.  There are also people who don't mean to 'take advantage' but don't realise you/I need time to think about something because you get overwhelmed so its not always intentional. Even when I warn people that this can happen.., they say yes, I understand and carry on (not in a mean spirited way, they just don't get it). n Yes it makes me feel a bit down, but I don't dwell on it, put it down to experience (anyone with or without ASD can focus on one thing and completely miss another, many of the posts on the forum illustrate this). 

I'm not going to make myself feel even more disabled.., I learn from it, vow it will never happen again and move on.  

You say the house was a <>hole but at the time you obviously wanted the house and thought it was worth it.  Now you are ruining how you feel about the house by exploring how/what/why you 'overpaid' for the house.  Make it a useful experience and learn from it.  Move on.  Pursuing the course of action you want to has little chance of compensating you for the decision you were happy making at the time, so would it really be worth the hassle and depression?

Doozergirl

Lonely_willow said:

Doozergirl said

Let me get this straight. 

The estate agent is a criminal. 

The surveyor you hired had no idea what they were doing and didn't do the job you paid them for, despite downvaluing the property... 

The vendor was in absolute cahoots with the criminal estate agent.  

There is such a thing as a 'bidding book' for imaginary bidders.  

Property investors only want houses to rent to long term individual tenants - in a street full of Air BnBs and student lets?  

But the person who can get a little too focussed on the wrong things bears no responsibility?  

Those are all very valid points. I guess I had taken advice from some local people and they all listened to my story and said fake bids. Maybe I should have not listened to them so much.

Now I understand!   This is what people say about estate agents all the time!  There's absolutely no genuine evidence for it, it's a perpetuated myth.    It's an indirect result of the unpredictable nature of the legal process in this country - the estate agent always gets the blame and it's easy to create a conspiracy around them.    

I have never been an estate agent but I have been involved with them for the last 20 years, buying, selling and acting to assist friends and clients with property searches and sales. 

It really isn't what people on the outside think it is.  It took me a few years of experience to get my own head around it.  Of course all agents are individuals, but they really are just trying to get on and do their jobs.  Some are more driven salespeople than others, but I do understand after all this time that sales pressure needs to be put on both potential buyer and seller and the absolute focus is on getting a sale to completion, not necessarily the highest price.  Because sales are difficult for *everyone* involved and everyone really wants to feel like they did okay out of it.  There's a LOT of buyer/seller ego involved.  

I had the most awful time of 18 months with my own house sale.  I know this game and I found it almost impossible to keep a straight head - and I know that I would have been hugely better at it than most people.  

People get incredibly emotive about property purchases they missed out on and I've heard some really whacky stories and some really disgusting things said about agents by people whose only experience of the property market is buying one house.  

I believe that your surveyor did do their job when they down valued it a bit.  I also KNOW that people underestimate the cost of renovations almost universally and that houses are mostly overpriced for the work that really needs doing. 

I do believe that it must be a nightmare for someone like you if you are inclined to take things on face value.