No meter readings for two years

niktheguru

nick_griff187 said:

nick_griff187 said:

niktheguru said:

nickgriff, thanks for submitting some of your bills.
Like others have said, providing bills from "other homes" is no use, we need to concentrate on your current home. like jbuchanan has said,  from your bills we can see:
1st Feb 19 : 77926
12 June 19: 79174 (when meter was changed to smart meter)
18th Sept 19: 01249
The 18th sept reading is the last accurate reading we have.
This suggests at THAT time, you were using approx 10.85KwH a day. So, 3962KwH a year.

What you now need to provide us, is the bills from EDF (if they have charged you then you WILL HAVE A BILL) and any paperwork from shell. It still bemuses me how you switched to shell without having ever given a reading to edf or at least checked that they had accurate readings on bills!!
If you dont have bills you need to CALL EDF and get the opening and closing meter readings they used.
You also need to contact SHELL and ask what opening readings they have been given and are using.

What you need to provide us with are the following
1. unit rate for elelctricity and standing charge for EDF tariff you were on (it will be on any paperwork or bill you have)
2. Unit rate for electricity and standing charge for shell tariff you are currently on
2. Opening and closing readings from EDF
3. Opening reading from shell
4. Exact dates you were with EDF from and till.
5. Date shell has started your electricity.
6. How much you paid EDF in direct debits for the full term (these will be on your bills. I assume you have dual fuel so your DD will be including the gas as well, which may be confounding how much you owe!)
6. What your current meter reading is. (from the previous post you seem to say the actual meter is not showing anything, try pressing the buttons on it and seeing if it beeps or has anything at all on the display. The meter you took a picture of, not the in home display, as this will not work.

If you provide us with all this info we can work out how much you should owe them

Thank you , I will get this info over to you tomorrow. I have all bills on all the accounts. I know it's hard to believe I switched with no readings but I honestly thought that it was all in order , as whole point of smart meter is that they get this info for me. I'm rubbish at energy suppliers & bills. Probably going to pay big time for the lack of knowledge to be honest. 
I now know the difference between the smart meter & the ihd. The smart meter 100% isn't working. I've tried pressing all buttons , everything. It will not respond. 
Would it be easier for me to just post all bills? 

Hi, Quick update, ive gathered all the info apart from the questions regarding EDF bills. I could access these bills last week but now it keeps showing message saying there is a hitch & cant get data please try later. I need to phone EDF anyway as they have given me a date of tomorrow to receive the £630?

Also our Shell dual DD are £103, it states on the bill also this amount will be debited but they have been taking out £175 last month & this month £230. So unsure what to do about this as they are still going of estimates. They are out fixing the smart meter 11th of Feburary.

Again thanks for all your help & patience 

Also, why are you not concerned about your gas usage? Is the gas meter working. Were the gas readings estimates too?
Given you're on dual fuel you will not be able to argue being over charged or undercharged unless you have accurate readings and consumption for both the electricity AND gas. Probably worth getting both in order now whilst your are dealing with these companies.

nick_griff187

niktheguru said:

nick_griff187 said:

nick_griff187 said:

niktheguru said:

nickgriff, thanks for submitting some of your bills.
Like others have said, providing bills from "other homes" is no use, we need to concentrate on your current home. like jbuchanan has said,  from your bills we can see:
1st Feb 19 : 77926
12 June 19: 79174 (when meter was changed to smart meter)
18th Sept 19: 01249
The 18th sept reading is the last accurate reading we have.
This suggests at THAT time, you were using approx 10.85KwH a day. So, 3962KwH a year.

What you now need to provide us, is the bills from EDF (if they have charged you then you WILL HAVE A BILL) and any paperwork from shell. It still bemuses me how you switched to shell without having ever given a reading to edf or at least checked that they had accurate readings on bills!!
If you dont have bills you need to CALL EDF and get the opening and closing meter readings they used.
You also need to contact SHELL and ask what opening readings they have been given and are using.

What you need to provide us with are the following
1. unit rate for elelctricity and standing charge for EDF tariff you were on (it will be on any paperwork or bill you have)
2. Unit rate for electricity and standing charge for shell tariff you are currently on
2. Opening and closing readings from EDF
3. Opening reading from shell
4. Exact dates you were with EDF from and till.
5. Date shell has started your electricity.
6. How much you paid EDF in direct debits for the full term (these will be on your bills. I assume you have dual fuel so your DD will be including the gas as well, which may be confounding how much you owe!)
6. What your current meter reading is. (from the previous post you seem to say the actual meter is not showing anything, try pressing the buttons on it and seeing if it beeps or has anything at all on the display. The meter you took a picture of, not the in home display, as this will not work.

If you provide us with all this info we can work out how much you should owe them

Thank you , I will get this info over to you tomorrow. I have all bills on all the accounts. I know it's hard to believe I switched with no readings but I honestly thought that it was all in order , as whole point of smart meter is that they get this info for me. I'm rubbish at energy suppliers & bills. Probably going to pay big time for the lack of knowledge to be honest. 
I now know the difference between the smart meter & the ihd. The smart meter 100% isn't working. I've tried pressing all buttons , everything. It will not respond. 
Would it be easier for me to just post all bills? 

Hi, Quick update, ive gathered all the info apart from the questions regarding EDF bills. I could access these bills last week but now it keeps showing message saying there is a hitch & cant get data please try later. I need to phone EDF anyway as they have given me a date of tomorrow to receive the £630?

Also our Shell dual DD are £103, it states on the bill also this amount will be debited but they have been taking out £175 last month & this month £230. So unsure what to do about this as they are still going of estimates. They are out fixing the smart meter 11th of Feburary.

Again thanks for all your help & patience 

Also, why are you not concerned about your gas usage? Is the gas meter working. Were the gas readings estimates too?
Given you're on dual fuel you will not be able to argue being over charged or undercharged unless you have accurate readings and consumption for both the electricity AND gas. Probably worth getting both in order now whilst your are dealing with these companies.

Because shell have told me that they have established a connection with the gas

niktheguru

Hopefully you've checked your edf final bill and shell opening reading match then for the gas.

nick_griff187

niktheguru said:

Hopefully you've checked your edf final bill and shell opening reading match then for the gas.

I have just checked this month's bill with Shell & it's got an E next to the reading for Gas. So although they stated when queried by email they have picked up connection for gas. Im really starting to get down about this now. We are going to be in major debt the way these bills are looking. 
I really don't see the benefit of these smart meters, I was having no issues manually inputting them.

Also as someone said above if I haven't got actual readings there is nothing I can do to dispute? So it looks like we owe nearly over £1000 with the bills shell are giving too.  

Robin9

What is Shell's Estimated reading this month and what is your Actual ?  It may be that Shell's estimate is high and the bill should be less.  Give your actual reading to Shell via the online account - NOW.

Robin9

There is a huge margin between the actual - 3678 and the estimate  - 2478 = 1200 m3 = 13200 kWh. That's more than I use in a year.

I'm beginning to loose track of this - but between when the meter was installed and now you've used about 40,000 kWh and costs about £1200. Against which you will have paid some DD's.    You can argue that some of this is Eon, some EDF and some Shell.  but over the time you have underpaid - time to catch up - give Shell the 3678 reading, get a new bill and pay it.

You are learning some hard lessons.

niktheguru

nick_griff187 said:

niktheguru said:

Hopefully you've checked your edf final bill and shell opening reading match then for the gas.

I have just checked this month's bill with Shell & it's got an E next to the reading for Gas. So although they stated when queried by email they have picked up connection for gas. Im really starting to get down about this now. We are going to be in major debt the way these bills are looking. 
I really don't see the benefit of these smart meters, I was having no issues manually inputting them.

Also as someone said above if I haven't got actual readings there is nothing I can do to dispute? So it looks like we owe nearly over £1000 with the bills shell are giving too.  

You can’t blame the smart meters for this problem, they were working fine on your original eon tariff. The lesson you have to learn from all this is to keep an eye on your usage, or at the very least your bills. I still don’t understand how you could be several months with edf on estimated bills without once noticing on the bills, then switching again without noticing your meter wasn’t working.....surely to switch you check how much you’ve used to get an accurate price comparison. You’ve made it unnecessarily complicated for yourself, but what’s done is done.

It looks like you may have to pay up. The difficulty is to who and whether you may be able to write off some of it. What is unclear is you’ve already had some written off, why that wouldn’t have made you more careful with meter readings I don’t know.

like I said, we can’t really help you try and work this out without all the information or bills which you still haven’t provided. The alternative is to take everything to citizens advice bureau to see if they can help you make a plan.

niktheguru

Sorry if I’ve sounded harsh by the way. That’s not my intention. We’re really trying to help, but it’s been 2 weeks since your original query and we’ve asked for some vital information to see how we can help guide you through your situation but it hasn’t been forthcoming. At the start we also asked about gas but you seemed to think it was all sorted but it sounds like it’s also contributing.
I hope for your sake somehow when shell have a look at your meter they may be able to get a reading from it. (Maybe it just the display has broken and the meter is still registering the reading on the hardware)

there’s this big black hole of information from when you were with edf. We need all the opening and closing readings to help you, along with the tariffs you were on. Alternatively just send copies of your first and last bill with eon, edf and shell. Once we have those it will be easy to work out what you owe. Did you call edf and ask for these? They can post or email you bills if required. The longer you leave it, the worse you’re gonna feel. Good luck.

nick_griff187

@niktheguru @Robin9

Here is my info currently on chat to edf & the bills are available on my phone just not laptop. The edf questions i am going to attach some billls because i cant make sense of the bills

1.     The tariff I was on with EDF was the Simply Online 1 Year Fix Sep 20v4 & it states rate at 14.37p KWH. That’s all I can see on the bill?

2.     Shell tariff Energy September 2021 v4 Direct – 15.666 KwH

3.      

4.     Opening read from Shell is 8751.000….There is an I next to this reading not an E. Does that mean its not an estimate?

5.     Shell opening reading was 12/09/20….Believe that is the date they started supplyin?

6.     Currently cant get any meter readings for electricity as nothing showing. Cant even get anything by pressing all buttons

 

niktheguru

Right, thanks for the uploads, finally we may be getting somewhere.

This is enough to make your head hurt, the problem is the info is split between lots of different posts in this now very long thread!

Its all really quite a bit of a mess.  BOTH your GAS and your ELECTRICITY is a problem. Don't bury your head in the sand about the GAS, this needs sorting out. You need to look at actual figures on bills and not what the companies customer services are telling you by text.
I have tried to collate everything so it may be helpful. There are still lots of holes that need answering (from the original questions that haven't been answered)

I have put all your actual readings in a table, there are gaps. please can you provide info for the gaps.

So from my understanding you were with EON first. When did that tariff start on this property? You confused us by putting bills for 2 properties initially. The first reading I found was for 1st Feb 2019. Is that when you started with EON in this property? 
You changed your meter on 12th June 2019 to a smart meter, you then switched to EDF on 18th Sept. It looks like someone came and read your meter on 7th Oct 19 (should have rang alarm bells with you, why is someone coming to read a smart meter!!) then you have no meter readings since. They have now suggested your reading is 8751 which seems ridiculously high. You have then NOT provided any bills or information for Shell in terms of your electricity.

Looking at your electricity in 2019 you were using roughly 2500 KwH in a 6 month period, so lets say 5000kwh a year. So if you extrapolate that for the 1 year period you were with EDF you would guess that your closing reading should be in the realm of 6450 rather than 8751. By that calculation it suggests your final bill should realistically be £330 lower.  Now obviously you don't have any meter readings at all after 7/10/19 (15 months) so you may well need to negotiate with EDF about what your closing reading should be. Hopefully when Shell come to review your meter they may be able to get some readings from the meter itself (but dont count on it) I would wait till this new meter situation is sorted first before trying to negotiate with EDF (but do tell edf that you are awaiting your meter to be sorted out)

Now when it comes to your gas. You need to provide some bills from your EDF period, as it seems they have been estimated as well throughout that period. It would be useful to have an opening reading for that. Assuming their closing reading was 2205 and you have paid up till that point, you now have a discrepancy of  1473m3 which equates to 16193kwh - which at shells rate of 2.3p per kwh, you will owe an extra £372.43!