Private PCNs issued to people getting COVID19 vaccinations - policy responses from the Trade Bodies

Umkomaas

10% goons
90% ANPR. 

I rarely see any of the former, but the latter are omnipresent!

AnotherForumite

beamerguy said:

Half_way said:

beamerguy said:

Are parking companies ESSENTIAL ?

The Police have now hotted up with FINES

Private parking companies are NOT ESSENTIAL .... Parking goons are still seen in car parks.
If the public see one of these goons walking around for their next fix, CALL THE POLICE, the goon should be following the rules and stay at home. Nobody knows if the goon has covid, with a windscreen ticket the virus can live on and passed on to whoever takes the ticket off the screen

Mr Clark of the BPA should look at the government list to see what ESSENTIAL means.
Parking companies are NOT listed
The BPA should warn it's members that parking goons could receive a £200 fine

Much as it would give me great satisfaction to see a parking goon dragged kicking and screaming from his/her car pakr and issued a fine by the police, its not going to happen.

At the moment there is no definition or restriction on what an essential job is - only Work from home if you can, and only you should only travel to work if you can not work from home.

 Parking Goon can not menace the car park from home

I will rephrase that ..... Parking Companies and their staff are NOT classed as an essential and just like pubs and many other outlets must close.  The car parks they manage are owned by others so the parking companies cannot just close them but ..... as they are not classed as essential , the on foot parking wardens must stay at home.

If they are allowed it would be no different to a barman in a pub serving drinks

This is a common mis-interpretation of the Covid rules. There is absolutely nothing in the legislation or guidance that prevents people working if the business is not on this list of businesses that must close: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/national-lockdown-stay-at-home#businesses-and-venues
The legislation and guidance clearly states that people should work from home where possible; therefore, if you cant work from home e.g. patrol car parks (car parks are on the list of businesses that can stay open); then it is perfectly acceptable to go to work.
On the subject of transmission via PCNs on windscreens, many operators are not issuing to the screen ATM for this very reason; opting to send by post instead.

beamerguy

Whatever you say, the police will fine wandering vagrants loitering

On the subject of transmission via PCNs on windscreens, many operators are not issuing to the screen ATM for this very reason; opting to send by post instead.

That's it, pass it on to the post office as well. 

Coupon-mad

On the subject of transmission via PCNs on windscreens, many operators are not issuing to the screen ATM for this very reason; opting to send by post instead.

Yep, VCS do that a lot.  The ICO is not impressed, I hear.  Getting keeper data is too easy and that needs to change.

Half_way

knowing the way that PPCs opperate the kes of the bpa and ipc will calim they are essential security workers if tpush comes to shove.

beamerguy

Half_way said:

knowing the way that PPCs opperate the kes of the bpa and ipc will calim they are essential security workers if tpush comes to shove.

It's just their last dying wish

Coupon-mad

I have to say, although we all know that there are many fundamentally unfair and very serious anti-consumer issues that are objectionable about private parking charges and the way the firms operate, I think the BPA's stance on this particular matter is admirable.  If the landowner hadn't cancelled the one we saw in a thread today, the PPC would have to anyway, under the BPA policy.

By contrast, I just stumbled across this published by the IPC last week and I have repeated this in post #2, as promised:

https://theipc.info/uploads/2dCaCOSCEc7hewCjqPzBzudPI0Wjru0Ngwc1IT5MBMQ/IPC Covid Vaccination Centre Guidance for Motorists V1 15012021.pdf

The IPC didn't reply to me when I raised the very real 'vaccination centre parking charges' concern with both APAs at the start of this month.  They still have not replied to me at all but that news article has appeared here:

https://theipc.info/latest-news

What can I say?

The IPC have decided to place the burden upon society's most vulnerable and elderly people and their carers/families, to have to appeal any extortionate parking charges they get.   The article makes it clear that it will be 'business as usual' for IPC member firms and they actually think that site rules like 'permit holders only' will continue to apply and PCNs can still be issued even though in many cases, to comply with rules like displaying some sort of 'permit' will be void for impossibility.   

This article talks about people having to explain and evidence why they might be late back to their cars in these extraordinary times. 

The IPC have made it clear that they have made no provision whatsoever (well there is zero indication) that they will extend grace periods, despite knowing that the best laid plans and timings of NHS services can result in people being delayed.  So, if your granny has to wait 15 minutes for her vaccination and is told to rest before she leaves the site, to make sure there are no adverse reactions, she will find a PCN on her windscreen to greet her when she staggers back to her car.

Of course these patients are permitted visitors - the article is written as if there will be carmageddon at vaccine sites with rogue ninety-year olds and people with serious medical conditions 'abusing' the landowners' land by parking willy nilly all over the place, even though the appointments are staggered to allow for safe social distancing.

The IPC member firms must be lurking, ramping up the site visits and ANPR monitoring at these test centres and rubbing their hands together with glee each time they hear that a location they 'manage' is being set up as a vaccination centre.

The difference in the statements is truly gobsmacking.  I am not sure how whoever wrote it sleeps at night.  Where is their social conscience?   

Some might describe this as morally bankrupt.  I think the press will.

Coupon-mad

Here it is in full:

IPC Guidance on Covid-19 Vaccination Centres and subsequent enforcement
The Government and the NHS are now rolling out a mass vaccination programme to combat the threat posed by Covid-19. The NHS vaccination programme, the biggest in the health service’s history, is being delivered as health service staff are treating record numbers of seriously ill patients with coronavirus, caused by rapidly rising infection numbers.

The first seven NHS Vaccination Centres have now opened at various locations across England. The seven large-scale sites, capable of delivering thousands of the lifesaving jabs each week, will be followed by dozens more. Hundreds more GP-led and hospital services are also due to open, along with the first pharmacy-led pilot sites, taking the total to around 1,200. The new large-scale NHS Vaccination Centres – including one on the site of the London Nightingale Hospital, Bristol’s Ashton Gate stadium and Manchester’s Etihad tennis club – offer a convenient alternative to GPled and hospital services.

The mass vaccination programme will mean that people will be required to travel to receive their vaccine. It is not feasible for operators to cease enforcement at all sites in and around vaccination locations.


Importance of Parking Management
To the general public, parking on private land is almost always associated with the operation and management of car parks. Parking management is about aiming the right people can park in the right places at the right time. During the pandemic that is increasingly important.

Parking on private land covers many more situations than just privately-owned car parks. It relates to all privately-owned land which includes:

 • Disabled bay
 • No Parking areas
 • Privately owned roads leading up to airports
 • Residential parking areas
 • Lawn and garden areas
 • Verges
 • Office car parks
 • Electric charge bays

As well as causing a major inconvenience for private landowners, unsolicited parking is a potential hazard for road users and pedestrians, especially on private land adjacent to public amenities and schools. With the increasing need for social distancing rules some areas are now running with reduced capacity for vehicles which inevitably creates problems.

Parking enforcement to uphold the rights of landowners is commonplace nowadays. Many landowners would rather their land was respected by those not invited upon it, but many are forced to engage the services of a private parking management company as a measure to protect their land from unsolicited parking.

Finding the correct balance between the contrasting needs of landowners, private parking management companies and motorists is no easy task, especially when considering the ever-growing number of private motor vehicles on UK roads.


Guidance for Motorists 

Avoiding a Parking Charge
Receiving a parking charge on the window of your vehicle or through the post can be upsetting, annoying and stressful. Here are the most important ways to ensure you never incur a charge at the outset.
 
Plan
Look
Read
Comply
Leave

Plan ahead –
 If you are travelling to a vaccination centre or an area where you have not travelled before then plan your journey. Do not assume there will be designated parking or free parking. Speak to the centre or look on the website. If there is parking look to see whether you will need to pay and how you are able to pay. Can you pay in advance and pre-book, do you need cash, card or a mobile app to pay? These are the questions you should consider. If there is no parking at the centre itself then look to see what facilities there are nearby and again see if you can book and how you will need to make payment. Failing to plan ahead can result in difficulties in finding a parking space. If you are stuck in traffic or delayed, then it could put pressure on you to park somewhere unfamiliar where you may be unauthorised to park.

Look for signs –
All private land which is managed for parking will have signage. Where parking is allowed either for paying customers or perhaps free for a period there are likely to be signs at the entrance which give a clear indication the car park is private land and some of the key pieces of information such as that it is a pay and display car park or there are 2 hours free. These signs will refer you to the full terms which will be located at signage throughout the car park. If there are payment machines, then it is likely there will be signs close to them.

Read the signs –
It is important that having seen the signs motorists read them. The signs will set out what you need to do. For example, they will set out;
• The time you are allowed on the car park for free
• Whether there is a payment required
• If you need to display the ticket in the windscreen
• If you must be parked in marked bay
• Any special restrictions for certain areas such as accessible bays
• The need to enter a registration number into a payment machine and/or registration kiosk

Comply with the requirements –
Motorists may feel it is ok for what appear small deviations from the terms such as not paying because they will only be 5 minutes, or that they are only in an accessible bay while they nip to the cash machine. However, these can cause difficulties and often what starts as a 5-minute trip to a shop can result in a longer stay. If you are parked in breach of the terms there is a chance you will receive a parking charge, either on the windscreen or in the post.

Do not park if you cannot or do not wish to comply with the requirements –
If you park in breach of the terms you are taking a chance. The rules are in place for a reason and you are at real risk of receiving a parking ticket if you breach the terms and conditions.

TOP TIP
If there is no parking at the vaccination centre then look to see if there is a pay on exit car park. This can prevent you either paying for too much time or being caught out by staying longer than you had paid for.

Motorists Receiving a Parking Charge
Motorists should remember that a car park attendant or operator will only have issued a parking charge where they believe the parking charge should have been issued. They will not know of any circumstances that have occurred which may justify you asking them to cancel the parking charge. The only way they will know is if you contact them, tell them and provide evidence of what occurred.

A breach of the terms and conditions may result in a motorist being issued with a parking charge. The motorist will be notified in writing either at the time of the event with a notice on the windscreen, or soon after the event with the registered keeper being notified in the post


Parking Charges Correctly Issued
If a motorist receives a notice affixed to the windscreen or in the post and they think it has been correctly issued they should accept and pay the parking charge. A discounted fee is available for payment received within 14 days of the ticket being issued. If the charge remains unpaid after 28 days, it may increase by up to a further £60 and could result in enforcement through the courts with additional costs being awarded.

Parking Charge on the Windscreen
If a motorist receives a notice affixed to the windscreen and they think it has been incorrectly issued they should: • Obtain evidence – keep the pay and display ticket or the parking permit • and compile photographic evidence which supports their case. • Follow the appeals procedure on the notice. • Identify themselves as the driver. • Provide their name and address. • Produce their evidence. If the operator rejects the appeal and the motorist still wishes to contest they should appeal to the Independent Appeals Service by following the process set out by the operator when they rejected the appeal. If the motorist appeals to the independent adjudicator they may lose their ability to pay at the reduced rate.

Postal Parking Charge
If a motorist receives a postal notification, and they think it has been incorrectly issued on the basis that they are not the driver they should:
• Identify the driver by providing the operator with the name and address of the person driving the vehicle at the time of the parking event. Details of how to do this will be on the notice.
• Once you have provided the correct name and address for the driver of the vehicle they will contact the driver. If they were the Driver they should:
• Obtain evidence – keep the pay and display ticket or the parking permit and
• Compile photographic evidence which supports your case.
• Follow the appeals procedure on the notice.
• Appeal to the operator.
• Identify themselves as the driver.
• Provide their name and address.
• Produce their evidence.
• Keep the parking operator informed about any changes of address whilst the parking charge is in dispute.

If the operator rejects the appeal and the motorist still wishes to contest they should appeal to the Independent Appeals Service by following the process set out by the operator when they rejected the appeal. If the Motorist appeals to the independent adjudicator they may lose their ability to pay at the reduced rate.

Not dealing with the charge within the timescales allowed can cause motorists to lose any discounted rates applicable.

Not dealing with the charge can lead to enforcement of the debt and ultimately action through the Courts to recover it.

Top Tips
Don’t be confrontational or misleading. If you were parked in breach of the terms and conditions and are asking a parking company to cancel a parking charge based on mitigation then be polite, follow the steps and provide evidence.

Parking companies understand the difficulties many people face. They find themselves needing to balance the needs and desires of land owners and users of the car parks or areas where parking is not permitted. If you are asking for a parking operator to consider cancelling the parking charge they have issued to you then provide as much evidence as you possible can. If you have been late returning to your vehicle then explain what happened and why you were late. Also provide evidence. It is hard for parking operators to consider appeals without evidence that can prove what you claim happened did occur.

If you had difficulties following your vaccination, or the appointment was delayed then provide evidence of your appointment and explain what occurred. 

Snakes_Belly

It's a struggle for the elderly to get to these mass vaccination sites let alone receive a parking charge. My relatives were sent a letter for their vaccine at Millennium Point (they live in Staffordshire). It would have been a nightmare for them to go into Birmingham. One of the family would have taken them which is a risk as they are in the very vulnerable group. Fortunately they have managed to get  their vaccines at a local chemist. 

The main thing is that the elderly and vulnerable are not put off by their first visit and fail to attend for the second dose. These are people who will be most affected by Covid and cannot go by public transport as they are high risk.     

Umkomaas

Vomit inducing!

With the increasing need for social distancing rules some areas are now running with reduced capacity for vehicles which inevitably creates problems .....

......... for our operators' profit margins!