Mother-in-law and money

Fireflyaway

OP I'm interested to know what you plan to do about your drop in hours? Will it be permanent? If so then maybe you need to look for another job / take on a second job if you can't afford to get by on your reduced hours. 
Your MIL is definitely making a very modest contribution but I'm not sure that your MIL and your reduction in hours is really linked. If you got a pay rise would you be lowering her contribution? If she didn't live with you, how would you make up the loss in income? I get the feeling you are a bit panicked and the easy and obvious solution is to turn to MIL because you know she has money and the responsibility to provide for your family is down to you. Maybe it feels unfair that you now have to cut back / face a struggle whilst she is still maintaining the same lifestyle and expects you to deal with it? 
Maybe check if you are entitled to any benefits. There are calculators online. 
Personally I'd not ask for more money. You agreed to let your MIL life with you and its unreasonable to expect her to step in when times are hard. Having said that, she is getting a very good deal and it would be nice if she showed appreciation by doing a bit of shopping or pay the odd bill. 
I'd let the situation lie. Upsetting your wife or MIL is going to make life really hard. 

xylophone

Add up the  annual  bills for Council Tax/food/ utilities/other household shopping and ask her to pay a third of the cost?

chubster

Fireflyaway said:

OP I'm interested to know what you plan to do about your drop in hours? Will it be permanent? If so then maybe you need to look for another job / take on a second job if you can't afford to get by on your reduced hours. 
Your MIL is definitely making a very modest contribution but I'm not sure that your MIL and your reduction in hours is really linked. If you got a pay rise would you be lowering her contribution? If she didn't live with you, how would you make up the loss in income? I get the feeling you are a bit panicked and the easy and obvious solution is to turn to MIL because you know she has money and the responsibility to provide for your family is down to you. Maybe it feels unfair that you now have to cut back / face a struggle whilst she is still maintaining the same lifestyle and expects you to deal with it? 
Maybe check if you are entitled to any benefits. There are calculators online. 
Personally I'd not ask for more money. You agreed to let your MIL life with you and its unreasonable to expect her to step in when times are hard. Having said that, she is getting a very good deal and it would be nice if she showed appreciation by doing a bit of shopping or pay the odd bill. 
I'd let the situation lie. Upsetting your wife or MIL is going to make life really hard. 

Yes I am going to look for a second job to top up my income but I would like to retire one day and don't want to work till I drop dead. I guess that, rather stupidly as it now seems, that MIL would want to increase her contribution over time. Looking back we should have had this conversation a few years. We can survive on my reduced income so I guess we will just have to look at ways we can cut back but it does seem a bit daft to me when it is clear that MIL could easily make a greater contribution to running the house. I probably just will have to accept the situation, it has been good to get a range of opinions and some ideas on here so thanks for everyone who has posted.

74jax

chubster said:

Fireflyaway said:

OP I'm interested to know what you plan to do about your drop in hours? Will it be permanent? If so then maybe you need to look for another job / take on a second job if you can't afford to get by on your reduced hours. 
Your MIL is definitely making a very modest contribution but I'm not sure that your MIL and your reduction in hours is really linked. If you got a pay rise would you be lowering her contribution? If she didn't live with you, how would you make up the loss in income? I get the feeling you are a bit panicked and the easy and obvious solution is to turn to MIL because you know she has money and the responsibility to provide for your family is down to you. Maybe it feels unfair that you now have to cut back / face a struggle whilst she is still maintaining the same lifestyle and expects you to deal with it? 
Maybe check if you are entitled to any benefits. There are calculators online. 
Personally I'd not ask for more money. You agreed to let your MIL life with you and its unreasonable to expect her to step in when times are hard. Having said that, she is getting a very good deal and it would be nice if she showed appreciation by doing a bit of shopping or pay the odd bill. 
I'd let the situation lie. Upsetting your wife or MIL is going to make life really hard. 

Yes I am going to look for a second job to top up my income but I would like to retire one day and don't want to work till I drop dead. I guess that, rather stupidly as it now seems, that MIL would want to increase her contribution over time. Looking back we should have had this conversation a few years. We can survive on my reduced income so I guess we will just have to look at ways we can cut back but it does seem a bit daft to me when it is clear that MIL could easily make a greater contribution to running the house. I probably just will have to accept the situation, it has been good to get a range of opinions and some ideas on here so thanks for everyone who has posted.

I'm at a loss to your wife's behaviour. Seeing nothing wrong in you working 2 jobs to support her mother. 

chubster

FreetodoasIlike said:

Look at it another way. Do you have (adult) children? I am assuming that you and your wife are probably in your mid to late 50s? If you DID have adult children still living at home (and fortunate enough to be in a job) you would expect them to make a financial contribution towards household bills, wouldn’t you? Even if they were fervently saving for a house deposit you would still ask them to contribute more than £20 a week - even if you could afford not to, you would still want to teach them the value of money and how much things cost in the real world, wouldn’t you?  I appreciate that a young adult may eat more than an elderly lady, but not always. I have an ex-work colleague who is several years older than me. She claims to “eat like a bird” but I have been on meals out with her and she eats more than the rest of us. The packed lunch she used to bring to work would feed two people! £20 a week is nothing. As you said your MIL doesn’t drive and doesn’t go out, but as another poster on here said, she surely has GP/optician and other appointments etc. which would all add up if she had to attend by taxi. Your MIL clearly doesn’t understand the cost of living nowadays. My own mother (who lives on her own in sheltered accommodation) doesn’t to an extent either. I have PoA and her debit card but she still queries the £25/£30 a week grocery shop - when ours is a
around £80/ £90! You really do need to have “the conversation” about money. Does a large proportion of the £80k savings she has come from her house sale 10 years ago? I suspect, as she doesn’t contribute much financially, that she’s added to the savings over the years and thinks that is her daughter’s inheritance. But, as others have pointed out, no-one knows what’s around the corner and the savings she’s accumulated could easily go on care home expenses. There’s no guarantee that your wife will inherit. Also, you say that your home is large enough for her to have her own space. Who cleans this “space”? Who does your MIL’s washing and ironing/changes her bedding? I suspect it’s your wife. If that’s the case, your MIL is getting a very good deal indeed! She is clearly “blinkered” and you (and your wife especially) need to talk to her.

PS - I don’t know how old your MIL is, but my mother is 99 and still going strong. If your MIL is only in her early 80s she could live for another 20 years or so. The cost of living will always rise with inflation and you could find yourselves in this same situation in 19 or 15 years time. 

Yes we have adult children and we are both nearly 60, MIL is in her early 80s and as you say could live for a long time. My wife agrees that if either of our adult children moved back in with us we would expect them to contribute to food and bills and that would only seem fair however she feels this isn't the case for her mother. I should say that MIL is a very prickly person who takes offence very easily so my wife tiptoes around her most of the time. MIL does help with light housework but she would definitely not be able to look after herself to the standard she gets living with us! There was some money left over from the sale of her house but MIL's savings are mainly due to the fact she doesn't spend any money other than haircuts and buying a few bits of clothes. MIL never takes the bus or taxi my wife ferries her everywhere in the car and she never offers petrol money or even to pay for parking. Looking back we should have thrashed this all out years ago rather than leaving it all this time and yes inflation is going to make things worse.

ZeroSum

Silvertabby said:

Serve up beans on toast for dinner.  Every night.  If she complains, say it's all you can afford.

Luxury. I'd be serving porridge. Made with water, rather than milk 

Pollycat

chubster said:

Yes we have adult children and we are both nearly 60, MIL is in her early 80s and as you say could live for a long time. My wife agrees that if either of our adult children moved back in with us we would expect them to contribute to food and bills and that would only seem fair however she feels this isn't the case for her mother. I should say that MIL is a very prickly person who takes offence very easily so my wife tiptoes around her most of the time. MIL does help with light housework but she would definitely not be able to look after herself to the standard she gets living with us! There was some money left over from the sale of her house but MIL's savings are mainly due to the fact she doesn't spend any money other than haircuts and buying a few bits of clothes. MIL never takes the bus or taxi my wife ferries her everywhere in the car and she never offers petrol money or even to pay for parking. Looking back we should have thrashed this all out years ago rather than leaving it all this time and yes inflation is going to make things worse.

If your wife was in agreement with you about her Mum paying more, this would be a good way to make her realise just what a good deal she has.

'sorry Mum, I'm busy today so can't take you shopping/haircut/appointment. But I've written a list of taxi companies'.

pollypenny

I'm astounded by this woman's behaviour. A contribution of a £1000 pa, plus another weekly one for food would be a bit better. 

The ages are also very important. As said she could live for 20 years - but which time OP and his wife will be nearer 80. Who knows what their own health and needs will be?  

Without his wife in side, it's going to be difficult. 

pmlindyloo

I think you should sit down with your wife and discuss your finances for when your incomes reduce.
Do a simple budget for one month including all expenditure.
This will give you both an idea of how you are going to manage financially.  Don't forget to include sums for holidays and divide yearly items by 12.  I believe the Debtfree Wannbe forum has a SOA (statement of affairs) that you could use - best to use something like this as there are all kinds of things things that it is easy to forget.
When you have this discussion do not mention MIL. 
At the moment you are 'guessing' whether you will have to change your lifestyle.  You needs the facts.
I do not know to what extent you will have to 'tighten your belts' but you will know and most importantly your wife will know.
Of course if the change is substantial then the next conversation has to be about 'giving up' the holidays/selling the car/selling the house etc
If you leave your MIL's part in this OUT OF THE CONVERSATIONS then later, I suspect, your wife will inevitably consider MIL's financial contribution.  
Doing it this way means that you and your wife will not fall out and, with a bit of luck, all will resolve itself as your wife will speak to her mum and mum will offer more money.
So, do not discuss the situation with MIL for a while and then have that 'budget meeting'.
The last thing you want is for this to cause a major rift with you and your wife. Doing a budget when your finances change so dramatically is a sensible thing to do anyway.

GreenQueen

Does MIL get attendance allowance? My 80 year old DM does, the forms were a bit lengthy, but not difficult and I think for someone over 80 the lower level (£50ish a week) is granted fairly automatically. That money is for supporting their living - cleaning, care, etc. May be worth looking into.