Neon Reef - any views?

Farway

DiseasedBunny said:

So are neon reef any good these days? Looking at they want you to pay 33% more sep to March, then 33% less in the summer. How are people finding that working?

I joined in Feb, one year fix, Coral,  and so far no problems whatever, and no mention of DD increase for winter

brewerdave

Farway said:

DiseasedBunny said:

So are neon reef any good these days? Looking at they want you to pay 33% more sep to March, then 33% less in the summer. How are people finding that working?

I joined in Feb, one year fix, Coral,  and so far no problems whatever, and no mention of DD increase for winter

Exactly the same here; my DD was actually set a bit low so after I submit meter read in a couple of days ,I suspect that my account debit will be greater than this month's DD. Will be interesting to see whether they increase the DD for subsequent months or ask for a one off payment.

Bacman

Must be a reason they need cash injection...fines to pay again??

BUFF

I just moved to them in the middle of last month on fixed Neptune tariff with fixed DD (1/12 expected annual electricity usage). So far everything has gone smoothly  but admittedly I only have 2-3 weeks experience.

DiseasedBunny

. Please note, that with this tariff there will be a winter uplift in your estimated DD payment of 33% for the first 6 months and a reduction of 33% for the last 6 months. Your first direct debit payment will be taken on the day your switch goes live.  

I’m guessing it’s because it’s coming into winter and we use more electricity, but certainly not 33% more, ah well

Telegraph_Sam

Strikes me as putting the cart before the horse combined with dodgy mathematics - increasing the D/D by such an amount without "evidence". And if the agreed D/D is upped by 33% and then reduced by 33% (of what?) does that then get you back to square one?  Was the "blind" 33% uplift made clear at the time they quoted (or slipped in via the back door subsequently)?

It comes across as all part of the money grab scheme that seems to be so popular with some of the suppliers at the cheaper end of the market

niktheguru

Telegraph_Sam said:

Strikes me as putting the cart before the horse combined with dodgy mathematics - increasing the D/D by such an amount without "evidence". And if the agreed D/D is upped by 33% and then reduced by 33% (of what?) does that then get you back to square one?  Was the "blind" 33% uplift made clear at the time they quoted (or slipped in via the back door subsequently)?

It comes across as all part of the money grab scheme that seems to be so popular with some of the suppliers at the cheaper end of the market

Seasonal direct debit is nothing new Sam. It was put in motion so you don’t have a massive credit balance in the summer and don’t go into a debit balance in the winter when usage is higher. They generally work out your monthly payment based on your eac divided by 12, the. Apportion it by a percentage higher than that during winter and lower than that in summer. This is NOT the same as over estimating usage like symbio does.

Telegraph_Sam

As you know I have knowingly gone into a contract with SO which has seasonal variations - which I have got modified to suit my circs. The point here is not the principle as such but the way in which it is open to abuse. I would argue that NR slapping on a 33% uplift blindly up front without any data to go on amounts to a money grab abuse. It would be different if DiseasedBunny had a record of upping his thermostat by a huge amount come the start of winter - but that clearly does not apply. Underlying this approach is the implicit unstated rule: "Woe betide you if your account goes into debit, but it is perfectly acceptable if it goes into credit by the same or a greater amount". I would say that this is not miles different from what you report is Symbio's practice, but in different clothes.
The mathematics is further complicated by the fact that the usage in winter (higher D/D) will be higher than in summer (lower D/D). And whether, if you put the flat average D/D at 100, the winter tweak will be 133 - and then will the summer rate be 133 less 33%, or 100, or 67 .. ? Dodgy.

niktheguru

Telegraph_Sam said:

The point here is not the principle as such but the way in which it is open to abuse. I would argue that NR slapping on a 33% uplift blindly up front without any data to go on amounts to a money grab abuse. It would be different if DiseasedBunny had a record of upping his thermostat by a huge amount come the start of winter - but that clearly does not apply. Underlying this approach is the implicit unstated rule: "Woe betide you if your account goes into debit, but it is perfectly acceptable if it goes into credit by the same or a greater amount". I would say that this is not miles different from what you report is Symbio's practice, but in different clothes.
The mathematics is further complicated by the fact that the usage in winter (higher D/D) will be higher than in summer (lower D/D). And whether, if you put the flat average D/D at 100, the winter tweak will be 133 - and then will the summer rate be 133 less 33%, or 100, or 67 .. ? Dodgy.

I dont think you've really understood what they are doing here and you're making it sound much worse than it is. Yes, they're asking for a front payment, but they're being perfectly transparent and clear about it. It is in no way similar to symbio (who "estimate your month aheads usage often with a random multiplier, so you wont know by how much they do each month or not.....granted, with a submitted meter read the "extra" is rebated the following month)

The neon reef system is extremely simple, and the mathematics is not "complicated". You provide your EAC (just as you would for any utility company), then they will calculate the monthly average based on that. i.e. if your annual usage was for arguments sake 5000kwh and the theoretical unit price was 10p/kwh and the service charge was 1p per day, then your annual cost would be  (5000 x0.10) + (0.01 *365) = 503.65
Then monthly this would be £41.97
They ask you to pay 33% of this amount extra for the first 6 months. (so that would be £55.82), then for the following 6 months you pay 33% less than the £41.97 (which is £28.12).....so at 12 months you would have paid the same as if you paid £41.97 every month.

Their terms and conditions state as long as you provide monthly meter readings your account is reviewed twice yearly and any large credit balance can be amended (whether that happens in practice is another thing entirely)

However, i don't think this billing system is anywhere near as troublesome or "dodgy" as you are implying. If they are offering a competitive unit rate and its cheaper than other things available i'd be happy to pay a little extra for the first 6 months to build a modest credit and let it be spent the following 6 months.

Stratus

For a property not centrally heated by electricity, adding 30% to an electric tariff between October and March appears excessive.

My consumption is pretty consistent throughout the year and I've just checked between those months last year I used 50.07% of my annual consumption.