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pickledonionspaceraider

@Lover_of_Lycra      No one at all is saying you NEED to smack a child. People are just sharing experiences, of how common it was for some of us.

@onwards&upwards There are a lot of things that are legal that are ill- advised. 

Physical aggression is not the only type of punishment that leaves  scars.  I see a lot of passive-aggressive and patronising behaviour on these boards... and these behaviours have got to have been learned somewhere. 

SingleSue

I'm known as being a strict parent but I didn't smack my children nor did I parent through fear. I had my boundaries, the children were taught the boundaries and what would happen if they went over those boundaries in advance, rather than after they wandered over them. Although strict, within the boundaries there was a lot of leeway and freedom to express themselves and we conducted ourselves as a family in a democratic manner but more importantly, we talked and had time for each other.

However, in their early years and whilst still married, ex husband had a different way of parenting which was to smack for anything that he decided required a smack using the 'has to be disciplined' saying. He thought my way was too wishy washy and namby pamby. Unfortunately, through this, it taught my middle son that if he was annoyed with something or someone, then hitting them, shouting or throwing something was the way to get them in order. It took many years of no smacking, non aggressive, proactive  parenting to get him out of this.

My children are now 26, 23 and almost 22. None of them went rogue, none of them are disrespectful or troublemakers, the teenage years were bliss compared to what others had to endure, all of them will hold doors open for others, give up a seat for someone else, will help out someone who is struggling and are genuinely nice people. I'm currently teaching my brother and sister in law on my kind of parenting (at their request I hasten to add, I wouldn't dream of pushing my way in) for my niece as they are struggling with her....she's fine with me (and now my parents) using my old proactive parenting methods but is an absolute nightmare for them using their reactive parenting (smack when naughty) methods. 

It's early days for them but already it has made a big difference in her behaviour and respect for them and others.

Fireflyaway

I do think there is less consideration and respect for others compared to when I was younger. Simple things such as saying thank you if a driver stops for you at a road crossing. Very few people bother these days. When I was at school your parents and teachers would both reinforce the same messages but today so many parents encourage their kids to be defiant and challenge rules. The biggest thing in my opinion is people not taking responsibility for their actions and society / authorities/ the state etc being too afraid to tell them and let them face the consequences. I previously worked in a 'deprived ' area. I struggled to see what it was deprived of. They still had all the same services as any other area. What ruined it was people living there making bad choices. If you live in a 2 bed house and chose to have 8 kids of course you will be overcrowded. Why make that choice if you don't like the consequences? When I worked for one charity there were service users being paid more in benefits than the support workers were paid in wages. I think we need a benefit system for those in need but it shouldn't be an alternative to work. That's changed. People used to be self conscious about claiming benefits but there are some people now who are proud to claim as much as they can! 

[Deleted User]

pickledonionspaceraider said:

@Lover_of_Lycra      No one at all is saying you NEED to smack a child. People are just sharing experiences, of how common it was for some of us.

Not everyone is simply sharing experiences.  Some on this thread seem to be lamenting the fact that teachers can no longer dish out corporal punishment or that smacking your own child should be ok.  I for one am glad that teacher cannot belt children anymore and that its not really acceptable to smack children any more so for me that's an improvement on yesteryear.

[Deleted User]

Everything is cyclical.  Glasgow had its razor gangs in the 20s and 30s then again in the 60s and again in 2000.  Go further back and the Victorians brought in a strong religious drive for higher moral standards that what had come before.  There were the hedonistic days of Charles II's reformation that eventually came to an end.  It all ebbs and flows.  

pickledonionspaceraider

Lover_of_Lycra said:

pickledonionspaceraider said:

@Lover_of_Lycra      No one at all is saying you NEED to smack a child. People are just sharing experiences, of how common it was for some of us.

Not everyone is simply sharing experiences.  Some on this thread seem to be lamenting the fact that teachers can no longer dish out corporal punishment or that smacking your own child should be ok.  I for one am glad that teacher cannot belt children anymore and that its not really acceptable to smack children any more so for me that's an improvement on yesteryear.

It is all in relation to how society has changed. The lack of even basic consideration for anyone else or for taking ownership of ones own life, seems to be an age old concept. 

Society has negatively changed,  crime rates skyrocket, knife carrying is the norm...all happens within the same generation that smacking becomes frowned upon. 

It is understandable that people may come to the conclusion that is some kind of correlation

I am not saying smacking is right or wrong, but I can see both sides of the discussion, and I think the (if I was to be hysterical) 'downfall of society' has more elements in it. 

Loads has changed within one generation.  The whole topic goes far FAR deeper than smacking children. 

pickledonionspaceraider

Fireflyaway said:

Fireflyaway said:

I do think there is less consideration and respect for others compared to when I was younger. Simple things such as saying thank you if a driver stops for you at a road crossing. Very few people bother these days. When I was at school your parents and teachers would both reinforce the same messages but today so many parents encourage their kids to be defiant and challenge rules. The biggest thing in my opinion is people not taking responsibility for their actions and society / authorities/ the state etc being too afraid to tell them and let them face the consequences. I previously worked in a 'deprived ' area. I struggled to see what it was deprived of. They still had all the same services as any other area. What ruined it was people living there making bad choices. If you live in a 2 bed house and chose to have 8 kids of course you will be overcrowded. Why make that choice if you don't like the consequences? When I worked for one charity there were service users being paid more in benefits than the support workers were paid in wages. I think we need a benefit system for those in need but it shouldn't be an alternative to work. That's changed. People used to be self conscious about claiming benefits but there are some people now who are proud to claim as much as they can! 

(sorry the above I was trying to quote!)

I agree with much of what you say here

Having worked for Charities and Not for profits, folks qualify for far more services if they are on benefits, than if they are 'working poor'

There would be families on benefits getting goods, childcare, acces to local authority housing , food, clothes and services regularly given by  various charities. At Christmas, the kids would be given free presents. Events organised for them

Yet the working families on low wage, (coming home with the same or sometimes less than those on benefits) would be denied access to the exact same services - not even eligible to even join the local authority housing register, having to private rent and plunging them in to desperate situations

The working poor literally do disappear under the radar, they are the underclass in our society I think.

pickledonionspaceraider

Food for thought.  

We have removed smacking, however society has got more violent and unsettled.

Interesting. 

swingaloo

I was smacked as a child but it didn't make me afraid of my parents. It made me afraid of the repercussions of behaving badly. 
All my siblings were smacked and not one of us held any kind of grudge or resentfulness towards our parents. If we got in trouble at school then we got in trouble again at home when our parents found out about it. 
It certainly didn't leave scars or cause trauma to any of us.
Nor did it make me abusive towards my own children. There was only one instance of one of my sons getting a smack on the bottom and its turned into a family joke now he is older, he never misses a chance to remind me of it.
There is a big difference between physical abuse and a smack on the leg.  Now we have a society many of whom have no respect for anyone or anything because they have never had any form of discipline. Parents are held to ransom by their own children in many cases, schools cannot discipline any more and if they try they have some irate parent who cant believe their little angel could possibly misbehave posing on the front of the local paper with folded arms pulling the appropriate face. The police have no options, householders, shopkeepers and car owners are at risk if they try to defend their own property. People going about their daily jobs have to take abuse. 
Since this thread started Ive had chats with my grandson and my nephew to get their opinions. My grandson (14) said that at school a lot of the kids refuse to do things in lessons, never do homework, walk out of detentions, go in late and even leave early. When I asked why they did that he replied 'Because they can, they know no-one can do anything'. My nephew (19) said it was pretty much the same when he was at school and that pupils would just laugh at teachers when they tried to enforce any kind of order. In his words, 'No-one did anything they didnt want to do'. 
If smacking a child causes the child to grow up to believe that aggression is the answer as some posters have implied, why is it that since any kind of physical discipline has been banned children have become more aggressive? Shouldn't it be the other way round.
Sitting a child on the 'naughty step' is not working and we are now too far gone to rectify the problems caused by years of letting little Johnny have his own way.

onwards&upwards

pickledonionspaceraider said:

Food for thought.  

We have removed smacking, however society has got more violent and unsettled.

Interesting. 

First of all, plenty of people still hit their kids, sadly. 

Secondly, no it hasn’t.