UKCPS - “No Stopping” Parking Charge

Umkomaas

Happy to explain in court if need be. 

You may well get the opportunity, but you need to realise it's not just a case of rocking up in court and explaining to a friendly, on-your-side Judge. It doesn't work like that. There will be a significant amount of work for you to do to even get the chance of seeing a Judge. Ignore court papers and you're staring down both barrels of a CCJ with its dire effect on your credit rating. 

Please read the NEWBIES FAQ Announcement, first and second posts, so you can make informed decisions on how you proceed. 

schoie936

That’s my thoughts as well, so trying to put the ground work in now before any court proceedings. If anybody has access to the title deeds of Gateway House or Piccadilly Station there may be information on byelaws or access rights for Piccadilly Station customers. Any help on this makes everybody’s claim a lot easier to defend. Keeper Liability not on relevant land?

nuibeach

schoie936 said:

That’s my thoughts as well, so trying to put the ground work in now before any court proceedings. If anybody has access to the title deeds of Gateway House or Piccadilly Station there may be information on byelaws or access rights for Piccadilly Station customers. Any help on this makes everybody’s claim a lot easier to defend. Keeper Liability not on relevant land?

It's a service road, it is not for public use as in dropping off, picking up. The land was previously owned by the railway but with the sale of Gateway House the rear service road changed hands and is now owned by the hotel building owners.

However, the signage must be read in order for you to enter into a contact with the landowner and the fact that you must stop your vehicle before being able to read the sign means you have already broke any contract before being able to enter into a contract.

When, or if I "rock up" at court this will be my first point of issue, you simply can't be penalised for disobeying a "No Stopping" sign when you had to stop to read it. If you are expected to read it whilst in charge of a moving vehicle then this, in. my opinion opens up a whole host of safety related issues.

My advice is don't pay, ignore all correspondence asking for for money and should you eventually get a court summons then turn up and argue your case. It will have no bearing on your credit record and the worst case scenario is you get fined approximately 250 quid with costs

Coupon-mad

Yep and I believe from pics there are no double red lines.  It's not a properly or fairly signed 'no-stopping' zone then.

Double yellows don't mean no stopping, so they can't rely on those.  The upcoming new statutory Code of Practice will help you this year, we hope, as the draft shown to the public mentioned repeater signs and double reds for 'no stopping' roadways.  

nuibeach

Coupon-mad said:

Yep and I believe from pics there are no double red lines.  It's not a properly or fairly signed 'no-stopping' zone then.

Double yellows don't mean no stopping, so they can't rely on those.  The upcoming new statutory Code of Practice will help you this year, we hope, as the draft shown to the public mentioned repeater signs and double reds for 'no stopping' roadways.  

I don't even think there are double yellows, there are certainly no road markings at the top of the approach where I stopped (the top of the road and the gap through to Gregg's. Which is where the majority of people stop.

There's a reason why nobody as far as I know has received a court summons and it's because they know would they would lose. Quite simply they are chancers who are happy getting maybe 50% of those caught paying up.

Coupon-mad

We all agree!

Umkomaas

There's a reason why nobody as far as I know has received a court summons and it's because they know would they would lose. Quite simply they are chancers who are happy getting maybe 50% of those caught paying up.

There has been a small number going to court from a few years back, but none that I recall were successful. 

Nowadays ESPEL look to the intimidation route in order to gouge money, a number of people are still content to open their wallet/purse to them. 

nuibeach

Umkomaas said:

There's a reason why nobody as far as I know has received a court summons and it's because they know would they would lose. Quite simply they are chancers who are happy getting maybe 50% of those caught paying up.

There has been a small number going to court from a few years back, but none that I recall were successful. 

Nowadays ESPEL look to the intimidation route in order to gouge money, a number of people are still content to open their wallet/purse to them. 

I have regularly dropped stuff off at work over the last 25 years, no issues as was railway property. The last time was about four years ago (no issues) As far as I am aware the new landowners fitted cameras about 18 months ago.

Denzelp

It has been suggested that I post a copy of the appeal I sent to IAS against a charge made by UKPCS in December because I am pleased to report that it was successful.

This is it:-

Heading:- "You completed the appeal on 29/01/2022 23:20:40. "

"The service area at Bilbrough Top on the A64 near York contains various unconnected retail outlets including a BP filling station, McDonalds, Starbucks and Premier Inn.

The access roads are not public roads, they are laid out to appear like public roads and include double yellow lines next to kerbs, there are no markings on the kerbs themselves. In order for a driver to read any roadside signs it would be necessary to stop which could trigger a charge from UKCPS.

Double yellow lines indicate no parking on public roads and there are exemptions for certain types of stopping.

'No stopping' markings should be red.

There is an annual report from POPLA which IAS will be familiar with, where Lead Adjudicator, barrister Henry Greenslade refers to what a no stopping zone must look like with red lines and repeater signs.

It is obvious from the pictures provided by UKPCS that the vehicle was not parked but had stopped. It was not next to the kerb, the driver was in the car all the time and would have moved if another vehicle approached. Two camera shots show 09:38:08 and 09:39;16, i.e.- 1 minute and 8 seconds.

There are mitigating circumstances but they do not form part of this appeal."

This is the thread I started: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6322403/no-stopping-pcn-from-ukcps/p1

This is the email from IAS received yesterday.

"Thank you for your appeal. Due to further information UKCPS Ltd has confirmed they will no longer be pursuing the matter and the parking charge has been cancelled."

Thanks to those who helped me and to the Forum in general.

Denzelp

Coupon-mad

Very good!

Extremely useful for this thread about a similar trap at Piccadilly Manchester.

People with any no stopping PCN from the likes of UKCPS can copy that to IAS, as long as they don't try the £15 non-standard option because that isn't an option!