A Question for Tory Supporters

MobileSaver

Herzlos wrote: »

he's very obviously not anti-semitic.

But he is/was an IRA sympathiser.

westernpromise

Labour has spent the last 40 years virtue-signalling about racism and being very quick to accuse others of it. The current extent of racism in the Labour party, and its tolerance of the racism of the likes of Diane Abbott, makes it quite clear that they absolutely do not care about it, and never have. It's just a way to persuade people that they have a grievance and should be given special treatment, so vote Labour.

It's the same with poverty, where Labour gains electorally if there are lots of poor, so they deliberately create more poor; with unemployment; with benefit dependency; with poor education - the list goes on. There's no problem in the country that Labour does not seek to make worse to preserve its electoral franchise.

To vote Labour is to vote for a country full of malicious, spiteful losers.

Theophile

Vote Tory.
Bring your own mattress though.

Child suspected of having pneumonia was forced to sleep on the floor of a hospital due to lack of beds.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10510584/boy-sleeps-on-hospital-floor/

Ex-NHS nurse left lying on wet pavement in three hour wait for ambulance

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-nhs-nurse-left-lying-20973109

Herzlos

jimi_man wrote: »

I do get the impression that there is a real 'closing your eyes to the obvious' about this whole anti-Semitism issue in the Labour party. A case of ignore it and deny it in the hope that it will go away. It gives the impression that there isn’t a problem at all, which is either extremely deluded or else it’s a desperate attempt to deny what’s going on.

I don't see that at all. I see lots of shouting that he's anti-semitic but it's never backed up with any evidence. We do know that he's disciplined members for AS comments and there are new processes in place to deal with it.
We also know that the cross-party review group found Labour was less AS than the population in general and less AS than the Tories. That everyone is screaming about Labour and Corbyn being AS whilst ignoring the Tories (who've had 1 MP sacked and 3 facing action in the last fortnight) makes it clear it's going nothing to do with the Jews.

When you have the UK Chief Rabbi who states that he is fearful of a Corbyn government;

This is the same one who said he was a good friend of Johnson? Doesn't that cast some doubts on his motivations?

Irrespective of who wins on Thursday, he needs to get a grip on this and he has singularly failed to do that thus far. There is a huge problem, there are numerous reports from within his own party of anti-Semitic issues and I fail to see how people cannot acknowledge this. (Unless of course they are of that persuasion themselves).

No-one is refusing to acknowledge it - it's being dealt with.

Tacit acceptance was how the Holocaust started.

Indeed, so why is everyone ignoring it when it's the Tories?


I'll also add that a lot of the claims of anti-Semitism seem to be aimed at complaints about actions of the Israeli state (it's not anti-Jew to be against Israeli soldiers killing civilians and children, or confiscating land, no?)

Herzlos

MobileSaver wrote: »

But he is/was an IRA sympathiser.

He wasn't, he's on record condemning them at every oportunity, he even reported them to the police when he found out about an attack.


Do you have any evidence that he agreed with them on anything?


How do you feel about the Tories also meeting them, or breaking our own laws to sell weapons to the people we know sell them to ISIS?

Herzlos

westernpromise wrote: »

1. He defended Stephen Sizer, who had posted anti-Semitic material online.
2. He wrote the foreword praising a “brilliant” book which argued that banks and the press were controlled by Jews.
3. He supported Paul Eisen, a Holocaust denier, and attended several of his events.
4. He defended a mural that contained anti-Semitic tropes, including depictions of “hook-nosed bankers” playing monopoly on the backs of the poor.
5. He attended an event on Holocaust Memorial Day in 2010 that compared Israel to the Nazis.
6. He “laid a wreath next to the graves of Black September terrorists” and later claimed he was “present but not involved”.
7. He said “Zionists...don’t understand English irony despite having lived in the country for a long time”.
8. He failed to call out anti-Semitic abuse, undermining his commitment that he opposes all forms of racism.
9. He pressurised staff dealing with anti-Semitism to “take a lenient approach”.
10. He initially reisted adopting the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance definiton of anti-Semitism.
11. He defended Chris Williamson against allegations of anti-Semitism weeks before he was suspended for those allegations. Mr Corbyn said he was “not anti-Semitic in any way”.

I'll look into these in a bit more detail but I know a few of them are definitively incorrect/misleading.

When Corbyn says "Zionist" what does he actually mean? He means "yid", correct?

He's almost certainly talking about the movement to reclaim Palestine as part of Israel (and the subsequent eradication of the Palestinian people). Unless you've got any evidence to show that by "Zionist" he means something other than "Zionist".

buggy_boy

triathlon wrote: »

most of the anti semitic rhetoric is coming from the islam community which is strong within labour, corbyn is a lot of things, but he is not racist

Even though in 2011 he questioned Israels right to existence.. If you understand the history of the jewish community you will understand why this is so offensive..

The man sympathised with the IRA, hezbullah, hamas.

In 2015 he questioned the "shoot to kill" policy of London met police, he has now changed his mind after the brave men and women of the met have responded to two terror attacks that have necessitated a "shoot to kill" policy to save lives, if he had been in power how many extra lives would have been lost?

Then you have his front bench, Mcdonnell a marxist, Diane Abbott as home sectary that suggested getting rid of MI5, can't count, campaigns against private schools yet sent her son to a private school.

Corbyn as a potential PM releases confidential documents from russian sources, he publicly berates our closest security ally the US. We rely heavily on US intelligence to keep us safe, would the Americans be so keen to share intel if he is openly against the democratically elected president and releases confidential documents? You don't have to like the president but as PM you need to be diplomatic and work with them.

Then there is his spending plans, dragging us back to the 70's which was oh so great, I mean trains worked so much better under government control.

Brexit, he is going to get a deal that nobody within the Labour party is going to support, he can't even say who is going to negotiate this so called deal, then we have a second referendum with seemingly no plan afterwards. If we vote to leave then what? How long till calls for a harder brexit, do we have another referendum? if we vote to stay how long will it take for calls for another in/out referendum?

Scotland, he will not get a majority and will need to sell the union to get into power, allowing the SNP to have a referendum whenever and however many times as they like, its just a matter of time till they leave, with Scottish SNP MP's leaving westminster conservatives would have majority and would leave the country in paralysis once again and we would have to have another election.

I'm not the biggest fan of Boris, he is a bit blunder-some but he is no fool, he is by far the better of two evils. Corbyns short rein in power would take us decades if not centuries to recover from, we are still paying the price from the last Labour government.

buggy_boy

Theophile wrote: »

Vote Tory.
Bring your own mattress though.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10510584/boy-sleeps-on-hospital-floor/


https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-nhs-nurse-left-lying-20973109

Do both of those not seem a bit faked?

I mean the boy in the hospital, surely if they have seen him and given him oxygen they could have provided a foam mat for the floor and a blanket?

The old lady, they moved her enough to get pillows etc under her and put coats on her but they are sat next to a front door, surely they could either move her inside in the warmth or provide a duvet of something rather than clearly not her coat?

Im not saying they are fake, but they both seem a bit staged..

westernpromise

Herzlos wrote: »

He's almost certainly talking about the movement to reclaim Palestine as part of Israel (and the subsequent eradication of the Palestinian people). Unless you've got any evidence to show that by "Zionist" he means something other than "Zionist".

In the sentence "Zionists, even when they've lived here all their lives, don't understand English irony", what does "Zionist" mean other than "yid"?

Herzlos

westernpromise wrote: »

In the sentence "Zionists, even when they've lived here all their lives, don't understand English irony", what does "Zionist" mean other than "yid"?

Read how he explains it himself:


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/24/corbyn-english-irony-video-reignites-antisemitism-row-labour