Things can only get better

badmemory

foxgloves said:

 that doesn't take into account all the people who will no longer be testing & who are symptomless or not bothered about going out & about with symptoms. 
F

this is what worries me.  How many people no longer feel obliged to tell their boss that they are positive as they can't afford the time off work, how many can no longer test themselves because the tests are no longer free.  The total crash in the number of people wearing masks in the supermarket etc.  There were more wearing masks in the mini supermarket than in the whole of the massive tescos.

RelievedSheff

badmemory said:

foxgloves said:

 that doesn't take into account all the people who will no longer be testing & who are symptomless or not bothered about going out & about with symptoms. 
F

this is what worries me.  How many people no longer feel obliged to tell their boss that they are positive as they can't afford the time off work, how many can no longer test themselves because the tests are no longer free.  The total crash in the number of people wearing masks in the supermarket etc.  There were more wearing masks in the mini supermarket than in the whole of the massive tescos.

It is a tough call because we do need more exposure to the virus to bolster our immune systems and make the effects less severe when we are exposed too it.

We have not had a change of policy yet where I work and the advice is to still self isolate if you have covid. But it will come that having covid is just the same as having a cold and if you are well enough to work you go into the office. 

badmemory

Well as Boris has said he wants to see the bodies piling high I suspect he is going to see it.  It will save them a fortune in care packages & pensions.  Pity about the under 10s with long covid affecting the rest of their lives, but then they don't count either.

RelievedSheff

Unfortunately we can't all sit around and not go out in case a small minority of vulnerable people are affected.

As a society we need to learn to live with Covid.

Now that might sound harsh but it is a harsh reality. As a country we cannot afford more lock downs, we cannot afford for people to not be at work and we cannot afford the costs of vaccinating the whole population every 6 months. 

In an average year 10k people will die from flu. Now the death toll from Covid is obviously higher than that over the last 2 years but that is purely because we had no immunity to the virus. As our immunity increases and our bodies recognise the virus and learn to fight it off then the number of deaths will reduce. If we are willing to accept 10k flu deaths a year is 10k covid deaths any different?

There will always be those who are more at risk from any virus or illness. That is an unfortunate truth. 

badmemory

Sorry SA to bring this whatever down onto your thread, didn't realise people actually felt quite this aggressive against those of us who don't want to catch it at all.  Well we live & learn.

beanielou

Wow, that's a tad harsh.
I dont choose to be in an at risk group & would much prefer not to be.
Until you walk in my shoes.........

-taff

RelievedSheff said:

. If we are willing to accept 10k flu deaths a year is 10k covid deaths any different?

Unortunately, it's been 183,579 deaths from covid over the last two years. Slightly higher than the 20k you're talking about.

Cherryfudge

One of the reasons flu deaths are so high is because we aren't all immunised, so the vulnerable die and of course there is the knock-on effect on hospitals: services are more stretched and I think it's possible that means an increase in deaths from other causes though I've not seen the figures.

Flu vaccines are available: because there are multiple strains of flu, some cases will arise among the vaccinated but those thousands of deaths every winter could be reduced. I never used to have a flu vaccine because I didn't consider myself high risk but now I do get it: what changed my mind was discovering that a colleague's teenage daughter was could die if she caught it.

I don't think we can use the regular deaths from flu as an excuse for ignoring them. They are hidden away in hospitals and we don't see them but that doesn't mean they are inevitable, just that we have got used to them and not questioned whether this huge grim statistic could be reduced. Similarly, over a hundred people are still dying with Covid every day in the UK. Two years ago we would have been horrified but now - if it's not someone we know - we just seem to accept it.

Yes, people have to die of something, but neither flu nor covid needs to be as big a killer as it is.

RelievedSheff

So what do you all suggest?

That we lock ourselves away forever?

RelievedSheff

Cherryfudge said:

One of the reasons flu deaths are so high is because we aren't all immunised, so the vulnerable die and of course there is the knock-on effect on hospitals: services are more stretched and I think it's possible that means an increase in deaths from other causes though I've not seen the figures.

Flu vaccines are available: because there are multiple strains of flu, some cases will arise among the vaccinated but those thousands of deaths every winter could be reduced. I never used to have a flu vaccine because I didn't consider myself high risk but now I do get it: what changed my mind was discovering that a colleague's teenage daughter was could die if she caught it.

I don't think we can use the regular deaths from flu as an excuse for ignoring them. They are hidden away in hospitals and we don't see them but that doesn't mean they are inevitable, just that we have got used to them and not questioned whether this huge grim statistic could be reduced. Similarly, over a hundred people are still dying with Covid every day in the UK. Two years ago we would have been horrified but now - if it's not someone we know - we just seem to accept it.

Yes, people have to die of something, but neither flu nor covid needs to be as big a killer as it is.

According to the official stats 1400 people a day on average die in the UK with the vast majority of those being from heart failure or stroke.

Far greater numbers than have died from Covid. 

Health care for lots of conditions has essentially been put on hold during the Covid pandemic which could well lead to a far greater number of deaths than Covid has been held responsible for.

Apologies for side tracking your Diary SA but this is a topic that clearly has lots of very differing opinions.