Public Sector Pay Restraint Ending?

economic

Windofchange wrote: »

So I as a public sector worker pay no tax? I don't lose 20% and then 40% of my pay packet to taxes that subsidise things within the UK economy?

You don't know what you are talking about as per usual. Public sector pay isn't set by supply and demand. Are you blind? 40,000 nursing posts unfilled at the moment (BBC via Royal College of Nursing)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-39913481/nhs-nursing-up-to-40000-posts-unfilled

Public sector pay is set by the government who have capped it at 1% for the past 7 years.

As for very low skill, again you are talking out of your !!!!. You are absolutely clueless. You think that all nurses do is wipe bottoms and serve lunch? Yet another post from yourself proving how narrow minded ignorant and selfish you are.

it is set by supply and demand - if wannabe nurses are not happy with the pay prospects then they dont nurse and if everyone thinks like this pay will have to go up.

ive had to go to hospital myself and also for a relative and not seen any problems with nursing, just like geatape experienced. so i have no reason to believe there is a severe shortage.

Windofchange

GreatApe wrote: »

I dont think I ever said that,

I know my local GP and hospital is quite good, I go maybe a dozen times a year to take my mother for various appointments and tests for a chronic condition. I have not had any bad experiences myself with either the GP or the hospital. I am not using that as evidence for things being perfect but it is sufficient for me to doubt claims of 'a flipping mess'.

As for nurses and teachers, what do you think the problem is? Just pay is too low so not interesting for work seekers? Maybe, but I know one teacher who is leaving this term to take a job that in all likelihood will pay about 2/3rds as much. I also know a chap that went from industry to teaching and then back to industry a couple of years later just did not take to it. My guess is teaching has a high turnover rate. In fact my guess is almost every sector has a high turnover rate and thus you can find thousands of individuals stories of people leaving sector X whatever X might be.

In fact on the same theme could we not argue that the fast food sector is in a mess? So many people leave and there are always vacancies needing filling especially with good quality staff. What is the solution to the fast food workers? Is it comparable with what happens with nursing and nurses?

My mistake, it wasn't you, it was your partner in crime:

economic wrote: »

again when did i say nurses were not hard working? i never said that and you havent provided any proof.

if these shortages of nurses were really a problem, it would be a public outrage and we would be hearing constantly. dont listen to everything u read in the papers, their only purpose is to sell papers even if it over exagarates the problem.

So, over to economic. It seems that just maybe I am right?

economic

i was in the banking industry for a number of years earning about 100k. its a cut throat industy and especially now its a tough industry to stay in. a nurse is pretty much guranteed the job for life. thats one reason why nurses get paid 22k.

post tax my pay was 66k vs a nurse which is 18k which is really the only comparison that should be made. and rememebr a 100k gross salary even for london is quite a bit much higher then median/mean.

Windofchange

economic wrote: »

it is set by supply and demand - if wannabe nurses are not happy with the pay prospects then they dont nurse and if everyone thinks like this pay will have to go up.

ive had to go to hospital myself and also for a relative and not seen any problems with nursing, just like geatape experienced. so i have no reason to believe there is a severe shortage.

You are just incapable of being wrong aren't you? I went to hospital once and there were no problems.

How is the government imposing a 1% salary cap letting supply and demand set a price? Please, explain that to me. You can't. It is a salary cap so supply and demand can't come into it. It is an artificial cap on the market. I'll spell it out - hospitals can't pay what they want to attract nurses. It's capped. Do you understand?

Despite posting articles showing there is a shortage you just won't accept it. You see the world about as far as the end of your nose.

Windofchange

economic wrote: »

i was in the banking industry for a number of years earning about 100k. its a cut throat industy and especially now its a tough industry to stay in. a nurse is pretty much guranteed the job for life. thats one reason why nurses get paid 22k.

post tax my pay was 66k vs a nurse which is 18k which is really the only comparison that should be made. and rememebr a 100k gross salary even for london is quite a bit much higher then median/mean.

Good for you. My boss is a consultant orthopaedic surgeon and earns in the region of 125k perhaps with overtime. So, compare your salary to his. Post tax his pay is what, 75k? 80k? What's your point? He doesn't pay into the tax system and so public sector workers are just sponging off the private sector?

Get back to me with the below when you have digested the above.

1) How is supply and demand setting public sector pay with a 1% per annum pay cap?
2) How is it that public sector workers pay nothing into society and it's all supported by the private sector?
3) Expand on the quoted section above where you said there is no shortage of nurses, and if there was we'd have heard about it. Don't believe the news etc.

You are clueless.

economic

Windofchange wrote: »

Good for you. My boss is a consultant orthopaedic surgeon and earns in the region of 125k perhaps with overtime. So, compare your salary to his. Post tax his pay is what, 75k? 80k? What's your point? He doesn't pay into the tax system and so public sector workers are just sponging off the private sector?

Get back to me with the below when you have digested the above.

1) How is supply and demand setting public sector pay with a 1% per annum pay cap?
2) How is it that public sector workers pay nothing into society and it's all supported by the private sector?
3) Expand on the quoted section above where you said there is no shortage of nurses, and if there was we'd have heard about it. Don't believe the news etc.

You are clueless.

you get pay caps in private sector too - i had no pay rise for a good 4 years. it all depends on the company you work for. that doesnt mean wages are not set by supply and demand. if there really was a shortage of nurses then wages will rise to attract nurses.

i am not going to read something from the bbc and believe its true. i have learnt that reading articles from the media should not always be believed so i remain skeptical unless i see real hard evidence. that bbc article is just he said this she said this so who do i even believe??? its just a waste of time.

economic

i know i have posted many posts about the media being a waste of time. but just another example of how silly it is, i have seen so many constant articles on how trump many of which are about handshakes. bbc has become a pathetic media organisation:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-40525157/donald-trump-in-handshake-trouble-again

GreatApe

Windofchange wrote: »

So I as a public sector worker pay no tax? I don't lose 20% and then 40% of my pay packet to taxes that subsidise things within the UK economy?

You don't know what you are talking about as per usual. Public sector pay isn't set by supply and demand. Are you blind? 40,000 nursing posts unfilled at the moment (BBC via Royal College of Nursing)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-39913481/nhs-nursing-up-to-40000-posts-unfilled

Public sector pay is set by the government who have capped it at 1% for the past 7 years.

As for very low skill, again you are talking out of your !!!!. You are absolutely clueless. You think that all nurses do is wipe bottoms and serve lunch? Yet another post from yourself proving how narrow minded ignorant and selfish you are.

Why not take the politics out of this and have the average public sector pay equal to the average private sector pay (both employed and self employed)?

That way if you want to pay nurses more you can pick if you want to pay fire fighters or policemen less.

Right now that would mean you would need the public sector, all of them, to take a 3% pay cut. Thereafter the public and private sector can be linked.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40480766

What would your protests be for that?

GreatApe

Windofchange wrote: »

You are just incapable of being wrong aren't you? I went to hospital once and there were no problems.

How is the government imposing a 1% salary cap letting supply and demand set a price? Please, explain that to me. You can't. It is a salary cap so supply and demand can't come into it. It is an artificial cap on the market. I'll spell it out - hospitals can't pay what they want to attract nurses. It's capped. Do you understand?

Despite posting articles showing there is a shortage you just won't accept it. You see the world about as far as the end of your nose.

Arguably there is always a shortage in almost all sectors
Something like 700,000 jobs looking to be filled at any given point

GreatApe

Windofchange wrote: »

Good for you. My boss is a consultant orthopaedic surgeon and earns in the region of 125k perhaps with overtime. So, compare your salary to his. Post tax his pay is what, 75k? 80k? What's your point? He doesn't pay into the tax system and so public sector workers are just sponging off the private sector?

Get back to me with the below when you have digested the above.

1) How is supply and demand setting public sector pay with a 1% per annum pay cap?
2) How is it that public sector workers pay nothing into society and it's all supported by the private sector?
3) Expand on the quoted section above where you said there is no shortage of nurses, and if there was we'd have heard about it. Don't believe the news etc.

You are clueless.

What is your solution?

Pay them more? How much more? Is it fair to expand the pay gap between the public sector further from the private sector. It is already 3% to the advantage of the public sector, plus they probably have better job security too.

Lets assume you do want to pay them more, the actual question is do you want to do that from

higher taxes (which ones and what would the impact be)
more borrowing
divert money from elsewhere (where and what would the impact be)

just saying there is a nurse shortage is like crying wont someone think of the children!!!