Will Scotland become independent in the next 5 years?

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

International Law on rights to Self Determination ?

Not really, that's just slogan territory. Big national interests are at stake here and the machinations and propaganda of a small group of party fanatics won't overide those larger considerations.

beecher2

.string. wrote: »

Hi Shakey -. Unsurprised to note that you are proud of the SNP Neverendum obsession, but no, we do not all know that there will be another Neverindyref.

Rather the opposite really. Why on Earth should May agree to that?

As Bernard Ponsonby said tonight, because otherwise she would be precipitating a constitutional crisis.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

Not really, that's just slogan territory. Big national interests are at stake here and the machinations and propaganda of a small group of party fanatics won't overide those larger considerations.

Yes they do string. International law is clear that the right to national self-determination trumps internal constitutional concerns. Otherwise all multi-nation states, such at the UK, could become dictatorships of the majority nation.

There is no point where the UK government can restrict the right to self-determination of Scotland.

Hopefully it won't come to anything like that. But it really is time that you woke up to the fact that UN and international law don't bend to Westminster whims. It doesn't work like that.

.string.

You are both day dreaming. There is no way that May would agree to such a diversive event during a crucial negotiation which would damage the prospects of the UK including Scotland merely on the self seeking assertions of the SNP.

It cannot be assumed that Scots would vote for separation from the UK and a referendum at that time would inflict damage on Scots done by the obsessed SNP on the folk they pretend to represent.

In any case a delayed referendum is not the same as refusing self determination, not that I buy that self-important argument.

Don't expect the UK to march to the SNP Dirge.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

You are both day dreaming. There is no way that May would agree to such a diversive event during a crucial negotiation which would damage the prospects of the UK including Scotland merely on the self seeking assertions of the SNP.

It cannot be assumed that Scots would vote for separation from the UK and a referendum at that time would inflict damage on Scots done by the obsessed SNP on the folk they pretend to represent.

In any case a delayed referendum is not the same as refusing self determination, not that I buy that self-important argument.

Don't expect the UK to march to the SNP Dirge.

You want Scots voters to sit about for two years waiting until Scotland is out of the Single Market and or EU ? Something they didn't vote for incidentally. And only then will allow a second referendum ? I get it, we all do.

But what's in the UK interests regarding negotiations, and what is in Scotland's interests are not the same thing. Sturgeon will be acting in Scotland's interests which do not include leaving the Single Market/EU. Thus she will call a vote regardless most likely in 2018 causing the constitutional crisis beecher was referring to.

At least the Tories are starting to face the reality that there isn't really anything to do to stop one, and just the timing in question.

Although the British government could withhold the legal authority for a vote, it now appears focused on determining the date instead.

“It’s looking inevitable, I don’t think we’re in any position to stop it happening,” said one minister close to the discussions. Another person briefed on Downing Street’s thinking said: “ The debate is only going to be about the date.”

https://www.ft.com/content/3edbbc7e-04ea-11e7-ace0-1ce02ef0def9

.string.

The SNP can wait around for ever as far as I am concerned, and they should understand that what is in the interest of the SNP is self evidently not in the interest of all Scots. But of course they won't understand, preferring the politics of division.