Penalty fare - first time ever!!!

magyar

andygb wrote: »

The person in question (the latest email) has not even managed to look at the details yet, so she has not yet given any advice.
Advising me to pay without reading the facts is not in my opinion "giving advice".

I see what you mean, but I disagree. What they're advising is "we haven't had time to read this yet, but we know that if you win you'll get the money back, whereas if you lose, you'll suffer an admin fee if you don't pay up." - that is advice in my opinion.

My personal advice above was not to pay the fine, but then again I *have* read the facts. I'm also not an industry expert :-)

Quentin

andygb wrote: »

Have you read my original post, and the facts?
Why on earth should my case fail?

It may or may not, but if you pay now you avoid any possibility of further admin fees getting added.

wealdroam

andygb wrote: »

The person in question (the latest email) has not even managed to look at the details yet, so she has not yet given any advice.
Advising me to pay without reading the facts is not in my opinion "giving advice".

Well if you can't recognise advice when it is given, I'll not bother.

nimbo

Most stations I travel through that have barriers have a stand where a ticket can be bought on the side of the tracks so there is no need to try to get through the barriers - prior to purchasing a ticket. The queues can be long when there is a broken hand held machine on a train though.

I realise I'm Yorskhire and this may not be the case everywhere - it can be really confusing as the one at Leeds is miles away from the barriers and only really evident to people arriving on platforms across the bridge from the higher numbered platforms.

Is there a chance this is the a we at the station in question?

Good luck with your appeal.

andygb

nimbo wrote: »

Most stations I travel through that have barriers have a stand where a ticket can be bought on the side of the tracks so there is no need to try to get through the barriers - prior to purchasing a ticket. The queues can be long when there is a broken hand held machine on a train though.

I realise I'm Yorskhire and this may not be the case everywhere - it can be really confusing as the one at Leeds is miles away from the barriers and only really evident to people arriving on platforms across the bridge from the higher numbered platforms.

Is there a chance this is the a we at the station in question?

Good luck with your appeal.

My station (the point of departure), has never had a ticket machine in the 25 years I have lived here. The permit to travel machine has now been out of order for at least nine weeks. There are two or three other stations on this line which have the same setup.
The destination station does not have a ticket machine trackside of the barriers, only out side the barriers where there is a ticket office and machines.
Conductors SHOULD make themselves available to sell tickets to passengers because of the situation with some of the stations, but some conductors decide to stay inside their cab rather than do their job.
The regular station staff at the destination stations are aware of the situation with ticketing and my station and let us purchase tickets from the ticket office (which I have done on several occasions in the past).
The revenue inspectors are a different breed entirely and refuse to listen to any explanation.:(

SirFreddy

andygb
Have a look at railforums.co.uk Then go to the fares dispute section.
They have some professional 'fare advisors' who could help you

andygb

SirFreddy wrote: »

andygb
Have a look at railforums.co.uk Then go to the fares dispute section.
They have some professional 'fare advisors' who could help you

Thanks, I will have a look at that now.

Manxman_in_exile

I've never been in this situation but I can understand why the OP refused to pay the penalty fare.


However, my understanding is that if the revenue protection officers on the platform don't accept your reason for not having a valid ticket, then the best advice is to pay the penalty and then appeal against it.


By not paying in the first instance it can become much more expensive and some train companies apparently may choose to see this as "evidence" of intent to avoid the fare. I presume you did eventually buy a ticket?


Of course, if you're confident you've got a good case for not having a ticket you should succeed any way.

magyar

Can I just check whether at any point you've actually paid the right fare yet?

What is entirely reasonable in my view is to write and offer to pay the full fare due, rather than the penalty fare.

This then negates the argument of someone who was trying to avoid paying. Ultimately, if you pay the penalty and they refuse to refund it, small claims court is your only solution. The other way round, it's their only solution. Bottom line is how much do you care about the principle of winning this?

andygb

magyar wrote: »

Can I just check whether at any point you've actually paid the right fare yet?

What is entirely reasonable in my view is to write and offer to pay the full fare due, rather than the penalty fare.

This then negates the argument of someone who was trying to avoid paying. Ultimately, if you pay the penalty and they refuse to refund it, small claims court is your only solution. The other way round, it's their only solution. Bottom line is how much do you care about the principle of winning this?

I actually offered to pay the fare in my original letter to them, but they chose not to answer that or any of the other points which I made.
I am afraid that if I pay the penalty fare, they will somehow manage to get out of refunding it to me, and I just think that would be akin to robbery.