The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

.string.

What we're seeing us, actually, is the development of a Fake News story which is being put about by the SNP in order to raise the whingeing level and try to grabble back the votes of Fishermen. If anyone is using them as pawns, it is the SNP. The same as the crocodile tears shed over immegrants living in Scotland.

The other one was about Scotland being excluded from Brexit negotiations. Pure underhanded misrepresentation, but a planned misrepresentation following the SNP tactic of asking for something they knew was not sensible and whining when it did not happen. Do they really still expect any but the most thistled to be conned by that worn-out trick?

When Sturgeon demanded that she be present at the table, she knew full well that she would not be part of the front-row negotiation team; bug then nor will a representative from Wessex, let alone London. I can barely supress the insult I feel to my regional nationality.

It has been stated, as far as I know, that the Devolved Administrations will be kept apprised of progress. Sturgeon will, of course, take that as an opportunity to leak all, and only, negative news. I see it as an opportunity to catch her telling porkies.

Shakethedisease

Yah_Boo_Sux wrote: »

One democratically governed?
See the post above.


Show me which of the 27 remaining EU countries are getting a say in Brexit talks?
You see, the head of government speaks for the whole UK just as the designated negotiator supposedly speaks for the whole EU in negotiations following Article 50 being put forward.

Think of it as akin to a small, two-seat table & chairs. It is not appropriate for large, extended families.

Go and have a read of the Brexit thread and you'll find that the most ardent Brexiteers are constantly going on about how individual EU nations will influence what kind of deal the UK gets due to separate countries having very different interests to protect.

Are you saying on this thread that this won't happen ? Just so I can copy and paste it over for Conrad and others to read and discuss.

Shakethedisease

Shaka_Zulu wrote: »

For the same reason they are not commenting on the right to remain.

One holds ones cards as close to your chest before they need to be played.

Quite simple.

But fishing isn't supposed to be a card. That's the point. The fishermen were told they wouldn't be, that's why many of them voted Leave in the first place. They don't want 12 miles of fishing waters, they want 200.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

So this never happened?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-38670128

In January, pre-article 50, allegedly!

Neither Wales, Scotland nor NI were happy about any of those talks and the lack of information they got during them. They were told and informed of nothing. Not even the Brexit triggering date. None of them were.

Scottish government 'not told' about Article 50 date

Mr Russell, who is a member of the Joint Ministerial Committee (JMC) on EU negotiations, tweeted: "Thank you @BBCNews for letting JMC members like me know that #Article50 is to be triggered next week".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39331244

In the United Kingdom, the Joint Ministerial Committee (JMC), (Welsh: Y Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion), is a consultative body established by a memorandum of understanding between the UK Government and devolved administrations in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. The JMC seeks to act as a focus for the coordination of the relationships between these administrations.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

What we're seeing us, actually, is the development of a Fake News story which is being put about by the SNP in order to raise the whingeing level and try to grabble back the votes of Fishermen. If anyone is using them as pawns, it is the SNP. The same as the crocodile tears shed over immegrants living in Scotland.

The story is in the Telegraph. The SNP have nothing to do with it. So your 'Fake news' is falling a little bit flat there.

The other one was about Scotland being excluded from Brexit negotiations. Pure underhanded misrepresentation, but a planned misrepresentation following the SNP tactic of asking for something they knew was not sensible and whining when it did not happen. Do they really still expect any but the most thistled to be conned by that worn-out trick?

When Sturgeon demanded that she be present at the table, she knew full well that she would not be part of the front-row negotiation team; bug then nor will a representative from Wessex, let alone London. I can barely supress the insult I feel to my regional nationality.

It has been stated, as far as I know, that the Devolved Administrations will be kept apprised of progress. Sturgeon will, of course, take that as an opportunity to leak all, and only, negative news. I see it as an opportunity to catch her telling porkies

The devolved administrations aren't being kept well informed of progress. Nor is Westminster. I have no idea what the rest of your post is about.

kabayiri

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

So because the Conservatives said nothing about fishing in their manifesto means that it's now a certainty that they're bargaining away fishing rights? Is that what you're saying?
...

Maybe the SNP are phishing for details about fishing?

Yah_Boo_Sux

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Go and have a read of the Brexit thread and you'll find that the most ardent Brexiteers are constantly going on about how individual EU nations will influence what kind of deal the UK gets due to separate countries having very different interests to protect.

Are you saying on this thread that this won't happen ? Just so I can copy and paste it over for Conrad and others to read and discuss.

Show me where I say that EU nations will not influence what kind of deal the UK gets?
As usual it looks like you are twisting what has been said.

So, I remind you by highlighting the relevant part of what you quote above and repeat it here: "the head of government speaks for the whole UK just as the designated negotiator supposedly speaks for the whole EU".

There is a vast difference between influencing and negotiating. If you are as unsure as your post suggests then I recommend the use of a dictionary.


Are you ignoring too that the remaining EU27 must vote on a Brexit agreement? Is that not influence, then?

BTW, you may if you wish copy and paste this for "Conrad and others to read and discuss". I'm sure they too will chuckle at your (failed) devious attempts at distortion.

A_Pict_In_A_Past_Life

Shakethedisease wrote: »

The story is in the Telegraph. The SNP have nothing to do with it. So your 'Fake news' is falling a little bit flat there.

Maybe it's interpretation that is falling a little bit flat, because the Telegraph also very clearly says

Owen Paterson, the former Conservative Environment secretary, said he interpreted the manifesto as committing the UK to taking control of waters up to 200 miles from the coast. He told The Daily Telegraph: “I am delighted to see it confirmed that we will have a modern fishing policy that will have an EEZ 200 miles off the coastline.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/19/theresa-may-could-waive-rights-95-per-cent-british-waters-brexit/

And

A Tory party spokesman admitted that ........... Following our departure from the EU, the UK will be an independent coastal state and subject to international law on fisheries management. “This includes the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea

the convention being mentioned earlier in the report saying

the 200-mile zone, agreed under a United Nations convention in 1982

See?
It's all there, you just have to read it. Even if the Telegraph are trying to muddy the waters, so to speak.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

1 The story is in the Telegraph. The SNP have nothing to do with it. So your 'Fake news' is falling a little bit flat there.

2 The devolved administrations aren't being kept well informed of progress. Nor is Westminster. I have no idea what the rest of your post is about.

My numbering:

On 1 No - that is you/SNP jumping on any possible ambiguity/clumsy wording or inuendo and building a whingeing mountain out of it. Fake news generation.

On 2. Don't believe you - the SNP has already spent too much time claiming that no discussions had taken place between the UK Government and themselves when we know there had been some. We will see how things progress as time goes on.

You know perfectly well what I mean, the point has been made many times in different contexts.

.string.

@Shajey - in spite of the amount of time you spend griping about Westminster you seem to have forgotten that it exists.

Let me explain.

Westminster is where matters that are not devolved are debated, policies developed and actions taken.

All of us vote for MPs who go there and do that job. They get to debate things and have their say. Their number and where they come from is fairly well proportionate to the number of folks in their local community, give or take variance in electoral seat size.

So Scotland, like all parts of the UK, gets to join in that process and is as well represented as any other part of the UK. In the case of Brexit Parliament is going to be informed and will get to vote on issues along the way and on the final outcome.

It's a different system to the EU but there also the eventual vote will be done by the countries across the EU on the basis of a qualifued majority weighting system and in the European Parliament also related to population.

The devolved Assemblies, on the other hand, take care of the devolved issues.

Different strokes for different folks and different responsibilities.

So what the blee#@ng heck are you moaning about.