The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

We all want clarity from our strong and stable PM. And she needs to give the Scottish Govt a straight answer, vague wavy hands stuff about public consent and when Brexit is 'played out' isn't enough clarity for anyone.

You really have to understand that people don't dance to your tune.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

No.

It's using the same precedent that you use when you feel you can ignore the result of 2014, to use the same argument against you "things change in a democracy".

If the Scottish electorate by majority share reject pro-independence parties, then there can be no appetite for what you seek. Simples.

None of the parties in Scotland apart from the Tories are standing on ONLY an anti-independence or pro-independence basis. Therefore you cannot know whether people are voting Labour or Lib Dems solely due to their current anti-indy stances or because of something else. The same in the other direction. For example.. with the Greens only standing in three seats and Labour confirming they want to keep Trident you can't ascribe votes for the SNP solely on an independence basis, because there will be a lot of left leaning voters who will be voting for them based on their anti-Trident policies rather than independence.

You're trying to lump 3 very different policial parties together and call it THE anti-independence party. Things are far more complicated than that and the independence question isn't being asked in any case.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

You really have to understand that people don't dance to your tune.

Yes, I know. But it doesn't alter the fact that after June 8th, the Scottish Parliament is going to be asking for a clear and straight answer. I guess if they don't get one they'll have to start preparing for an independence based election or a few court cases over the next 18 months.

Theresa May doesn't have to dance to the the Scottish Govt's tune no, but she should be prepared that they in turn aren't going to be boogieing along to hers either. And they have been clear and straight about that.

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

None of the parties in Scotland apart from the Tories are standing on ONLY an anti-independence or pro-independence basis. Therefore you cannot know whether people are voting Labour or Lib Dems solely due to their current anti-indy stances or because of something else. The same in the other direction. For example.. with the Greens only standing in three seats and Labour confirming they want to keep Trident you can't ascribe votes for the SNP solely on an independence basis, because there will be a lot of left leaning voters who will be voting for them based on their anti-Trident policies rather than independence.

You're trying to lump 3 very different policial parties together and call it THE anti-independence party. Things are far more complicated than that and the independence question isn't being asked in any case.

So the Lib Dem's and Labour are pro-independence are they, or maybe neutral?

Haha

You are funny sometimes.

Due to the fact that the SNP and Greens are openly pro-independence, any vote that isn't for them can be considered a vote that is not for independence.

.string.

It is ironic for someone who has avoided answering questions for so long to get upset when they don't get the answer fhey want.

It's been said many times but some people won't take "not now' for an answer.

I look forward to reading.

"We have been very clear that now is not the time for another referendum on independence. In order for a referendum to be fair, legal and decisive, it cannot take place until the Brexit process has played out and it should not take place unless there is public consent for it to happen. This is a time to pull together, not apart."

or something along those lines.

cogito

Shakethedisease wrote: »

A really bad Brexit.

Still making it up as you go along.

IveSeenTheLight

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

No.

It's using the same precedent that you use when you feel you can ignore the result of 2014, to use the same argument against you "things change in a democracy".

If the Scottish electorate by majority share reject pro-independence parties, then there can be no appetite for what you seek. Simples.

Clutching at straws there.

I accepted the 2014 result. I moved on.
The democratic position was set and hugely based on remaining in the EU

The 2016 referendum significantly changed the situation and Scotland is now being withdrawn from the Eu, putting the 2014 referendum result in question.

We've seen, very staunch anti SNP, pro remain posters in here vehemently state they are now voting for the most pro Indy party as they now want Independence.

I don't know what the issue is, if the consideration is that the electorate of Scotland would reject Independence, let the question be asked and accept the decision with the new position we are in now.

.string.

cogito wrote: »

Still making it up as you go along.

The SNP would like nothing more than a really bad Brexit. Anything that damages the Union, they calculate, is advantageous to their obsession.

So actually I don't think Shakey is making anything up, she is merely expressing an SNP policy.

.string.

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

Clutching at straws there.

I accepted the 2014 result. I moved on.
The democratic position was set and hugely based on remaining in the EU

The 2016 referendum significantly changed the situation and Scotland is now being withdrawn from the Eu, putting the 2014 referendum result in question.

We've seen, very staunch anti SNP, pro remain posters in here vehemently state they are now voting for the most pro Indy party as they now want Independence.

I don't know what the issue is, if the consideration is that the electorate of Scotland would reject Independence, let the question be asked and accept the decision with the new position we are in now.

Now is not the time.

IveSeenTheLight

.string. wrote: »

Now is not the time.

Accepted.
Can it be set for when the outcome of Brexit is known?

Or is TM hoping she can procrastinate long enough for some other reason to delay the democratic will of the elected MSPs?

[edit]
Now is not the time as "Better together" can't use the same scaremongering tactics as 2014
[/edit]