If we vote for Brexit what happens

LHW99

Since you raise the matter, 'thick', as commonly used, is the converse of clever and relates to IQ.

And as commonly used is in error.

IQ is an outmoded measure, which is generally now derided, mainly because of it being used inappropriately in the media and being transferred to general useage. IQ was conceived as a measure of an ability to think abstractly, and pass exams, which in the days when it was invented was regarded as being a sign of "intelligence" because only a minority of people would receive the opportunity for that kind of education, so if they weren't rich enough to pay for private education, the State needed to be sure they only picked the few that they could be sure would learn anything using maily written text. After all, most would be leaving school at 14!

A few tests were developed later that defined other types of "intelligence", such as pictorial or numerical, but as far as I am aware, none encompassed skills such as common sense, or problem solving.

A true "intelligence quotient" should probably test all of these aspects, and a few more, but still would probably not cover making the "right decision" - when judged by someone whose life experiences and general philosophy were completely different.

BobQ

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Brown and Blair set the bar in 1997. Spin, deceit and lies. Net result is that many people are only interested in themselves not others. Don't like something. Complain endlessly or take legal action (using crowdfunding) . Wasting huge sums of resource, money and time. There's no respect for anything.

Life goes in cycles. Perhaps we are heading to the next one. As people are waking up to reality. Rather than sleepwalking into a nightmare.

I agree that Blair used spin effectively and that it is part of the reason why there is mistrust of politicians. But he did not invent spin. Like so many of our worst developments, spin came to us courtesy of the US.

Thatcher was not averse to spin, something she probably imported from President Reagan - remember his man Donald Regan - who learned from another master Richard Nixon. Then you have the techniques of Joseph Goebels. A lot of it came from the application of emerging marketing techniques to politics. Orwell highlighted the potential of manipulating the message. What was the Zinoviev Letter if it was not spin.

Spin has been around for years but the mass media and social media are now making it easier to do and easier to uncover. Would you say that we are not being subjected to spin today?

prosaver

EU referendum: £9m cost of taxpayer-funded leaflet warning about the 'damage' of Brexit angers Eurosceptics.

ref :http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/06/eu-referendum-taxpayers-to-fund 9m-leaflet-to-every-home-warning/

And they still lost ..must of been one hellava case to leave.

Seven key points from a major report on how the Government bungled the Brexit referendum (walesonline.co.uk)
submitted 11 hours ago by ajehals
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[–]TwixLighter 6 points 10 hours ago
Uncertainty and the unknown was what part of the Remain campaign focused on.
If Cameron had actually ordered a report that reduced uncertainty and objectively laid out how things would be expected to proceed from a rational perspective it would have eaten into the Remain's campaign.
Cameron not preparing as such was a campaign strategy to fuel uncertainty and to present Remain as the safer option. There was a reason why Osborne talked about immediate punishment budgets. He knew that if he'd said there'd be no big changes, Article 50 wouldn't be triggered until the UK had its ducks in a row (even if it took 9 months) by which time the stock markets would have recovered, that there'd be a two year process thereafter and then a transitional and phased introduction period but that we'd be out in time for the 2020 general election where people can decide again what to do with the newly repatriated powers - that it would play almost universally into the Leave campaign's hands.

gfplux

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

Why?
Do the recent posts (quite numerous too) suggesting that this - even if it DOES become a "problem" - will not lead to the disruption that some predict not ease that concern?

Do you not even see the "fishing" from business just dreaming of luring some of The City's business?

Problems will inevitably arise.
However, one certainty is that life will continue.
In reality little of great consequence is likely to change much.

An aggressive keyboard person like you clearly shows in so many of your (numerous x numerous) postings that you are very angry when someone posts a view you don't agree with. I may be mistaken but you appear to want to shut down any one who has a different point of view to you. That puts you in my opinion in the bully boy category.

Why don't you try to calm yourself and not reply in such an aggressive way.

A_Medium_Size_Jock

gfplux wrote: »

An aggressive keyboard person like you clearly shows in so many of your (numerous x numerous) postings that you are very angry when someone posts a view you don't agree with. I may be mistaken but you appear to want to shut down any one who has a different point of view to you. That puts you in my opinion in the bully boy category.

Why don't you try to calm yourself and not reply in such an aggressive way.

Oh cease the argumentative diatribes and stick to debate please?
There was nothing at all "aggressive" about that post.
Attempting to describe me as a "bully" is in fact bullying from yourself since I go on in that post to say, very clearly, "problems will inevitably arise".
Is that not then accepting (at least partially) your prior post?
As for "angry" and "aggressive" I must say that - given your quoted post particularly - it is clear that this terminology applies far more to you than it does to me.

You will not bully me into silence just because I disagree with your continued deceit and/or your point of view and supply valid responses.
I request therefore that you moderate your tone and attempt to debate the subject and not the poster (myself)..

tracey3596

gfplux wrote: »

An aggressive keyboard person like you clearly shows in so many of your (numerous x numerous) postings that you are very angry when someone posts a view you don't agree with. I may be mistaken but you appear to want to shut down any one who has a different point of view to you. That puts you in my opinion in the bully boy category.

Why don't you try to calm yourself and not reply in such an aggressive way.

It looks to me like you just want to argue.
I see nothing untoward in the post you refer to, just debate.
Which is what the forum is about, no?

In report this morning the UK is seeing the strongest growth in export seen since 2014.
Tempered please note with uncertainty about the future.
Well, when was the future ever certain?

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-economy-idUKKBN17E2XM

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

tracey3596 wrote: »

In report this morning the UK is seeing the strongest growth in export seen since 2014.

Well technically it was manufacturing exports, not all exports.

Which is mildly interesting but it's also of little relevance.

UK manufacturing is trivial and manufacturing exports even more trivial, by comparison to the 70%+ of the economy that is services.

And the UK consumer is already being squeezed by rising inflation and falling real terms wages - not to mention almost the entire economic performance since the Brexit vote has been thanks to a near record increase in personal debt - up almost 10% in the last 12 months - and the savings rate falling to 50 year lows.

That can't last and won't last.

tracey3596

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Well technically it was manufacturing exports, not all exports.

Which is mildly interesting but it's also of little relevance.

UK manufacturing is trivial and manufacturing exports even more trivial, by comparison to the 70%+ of the economy that is services.

Oh.
Did you not read my link then?
Because it clearly says in there.

and the services sector also recovered to rack up its strongest sales growth since last June's Brexit vote,

TrickyTree83

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Well technically it was manufacturing exports, not all exports.

Which is mildly interesting but it's also of little relevance.

UK manufacturing is trivial and manufacturing exports even more trivial, by comparison to the 70%+ of the economy that is services.

And the UK consumer is already being squeezed by rising inflation and falling real terms wages - not to mention almost the entire economic performance since the Brexit vote has been thanks to a near record increase in personal debt - up almost 10% in the last 12 months - and the savings rate falling to 50 year lows.

That can't last and won't last.

https://www2.deloitte.com/in/en/pages/manufacturing/articles/global-manufacturing-competitiveness-index.html

Government paper

Trivial?

Looks like you're confusing UK manufacturing with your knowledge on the subject.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

Trivial?

Yes - Trivial.

Services are 78% of UK GDP.

Manufacturing is 10% of UK GDP.

Manufacturing exports are around 4.5% of UK GDP.