Stay for the kids?

duchy

mumps wrote: »

He is out of the house travelling and working 12 hrs per day. She has two school age children. What can she be doing for 12 hrs a day, housework doesn't take that much time and with school age children how many night time wake ups are there? I can't for the life of me see why she would need a cleaner. Cleaning your own bathroom doesn't sound like it's that big a deal. If she is really working in the home for 60 hrs a week plus what he does in the evening and weekend what difference is 2 hrs cleaning going to make?

I don't see a cleaner as the answer either
I think his wife feeling unappreciated and not respected as an equal partner has a lot more to do with it.

(If my fiance told me he wanted me to apologize I'd he explaining to him I'm an adult woman in an equal partnership not a naughty child and I expect to be treated as such. )

I asked whose idea the apology was - the OP didn't respond so I'm left wondering if the idea came from his mother ....or if he and his siblings have always apologized to her to keep the peace whilst growing up )

mumps

duchy wrote: »

I don't see a cleaner as the answer either
I think his wife feeling unappreciated and not respected as an equal partner has a lot more to do with it.

(If my fiance told me he wanted me to apologize I'd he explaining to him I'm an adult woman in an equal partnership not a naughty child and I expect to be treated as such. )

I asked whose idea the apology was - the OP didn't respond so I'm left wondering if the idea came from his mother ....or if he and his siblings have always apologized to her to keep the peace whilst growing up )

On the other hand if my husband told me I couldn't visit my parents with our children I would be explaining that they weren't his property.

I think it is hard to know who is in the right with this one.

duchy

mumps wrote: »

On the other hand if my husband told me I couldn't visit my parents with our children I would be explaining that they weren't his property.

I think it is hard to know who is in the right with this one.

Well neither of them should be "telliing" in an equal partnership anyway but discussing as equals. I do think the MH issue makes it more difficult as the OP is "used to" his Mum and her bipolar behaviours whereas his wife didn't grow up with it and probably doesn't really want the kids to either . To most families it isn't such a huge ask for grandparents to behave appropriately around the grandchildren but with bipolar in the mix- maybe it is.

I don't think the OP and his wife are ever going to agree 100% on the grandparents seeing the children - but understanding each other's concerns and negotiating til they find some common ground would be better . The fact the OP's wife has agreed to meeting up with the GPs as a family again is a really positive step though. I get the feeling she thinks her husband is likely to give in to family pressure and leave the children alone with his parents even though he doesn't feel it's right either. Sometimes it's very hard to say no to a parent - especially with the Bipolar aspect as well.

mumps

duchy wrote: »

Well neither of them should be "telliing" in an equal partnership anyway but discussing as equals. I do think the MH issue makes it more difficult as the OP is "used to" his Mum and her bipolar behaviours whereas his wife didn't grow up with it and probably doesn't really want the kids to either . To most families it isn't such a huge ask for grandparents to behave appropriately around the grandchildren but with bipolar in the mix- maybe it is.

I don't think the OP and his wife are ever going to agree 100% on the grandparents seeing the children - but understanding each other's concerns and negotiating til they find some common ground would be better . The fact the OP's wife has agreed to meeting up with the GPs as a family again is a really positive step though. I get the feeling she thinks her husband is likely to give in to family pressure and leave the children alone with his parents even though he doesn't feel it's right either. Sometimes it's very hard to say no to a parent - especially with the Bipolar aspect as well.

I know someone with bipolar, he takes meds and is generally fine, you can tell if he is heading for an episode and it is normally because he hasn't taken his med or is under stress for some reason. Even when he isn't well I would be happy for my grandchildren to see him, he isn't dangerous or scary.

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

If my OH's dad shouted at me over anything, there's no way I'd risk my kids being exposed to that verbal aggression, never mind a lady who heard voices and gives far too much thought to ways of murdering people. There's being PC and then there's a person being around your children, outside your protection.

Then add on the being solely responsible for them almost until they're in bed. She's always looked after them whilst you've always worked - it's hard to let go to somebody who hasn't done as much with them.


If you leave rather than keep trying to mend things between you and her, you might find that she's angry she's been left, but it's not really that much different in her mind to how it's always been - and contact might very well become an issue; how well do you think a social worker dealing with assessing the needs of the kids will take a conversation where she's subjected to a discussion of five different ways to murder somebody in half an hour? Or where the kids say 'when they stayed, Granddad started shouting at Mummy'?

mumps

Jojo_the_Tightfisted wrote: »

If my OH's dad shouted at me over anything, there's no way I'd risk my kids being exposed to that verbal aggression, never mind a lady who heard voices and gives far too much thought to ways of murdering people. There's being PC and then there's a person being around your children, outside your protection.

Then add on the being solely responsible for them almost until they're in bed. She's always looked after them whilst you've always worked - it's hard to let go to somebody who hasn't done as much with them.


If you leave rather than keep trying to mend things between you and her, you might find that she's angry she's been left, but it's not really that much different in her mind to how it's always been - and contact might very well become an issue; how well do you think a social worker dealing with assessing the needs of the kids will take a conversation where she's subjected to a discussion of five different ways to murder somebody in half an hour? Or where the kids say 'when they stayed, Granddad started shouting at Mummy'?

If mummy hadn't had a go at granny and granddad about hygiene maybe he wouldn't have shouted.

I've worked with social workers, they know about bipolar, people with bipolar don't have their kids taken into care just because they are bipolar so I can't imagine it would be a problem if daddy takes them to see grandparents.

Of course mummy will have to get used to not being in charge of everything, maybe she could even get a job and have other things to think about rather than telling her mother in law what she is permitted to talk to her own siblings about.

I think if the mother in law was behaving like the daughter in law is people would be up in arms. I love all the indignation when people thought it was the in laws critising the OPs wife but when he explained it was the other way round it all went quiet.

paddy's_mum

mumps wrote: »

rather than telling her mother in law what she is permitted to talk to her own siblings about.

I agree with much of what you say but on the other hand, to have one's private business broadcast by your parents in law and spread around the larger family when there are already problems in the (younger) marriage is hardly going to reassure the wife/mother that her position is being considered and respected.

Who would enjoy discovering that they are the target of perhaps ill-informed gossip when (and here I confess I make an assumption) they have little opportunity to rebut what is being said?

If the wife is somewhat insecure to start with, how is knowing that they are taking sides against her going to soothe things?

I think it an intelligent guess that this has indeed gone on or else how would the OP be able to state that his wife wanted the in-laws to promise not to do so (again)?

I have personally been on the receiving end of unpleasant and malicious comments and it is my experience that unfortunately, by the time the 'accuser' realises that their assumptions and accusations were completely baseless and without honour, it is too late and the damage has been done.

seven-day-weekend

I think they should all behave like responsible adults and set an example to those children. Shouting at someone is not doing that, neither is talking to them about ways to murder people, neither is denying them their grandparents' company and neither is wanting to brush it all under the carpet.

quarky

It was actually my step-Dad's suggestion to apologise all round. After the reconciliation meeting where things didn't go quite so well, I said to my parents that "well, we have done what we can, and I am pretty much out of idea's to move forward now, and just get all of this behind us, so do you have any suggestions?". At that point, he suggested general apologies all around.


Mumps, she is busy I work from home occasionally too and can see it. Sure, it could be that she is just busier while I am there (if she wasn't, I might goof of a little more too), but actually, there is always stuff to do. Once the kids are at school and the dog is walked, that is often 1030-1100. Then there might be shopping, helping out at school, tidying, washing, ironing, gardening (not so much in winter though), as well as all of the other less frequent but seasonal stuff. In terms of getting a job etc. I have no doubt that it would be a lot harder for her in many ways if I left (of course I would think that though) and I don't want to leave, because of the effects on the kids, and because I think overall, things would be worse all around. Sometimes though, in those selfish moments, the thought is almost appealing though just to say goodbye to the whole lot of them (well, not my kids!).


Paddy's Mum, yes, there has been a lot of talk already. Some of my uncles/aunties don't seem to want to have anything to do with me/us, which is a shame. On one hand, I am angry with them (they have never actually spoken to me about what the issues are) and on the other hand, if they are so quick to judge, perhaps it is for the best. But I don't want it to get worse with the parts of my family that are still talking to me


Seven-Day-Weekend, thanks. Yes none of us have covered ourselves in glory, and I think there have been mistakes all around. I think the "correct" answer here though is that my wife and I were fine before my parents came back, so that is what I should be thinking about in terms of a solution.. It is difficult though not to feel torn in different directions..

LannieDuck

OP, I hope you don't mind me saying that your parents do sound very difficult.

By your own admission, they overstayed their welcome and it was 'very stressful'. Remember that, while you were out of the house at work Mon-Fri, your wife will have been in the house with them nearly 24/7 (assuming they weren't out doing things every day...). And relations with the in-laws can be difficult at the best of times. If it was stressful for you, it would have been double or triple the amount of stress for her.

You also don't know how your parents treated your wife while you weren't around. Did they try to tell her how to parent? Did they try and sneak things to the kids that she disapproved of?

And then your Mother 'almost demanded' to see the children. I'm on excellent terms with my in-laws, and they've never once demanded to take the children anywhere. They've suggested and offered, but have never assumed that it's their right to do so. It would certainly put my back up if they did.

You said right back at the start that she thinks you're lazy. There's been a lot of chat about what you think you should be doing and what the posters on here think is a reasonable amount for you to be doing. But may I ask what she thinks you should be doing?

Also, bear in mind that housework can be soul-destroyingly tedious. It never seems to end and it's the same things day after day. Other people make mess and you clear it up. If you've chosen to be a SAHM and take on the lion's share of the chores, that's one thing. But when someone asked you earlier in the thread whether your wife was happy in her role as homemaker, I don't believe you ever answered.