New Alcohol self help

lewt

feelinggood wrote: »

Can I ask a question about Steps 8 & 9?

How does one go about making ammends when they can't remember how they harmed someone?

At my worst time, I know I did a lot wrong. I can't remember much of it though, and I know the people I hurt deserve more than a vague "I'm sorry". I don't want to dredge up bad feelings by asking them what I did, but I want to apologise and move on.

Any ideas what I can do? And any advice on how to deal with the fact that most people can't forgive?

Challenging day tomorrow - I'm going to a funeral. Its the first big social gathering since I've been pretty ill, and I know there will be a lot of food and drink on offer. One challenge after another!

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Dont mean to be blunt feelie, buit its best to not think about these untill you have done the steps that lead up to it.

At the moment if you have not got a sponsier i would try not to think about it, i know that is hard to do however this is where the keep it in the day comes in, it worked for me anyway.

if you have a big book read from page 76, thrid paragrag, thi talks about ammends. i personlally use a script which i posted on here back in nov "lewt's amends" i use that most of the time espiacally if its a resentment im making ammends for. i have found it works. but it is like anna said its about being willing to do so.

after i had done step 4 and 5 i was more than willing to do 6.7.8 and nine. its like walking up normal stairs you dont try and jump up to the top as you would never make it and fall down....

just looking at y book now and reading the promises fro step 9 and the bottom of page 86
If we are painstaking about this phase of our development,
we will be amazed before we are half way through.
We are going to know a new freedom
and a new happiness.
We will not regret the past
nor wish to shut the door on it.
We will comprehend the word serenity and
we will know peace.
No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experience can benefit others.
That feeling of uselessness (will disappear)
and self-pity will disappear.
We will lose interest in selfish things and
(We will) gain interest in our fellows.
Self-seeking will slip away.
Our whole attitude and outlook upon life will change.
Fear of people (will leave us) and
(fear) of economic insecurity will leave us.
We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us.
We will suddenly realize that God is doing for us what we could not do for ourselves.
Are these extravagant promises? We think not. They are being fulfilled among us—sometimes quickly, sometimes slowly.
They will always materialize if we work for them.

i have found these to be true and have enjoyed the promises. i have only had out of near 200 ammends one person not want to see me. which is ok i can except that...... i did wrong to him and he dont wanna see me. i have been willing and thats the main thing.

feelinggood_2

Lewt, you know anywhere I can get a 12 step work book? Most of the literature I'm reading at the moment is Overeaters Anonymous stuff, very interesting.

I doubt I'll ever have a 'real' sponsor, at least not for a long, long time. I do want to make some progress in the mean time!

mariauk

brodev wrote: »

Again Maria I cannot disagree with what you say. My problem with it is that what you say implies that there is a lot of other help out there. In my experience there isn't. There is some help but not a lot. In my opinion it is like comparing the premier league with the local pub team league. They both play football with the same rules but one attracts hundreds of thousands and the other a few hundred

I am merely talking about this thread Brodev not the whole wide world. Help is help whether its premier league or second division

feelinggood_2

brodev wrote: »

Hi feely it's nice to see you again. Remember that the steps are there to help you. For me the most difficult part was NOT being able to make amends because bringing up the past would have hurt others. I wanted to clean myself up but by doing so I could have damaged others. On another occasion a family member threw my effort back in my face and told me in 4 letter words to leave. Funnily enough 15 years later he came to me and apologised for his actions.
I do believe that you are very fortunate in that you have your mum who can and will help you. (if you ask)

Thanks for your post

I'm not sure why I have difficulty talking to my Mum about it. We do sort of touch on the subject, she asked the other day how I felt after being sober so long. Shes given me a lot of overeaters anonymous stuff, which is a great help. Almost 11 weeks binge free now. I can talk to her about that, but not alcohol. I think not being able to talk about it is just an extension of my low self-esteem, and not feeling entitled to do stuff.

lewt

feelinggood wrote: »

Lewt, you know anywhere I can get a 12 step work book? Most of the literature I'm reading at the moment is Overeaters Anonymous stuff, very interesting.

I doubt I'll ever have a 'real' sponsor, at least not for a long, long time. I do want to make some progress in the mean time!

i know NA have a work book. its green and gold i think, OA work from the big book of AA as far as i know. thats where i work from as the first 100 did. i dont see the point in doing it any other way... as it worked from them and ive been lucky enough to be shown the way they did it.....

i cant really advise doing it on your own as it has always been suggested to get a sponser as some1 to guide me through the steps. thats kinda what i see one as. i have also heard horror storys of friends that attempted them alone. it like it says in the book, half messures availed us nothing. and maybe not wanting a sponser is that ? i dont know...

can i suggest a way to move forwrd in small steps is ring the AA helpline and see what they have to say and if someone will come to see you. your feelings around going to a face to face meeting are by absoloutly no way unique. the rooms are full of us...

feelinggood_2

I appreciate the message, but at the present time I'm pretty much only able to leave the house with medication, so meetings aren't an option. I'm looking around for an online sponsor, so its not as if I'm not willing to do the work. Just don't want to make myself any more ill!

lewt

ok, i aint a doctor and i dont know your situation..... i do know that the steps make you welll though.

finding a sponser for me was about finding someone who had something i wanted, in the way they acting i alo choose someone whos actions matched the words they said in the meetings outside the meetings.

i wish you well in you quest.

annapantscats

lewt wrote: »

ok, i aint a doctor and i dont know your situation..... i do know that the steps make you welll though. .....

The steps may well 'make you well' in a spiritual and/or emotional way...but if someone is not able to leave their house without medication, doing the steps can not cure it. Depression, panic attacks, agorophobia, social phobia etc etc are all illnesses that need to be medically treated by someone who is trained to do so.

Feelinggood...maybe do some research on the internet hun, there is masses of information (some good, some not so good) about how different people have worked the steps. You already know about online meetings, so can you find someone you can relate to and ask for their advice/support?...and post on a message board (if the meeting site has one) asking for peoples storys of how they did steps 8 & 9? (I wouldnt advise one-to-one contact until you have got to know someone quite well....there are alot of loons about on this here interweb )

HTH xx

lewt

Well i know the steps helped me recover mentally, physically and spirtually.

http://www.depressedanon.com/

http://www.emotionsanonymous.org/

http://www.geocities.com/seanphilib/ColoradoSPA.html (socail phoba)
Contact : UK 0870 738 0760 Then, when prompted by the recording, enter 5802-474 Meets at 10PM

Seems to be working for others with different illness's too.

annapantscats

lewt wrote: »

Well i know the steps helped me recover mentally, physically and spirtually.

http://www.depressedanon.com/..... state that the use of medication is necessary for the treatment of depression. But they also state that regular attendance at their meetings is essential, so not much use to someone who cant go out. Or if you dont live in the US, Isreal, Poland or near the one and only UK meeting. Or if you are not overly religious, which this group is.

http://www.emotionsanonymous.org/...... This group utilises the 12 steps as an aid to anyone who wishes to achieve emotional health. Nothing wrong with that at all. But it does not claim that the 12 steps cure medically based problems, which was my point in the previous post.

http://www.geocities.com/seanphilib/ColoradoSPA.html (socail phoba).....
"Recovery from social anxiety is a gradual process for most of us. **We do get better though, and there are people in the groups who have gotten rid of the large majority of their symptoms. So it does work!".......Ummm, so no cure there then either. It might be slightly more appropriate if they said " ...So it does work, up to an extent, for some members of our groups"

Seems to be working for others with different illness's too.

The big book of AA clearly states that 'we are not doctors' and that some people need medication for various illnesses. Nowhere in the big book does it state that complete wellness can be achieve by using the 12 steps alone.
Any group can adopt the 12 steps..... to my knowledge there over 200 groups using them as part of their recovery programs...but the word to note there is PART. I have known people who were critisised for taking antidepressants whilst in AA. They were told they were using a mind-altering substance and were therefore not sober. So they came off their mediction. And are now dead. 1 took a huge drugs overdoes very soon after stopping the medication, one relapsed on drink and severe self harming, and one hung himself. The last 2 were good friends of mine and I attended their funerals. Both were young, wonderful, beautiful people who are no longer with us because someone decided that they were wrong to take medication and that the 'program' was all they needed.

I am sorry Lewt...but the 12 steps are NOT a cure-all. What works for one person does not necesserily work for another. I know many people who have used AA and the 12 steps to totally turn their lives around, and contrary to how I might come across, I am actually a huge advocate of AA.... having worked as a secretary, literature sec, treasurer, probation liason officer for intergroup, online AA email respondant etc etc, (oh, and the fact that I havent drunk for 6 years make me kind of fond of AA as well ) but my chosen path may well not be right for every other person who has a drinking problem. And for me to tell someone who asks for my help that they must do what I did..... its my way or the highway.... would be irresponsable, presumptuous, arrogant and wrong.