Boss shouting at work

mattcanary

Fact that OP's friend has a clocking in and clocking out system at work suggests she works in a factory or warehouse environment.


Nipping out of work now and again (even on a one-off basis) is not normally tolerated in this kind of environment.


Added to which, OP's friend has repeatedly fiddled with the system, clocking out and then in immediately after this. Meaning that the system thinks she has only taken a half hour break when in fact she has taken a lot longer. She also lied in this situation, saying that she told a colleague where she was going when she had done nothing of the sort.


She is a fraudster and a liar.
Frankly I'm not surprised she got shouted at and then disciplined by management. She deserves it and I have no sympathy for her.


She should attempt to limit the damage by apologising to her employers and behaving better in future (if given the chance to remain in her job).




I have had issues with management in one or two of my jobs in the past, but to be honest OP's friend has behaved terribly. I hate liars more than almost anything else, particularly when they try and get others involved in their games (like OP's friend has).

lemontart

so awol, lying and by own admission steals time - I do hope her bosses are aware of this later issue which may be why she was being looked for if noticed not at post.

Least she is going to get is a written warning, personally if on my payroll at least one for two confirmed offences of awol and lying - ideally sacked. Mistress of her own misfortune.

I worked with someone like that and who also tried to pull the bullying card when they issued warnings claiming that a manager had dragged her across the office.............only prob was only shift that could have happened on was late one with only handful of people in and the manager in question has been disabled for around 4 years and can only walk on crutches - she took comfort breaks after alloted breaks to eat her meals, kept going walkabout and so much more - in a 5 hour shift she probally actually spent max 30 minutes at her desk, much to annoyance of everyone else

wiogs

trollopscarletwoman wrote: »

Easy.

the trade union rep would at least make sure a decent hearing would be heard.

That is all that is required.

These days, sadly in my view, that's all unions can do.

Unions can do, and frequently are able to do, a lot more.

However as has been mentioned already as the employee in this case has a short employment history with this company no hearing is likely to occur.

As to whether a single absence is gross misconduct that is down to company policy.

Podge52

Should the boss have shouted at her in front of other colleagues? Absolutely not.

One of the attributes for people in authority should be to remain calm under pressure or provocation. This particular person seems to lack this attribute.

What should happen is the boss should apologise to the employee when he gives her her p45 and then ask his boss to try and get him on an anger management course to avoid it happening again.

Takeaway_Addict

adindas wrote: »

lincroft1710 wrote: »

Utter tosh ...
There is no evidence, news , etc that people been sacked for 20 minutes AWOL especially without previous written warning. People are going AWOL like this all the time for instance going outside to smoke, buy a cigarettes in the shop, go to coffeeshop / coffee machine across the road during working hours, coming late or going home early in one or two occasions. In many offices it is tolerable considering that it works both ways. Quite often employees are also leaving office 10-20 minutes late, come early in the office to prepare of attend a meeting because requirement of the job without getting paid.

Instant dismissal or Sackable offense is something to do with gross misconduct. Typically the things such as theft or fraud, physical violence, gross negligence, incapacity due to alcohol or illegal drugs, and serious insubordination, committing fraud, falsified or manipulating the data.

Not with minor mistakes (bad behavior) like this. Also there has to be a. clear from its disciplinary rules and standards of conduct in the workplace, backed up by a fair disciplinary procedure. Here is the link to differentiate between bad behavior and gross misconduct .

http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=3905

If it was in emergency service such as firestation, in the hospital, it might be different.

If the employer is asked the vast majority would have no issue or if there is a clear rule that the employee can work their hours flexibility then there would be no issue, however this employee is falsifying time sheets, thieving from the company both time and money and ultimately this is gross misconduct.

And sorry you're wrong again. The op has not worked there for 2 yeas so it can be the most unfairest disciplinary procedure going because the OP's friend can do jack about it.

Takeaway_Addict

notanewuser wrote: »

adindas wrote: »

e
I can assure you that ANY member of staff doing this either as a one off or regularly (as it seems this woman has) in any of the 500+ hotels in the chain I worked for would have been sacked immediately.

It's theft.

And a complete breakdown of trust.

Acc72

adindas wrote: »

lincroft1710 wrote: »

Utter tosh ...
There is no evidence, news , etc that people been sacked for 20 minutes AWOL especially without previous written warning. People are going AWOL like this all the time for instance going outside to smoke, buy a cigarettes in the shop, go to coffeeshop / coffee machine across the road during working hours, coming late or going home early in one or two occasions. In many offices it is tolerable considering that it works both ways. Quite often employees are also leaving office 10-20 minutes late, come early in the office to prepare of attend a meeting because requirement of the job without getting paid.

Instant dismissal or Sackable offense is something to do with gross misconduct. Typically the things such as theft or fraud, physical violence, gross negligence, incapacity due to alcohol or illegal drugs, and serious insubordination, committing fraud, falsified or manipulating the data.

Not with minor mistakes (bad behavior) like this. Also there has to be a. clear from its disciplinary rules and standards of conduct in the workplace, backed up by a fair disciplinary procedure. Here is the link to differentiate between bad behavior and gross misconduct .

http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=3905

If it was in emergency service such as firestation, in the hospital, it might be different.

As the employee in question has less than 2 years service, they can be dismissed quite easily without reason (unless linked to discrimination on the grounds of sex, race or disability).


The employer would not say that they are being dismissed for going to the Post Office, but because "it isn't working out" - maybe this is why you haven't heard of many cases ?


I do not agree with the current legislation, however this is the reality faced by millions of people, and they need to act within the current environment.


Some of the "advice" in this thread could easily lead to the employee being dismissed, and although they may feel that they have the moral high ground, you cannot take that to the bank or use it to pay the rent etc.

amibovvered

mattcanary wrote: »

Fact that OP's friend has a clocking in and clocking out system at work suggests she works in a factory or warehouse environment.

I clocked in and out all my working life in an office job - it is fairly usual with flexitime I believe.

Not that it alters the fact that she shouldn't have done it!

adindas

notanewuser wrote: »

adindas wrote: »

e
I can assure you that ANY member of staff doing this either as a one off or regularly (as it seems this woman has) in any of the 500+ hotels in the chain I worked for would have been sacked immediately.

It's theft.

In your workplace it might be a special circumstances because this sort of thing might cost a lot of money to employers if it is not tackled properly. I could think of situation where receptionist or porters suddenly AWOL for 20 minutes and nobody there to greet the guest. Also this sort of thing is normally already clearly stated from its disciplinary rules and standards of conduct in the workplace, backed up by a fair disciplinary procedure. Similar to what happen in an emergency service such as fire station, in the hospital.

Also I am aware that the OP does not have a chance for unfair dismissal because of working history of less than two years. My post is referring to general situation which include people who have been working for long time, permanent employees, etc where people are dismissed for bad behavior of 20 minutes AWOL.

notanewuser

adindas wrote: »

notanewuser wrote: »

In your workplace it might be a special circumstances because this sort of thing might cost a lot of money to employers if it is not tackled properly. I could think of situation where receptionist or porters suddenly AWOL for 20 minutes and nobody there to greet the guest. Also this sort of thing is normally already clearly stated from its disciplinary rules and standards of conduct in the workplace, backed up by a fair disciplinary procedure. Similar to what happen in an emergency service such as fire station, in the hospital.

Also I am aware that the OP does not have a chance for unfair dismissal because of working history of less than two years. My post is referring to general situation which include people who have been working for long time, permanent employees, etc where people are dismissed for bad behavior of 20 minutes AWOL.

Regardless of role, or type of business, this one occasion of "bad behaviour" constitutes gross misconduct and is a sackable offence. No exceptions.