Returning a laptop to Very! How can it be so hard?!

photome

George_Michael wrote: »

This is the consumer rights board, and when buying at distance, a consumer has the legal right to turn on and test the laptop provided that they only do it to the same degree as they could do in a shop, and most, if not all shops will allow you to operate a display computer.
This is not my opinion, This is stated in UK legislation.

The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/265898/consumer-contracts-information-cancellation-and-additional-payments-regulations-2013.pdf

Would a store let you boot up a pc/laptop to test other than the one on display.

I thought you couldnt return after booting up but looks like I am wrong

George_Michael

gik wrote: »

What about them? It's a laptop that's under discussion.

Some people just find it easier to de-rail a discussion rather then admit that they made a mistake.

stebiz

George_Michael wrote: »

Creams, perfumes and aftershaves are not laptops, so what possible relevance do they have here?
There are certain exemptions to the right of return which those items will come under, (goods which can't be returned due to health and hygiene reasons).

Because you can use them in store to sample them much like a computer. Try going into Tesco and taking a computer out of the box and having a play on it.

SuperHan

From the guidance on the directive:

Whether the consumer's testing of the goods went beyond what was necessary to establish their nature, characteristics and functioning will have to be assessed on a case-by-case basis in the event of a dispute. The comparison with what the consumer can normally do in a brick- and-mortar shop serves as a good point of reference, for example:
 Before purchasing audio/video and recording equipment, the consumer would normally be able to test the image or sound quality;
 Trying on a garment in a shop would not involve the removal of the manufacturer's tags;
 The consumer would not normally be able to practically test household appliances, such as kitchen appliances, the actual use of which unavoidably leaves traces;
 The consumer would not be able configure software on a computer; hence reasonable costs for any resetting of such equipment would also constitute diminished value.

In principle, the consumer should be able to open the packaging to access the goods if similar goods are normally displayed in shops in unpacked condition. Hence damage caused to the packaging by merely opening it is not cause for compensation. However, any protective films applied to the item should only be removed where strictly necessary to test it.

and

In relation to the right of withdrawal under the replaced Distance Selling Directive 97/7/EC the Court of Justice ruled in case C-489/07 Pia Messner (paragraph 27) that a national rule placing on the consumer the onus of proving that he did not use those goods during the period for withdrawal in a manner which went beyond what was necessary to permit him to make effective use of his right of withdrawal would adversely affect the efficiency and effectiveness of the right of withdrawal.

From http://ec.europa.eu/justice/consumer-marketing/files/crd_guidance_en.pdf

Now, I know this is in relation to the directive, and our law will supersede the directive, but given that there has been little to no case law on the new rights as of yet, and our law has an ambiguity in the sealed computer software (by turning it on, you have indeed the preinstalled configured software that came in a sealed box), I don't think it's as straight forward as is being made out above, and the guidance for the directive is all we really have.

It implies that there is a reduction of value if any of the protective films have been removed too, which would impair the rights to a refund.

And it places the onus on the customer to prove that what they have done is reasonable.

That said, from what I've read, Very should be refunding, but withholding a portion of the refund for a diminishment in value. For a configured laptop, I'd say around £50 is a fair amount to withhold, given that's roughly the going rate to get a laptop set back to factory settings if you were to take it somewhere to do it (as opposed to do it yourself, which of course is possible, but Very will no doubt charge you for the privilege)

stebiz

George_Michael wrote: »

Some people just find it easier to de-rail a discussion rather then admit that they made a mistake.

Try going into Tesco and taking an Ipad out of the box and have a play.

photome

OP

I dont think you would be entitled to a full refund.

Why did you decide you didnt want it after having a "play"

George_Michael

stebiz wrote: »

Because you can use them in store to sample them much like a computer. Try going into Tesco and taking a computer out of the box and having a play on it.

Yes, you can try perfumes and creams in a store, but as already explained, there is a specific exclusion for returning these back to an online retailer.

The rights conferred by this Part cease to be available in the following circumstances—
(a) in the case of a contract for the supply of sealed goods which are not suitable for return due to health protection or hygiene reasons, if they become unsealed after delivery

There is no such exemption that covers laptops.

stebiz

George_Michael wrote: »

Yes, you can try perfumes and creams in a store, but as already explained, there is a specific exclusion for returning these back to an online retailer.


There is no such exemption that covers laptops.

I'm not saying that there isn't legislation. I know there is. What I'm saying is that when in store you can try certain items but it doesn't mean you can try everything in store. Have you tried opening a bottle of perfume at Tesco lately? or opening an IPOD and connecting to WIFI to see what it's like?

shaun_from_Africa

stebiz wrote: »

It is yours now. From Very's site

Non returnable under our Approval Guarantee, once installed or connected. Your statutory rights are not affected. See Returns section in our Help pages for more information.

Also from Very's website.

Your Right To Cancel Your Order under the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations.

You also have the right to cancel your order under these regulations. However, this cancellation right does not apply to personalised products, perishable goods, audio & video recordings and computer software which has been opened and goods that are unsuitable for return for health or hygiene reasons if they are unsealed after delivery.
The cancellation period will expire 14 days after the goods are received by you or by a third party nominated by you to receive the goods. If your order is for multiple goods for separate delivery, the cancellation period will end 14 days after receipt of the last item. You must clearly communicate your decision to cancel to us before the end of the cancellation period, for example by using the returns note contained in your parcel, by sending us a letter or email or by using the model cancellation form in our website returns help pages. If you cancel, we will reimburse any payment received, including the standard delivery charge, by the original means of payment. Where the goods have not been delivered, the reimbursement will be made within 14 days of the cancellation. Where the goods have been delivered, the reimbursement will be made within 14 days of us receiving the goods back or us receiving evidence that you have returned the goods, whichever is earlier. You are responsible for returning the goods to us and we may make a deduction for any loss in value of the goods arising from unnecessary handling by you

So, no returns for goods such as creams, perfumes and aftershaves due to health reasons, but no mention of laptops or similar goods not being able to be returned.
I wonder why?

LilElvis

Same problem on this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4855620

The OP eventually received his money back, but only by making a section 75 claim against the credit card he used to make the purchase.

Hopefully someone on here knows how the financing is arranged with Very for 'buy now, pay later' and therefore whether the sale could be cancelled from the financing side.

If I'm being dumb just tell me, but be gentle, I've had enough of being called "Silly Mummy" today