Am I being selfish :(

morg_monster

"However, this is why I suggested it. Some friends of mine had unexplained infertility and tried for about 8 years, tried IVF etc, before deciding to try adoption. They adopted a little boy of 18 months and the following month their own son arrived. Taking the focus off conceiving helped it to happen."

If this really happened, they are going against the current "rules" of adoption in the UK. You have to convince social workers that you have given up trying. Some will even want you on contraception even after years of unsuccessfully trying to conceive, at least while the new child is settling in. If the new baby was actually born the month after the child was adopted, the social workers would have known the mum was pregnant, and the adoption would not have gone ahead. It's very important for a newly adopted child that they don't have this kind of disruption.

Also the way you've framed this example gives another side of why the "why don't you just adopt?" line is so offensive - you have suggested the adopted child is second best because eventually the couple got what they "really wanted" - a biological baby. People who are trying to conceive their own child don't just wake up one day and go, OK, we'll adopt one instead. They have to accept this is the end of the road, grieve for the biological children they'll never have, and the type of family they've been imagining for probably 20 or 30 years. That could take months or years. Only then can they think about adopting - and of course many won't go down that road anyway. Just like some people go to adoption first without trying to have biological children.

Sorry OP - realise this isn't the point of your thread and sorry for being off topic. Just another long term TTC er who hates throwaway comments from people who haven't been through it themselves. (actually it's not the comments themselves - that's OK, they haven't been through it; but rather when people are saying how upsetting the comment is and they can't even say you're right, I've got a completely different POV, I'm sorry).

notanewuser

tea_lover wrote: »

That's even worse! For some people, maybe 'relaxing' :mad: will help. But it won't grow sperm, it won't mature eggs, it won't bypass damaged tubes, etc. Suggesting adoption and relaxation are seriously two of the most hurtful, insensitive and downright offensive things you can say to someone who's stuggling to conceive.

Those are quantifiable fertility problems, are they not? I'm no expert, but my understanding of the OP's post is that there's no problem apart from "it's not happening".

The examples I quoted are accurate and I don't mean to upset anybody. The stress of not being able to have something with no explanation must be terrible. There's lots of anecdotal evidence of the phenomena I described.

notanewuser

morg_monster wrote: »

"However, this is why I suggested it. Some friends of mine had unexplained infertility and tried for about 8 years, tried IVF etc, before deciding to try adoption. They adopted a little boy of 18 months and the following month their own son arrived. Taking the focus off conceiving helped it to happen."

If this really happened, they are going against the current "rules" of adoption in the UK. You have to convince social workers that you have given up trying. Some will even want you on contraception even after years of unsuccessfully trying to conceive, at least while the new child is settling in. If the new baby was actually born the month after the child was adopted, the social workers would have known the mum was pregnant, and the adoption would not have gone ahead. It's very important for a newly adopted child that they don't have this kind of disruption.

Also the way you've framed this example gives another side of why the "why don't you just adopt?" line is so offensive - you have suggested the adopted child is second best because eventually the couple got what they "really wanted" - a biological baby. People who are trying to conceive their own child don't just wake up one day and go, OK, we'll adopt one instead. They have to accept this is the end of the road, grieve for the biological children they'll never have, and the type of family they've been imagining for probably 20 or 30 years. That could take months or years. Only then can they think about adopting - and of course many won't go down that road anyway. Just like some people go to adoption first without trying to have biological children.

Sorry OP - realise this isn't the point of your thread and sorry for being off topic. Just another long term TTC er who hates throwaway comments from people who haven't been through it themselves. (actually it's not the comments themselves - that's OK, they haven't been through it; but rather when people are saying how upsetting the comment is and they can't even say you're right, I've got a completely different POV, I'm sorry).

You're right, I've got a completely different POV, I'm sorry.

Am I allowed an opinion now?

"They got what they really wanted?". How offensive. Both children are lived equally and unequivocably.

The case of the couple adopting happened in 2010. They had a year of close contact with their adopted son before it happened. After a very difficult start in life everybody wanted stability for him. Losing 2 sets of parents in his first 2 years would have been horrific for him. The adoption went ahead and there is no different treatment for either son. They were both very much wanted.

tea_lover

notanewuser wrote: »

Those are quantifiable fertility problems, are they not? I'm no expert, but my understanding of the OP's post is that there's no problem apart from "it's not happening".

As the OP has posted for advice/info about a family financial situation she probably hasn't gone into great depth about the reasons she may require IVF.

Neither the OP nor anyone else should have to explain personal medical information in order to stop others giving insensitive, offensive and downright wrong "advice".

Instead of trying to justify these comments why not just accept (from several people who have gone through this) that you should never, EVER say these things to people TTC.

hawk30

notanewuser wrote: »

Those are quantifiable fertility problems, are they not? I'm no expert, but my understanding of the OP's post is that there's no problem apart from "it's not happening".

The examples I quoted are accurate and I don't mean to upset anybody. The stress of not being able to have something with no explanation must be terrible. There's lots of anecdotal evidence of the phenomena I described.

The problem with unexplained infertility label is that it doesn't mean you are 'ok' fertility wise, and so relaxing might help. It just means that the medical community, using the tests it currently has, can't find a reason. There is so much they don't know. Some things are only found during ivf (e.g. Poor quality eggs) and sometimes no reason can be found, but it just never happens.

*Louise*

Sorry if this has been said somewhere but I missed it - how long is it until the wedding? If it's ages then you could have this hanging over you all for a long time yet.

aileth wrote: »

Even if they buy the tickets for you, don't attend the wedding, vote with your feet. The fact they've said they're going to buy the tickets for you regardless is incredibly manipulative.

I totally agree - but rather than making it seem like a stubborn reaction, I would send a nice /letter to the sister explaining that every penny that can be saved is needed for the IVF

Babywanted wrote: »

He has had a face to face chat and they basically said this is his sisters dream wedding and she wants him there so he should put her first, they say if he wants ivf then he has to save

It's so sad that they appear to be treating their children unequally. I would quietly take a big step back from the parents. Maybe a letter to them as well, stating the disappointment in the fact that they seem to prioritise a big wedding over someone's attempt to have children (and their grandchildren)

Babywanted wrote: »

We did consider this but MIL won't hand the cash to hubby, she says she would book his ticket but considering hubby doesn't want to go without me it's a no win situation

Fair enough. Just tell her not to waste the money. If she buys it anyway, stick to your guns and don't be emotionally blackmailed into going at the last minute (and keep the sister informed of this). It might take losing the money on the tickets for her to see how unfair her stand has been.


I don't think you are selfish at all, and I can understand that you must be feeling so frustrated with the whole situation - it's awful when people just don't listen to reason because they are so stuck on the idea in their own heads.

Tiddlywinks

Back on topic - marvellous, thank you.

FatVonD

notanewuser wrote: »

Those are quantifiable fertility problems, are they not? I'm no expert, but my understanding of the OP's post is that there's no problem apart from "it's not happening".

I, like the OP, suffered from 'unexplained' infertility. I had my son after my first round of IVF and despite 'relaxing' because I have a child (my own in this case) I've never fallen pregnant again despite 16 years of unprotected sex.

Nicki

notanewuser wrote: »

[STRIKE]Those are quantifiable fertility problems, are they not?[/STRIKE] I'm no expert, [STRIKE]but my understanding of the OP's post is that there's no problem apart from "it's not happening".

The examples I quoted are accurate and I don't mean to upset anybody. The stress of not being able to have something with no explanation must be terrible. There's lots of anecdotal evidence of the phenomena I described[/STRIKE].

Fixed for you.

Toto

Telling people to relax and think about something else is as useful as telling the parent of an autistic child to cheer up because they will be a genius like rainman!

It may happen that way for some people but for many many more the reality will be very different. Sometimes it's just better to say nothing.