Does every family have one?

coolcait

poet123 wrote: »

We are talking about his name being changed in jest, and his sprouting moustache being commented on, not..., bullying or personal comments. ....

Commenting on a teenager's physical changes - as they go through puberty - seem like 'personal comments' to me. Especially when those comments are not made with kind intentions.

Which can then tip the 'personal comments' into 'bullying'.

If 'Harry' were 'Harriet', and a relative was making 'jokey' comments about the way her body was changing during puberty, how would people feel about that?

Changing someone's name 'in jest' works best if the person is happy with the joke. Otherwise, don't do it.

From a personal point of view, I find the name mockery one of the most uncomfortable parts of this story. I've seen that used a bullying tactic too many times.

coolcait

My personal view on this situation is very much in the camp of 'the relative's a twonk, your OH's family are twonk-enablers, your OH is failing his son, and you are colluding with all of it'.

However, if I were to go for the view that 'it's all about banter', then Harry could innocently remark that you've explained the Steptoe and Son context, and then congratulate the relative on the fact that his 'Harold' joke has now reached its Golden Anniversary.

Before pointing out that all the other old fart comedians have at least tried to update their sets ;-) (even though none of them are funny either)

Even better would be for your or your OH to point it out, when the relative starts with the 'Harold!' nonsense.

Best of all would be to let Harry stay away. Without any comment other than a platitude about him having another commitment.

Funky_Bold_Ribena

Dunroamin wrote: »

I do think that it's possible to define bullying far too widely. For me, unfunny jokes don't come into that category.

What is bullying then, if not repetitive unfunny jokes that go on year after year and grind the person being laughed at down?

One definition:

'exposed, repeatedly and over time, to negative actions on the part of one or more other persons'. He says negative actions occur 'when a person intentionally inflicts injury or discomfort upon another person, through physical contact, through words or in other ways.'

ailuro2

I'd let him stay at home - and when the family ask where he is - tell them.

"Where's your Harry got to?"

"He's asked to stay home because he can't stand the crap Uncle Pita spouts"

"Ah, teenagers these days, what are they like, can't take a joke can they?"

"Harry can, he's got a great sense of humour. He's turned into a lovely lad. But stupid name calling that's the same old crap every time just ain't funny to anyone these days. He would have liked to come, but tbh honest, the rest of you let Uncle Pita get away with it too, so he thinks you lot are just as bad, why would he want to come? Now I've got to go find my hubby he owes me a drink for putting up with Uncle Pita's crap lines"

andygb

Alternatively you could get your son to look at this, and try to mimic Harold Steptoe's voice.

http://vimeo.com/18420164

He only needs to master the immortal phrase - "You dirty old man", and then add "When was the last time you had a bath?".
If the older relation can dish it out, then he should have to learn how to take it as well.

Dunroamin

Funky_Bold_Ribena wrote: »

What is bullying then, if not repetitive unfunny jokes that go on year after year and grind the person being laughed at down?

One definition:

'exposed, repeatedly and over time, to negative actions on the part of one or more other persons'. He says negative actions occur 'when a person intentionally inflicts injury or discomfort upon another person, through physical contact, through words or in other ways.'

Definitely not bullying, particularly as this is obviously a relative who's only seen occasionally at family gatherings. You might be bored to death but since when has that been a crime?

duchy

Of course it's a form of bullying -he has been made clearly aware his personal comments and name jibes are unwelcome and is using his "senior position" in the family pecking order to justify it. Family is where a child or anyone for that matter should feel loved and secure not undermined.
If he pulled this kind of nonsense in the workplace someone would raise a grievence, if he did this kind of thing to strangers in public he'd be risking a punch on the nose or getting arrested for behaviour likely to cause a breech of the peace ...... why because he happens to have married the father of the child's sister does it make obnoxious behaviour acceptable ?

The parents can either teach Harry that it is OK to accept such behaviour and that his feelings are not important or they can teach him to stand up and say "This is not acceptable" and make it clear they stand with him .....none of this passive aggressive nonsense. The fact the father is too afraid of his family to have made a stand already speaks volumes about the family dynamics already in play with the older generation. We all have the annoying relative we tolerate to a point - but once it goes beyond a certain point you are a doormat or you stand up for your own family (in this case your wife who this man rudely ignores and the son he belittles).

I'd tell Dad if he wants to go ....then go but Mum and Harry have something nicer to do and won't be attending family gathering that include Uncle Toxic.

Oh and if anyone in my OH's family called me "Posh bint" rather than by my name repeatedly (not just a one off zinger) my OH would be telling them where to get off. I'm sorry OP but your husband needs to look at his part in allowing this situation to escalate to where it is now. You don't need one liners -you need him and his family to show you a bit of respect.

lostinrates

Dunroamin wrote: »

Definitely not bullying, particularly as this is obviously a relative who's only seen occasionally at family gatherings. You might be bored to death but since when has that been a crime?

'Its just a joke' is one of the first line defenses against the accusation of bullying.

If your behavious has been challenged, some one has asked you to desist and expressed discomfort and you continue pulling the line 'it's just a joke' or 'don't you have a sense of humour?' Its usually attempt to humiliate or dominate not humour and its bullying. The alternative is that the person is reverting to a pattern of behaviour they cannot change because they are exceptionally unintelligent, most people can at least shut up even if they cannot find another level on which to engage.

LEJC

Harry's not attending tomorrow...its a decision he's made and as parents we fully support that.

We will attend for a short while and should the subject of his abscence be raised we will explain that he's made the decision not to atternd as he feels uncomfortable in the precence this relation.

Thanks all for you comments...I have to admit its a mixed bag..some people seem to have the handle on this guy spot on and others perhaps have imagined the worse case senario.

We are not bad parents whatever some may like to think and I like to think that we have bought Harry up in a way that if he has reservations about something we will discuss those with him...
The situation was that yesterday he did feel able to ask yesterday whether it was something he could miss...and when he started to tell me about the uncomfortable situatuion of seeing this particular relation again I completely understood what he was getting at...
The man is not my blood relation and yes since the day I met him I disliked him...its true you cant choose your relations and I never married the family I married my husband. However this does mean that at various points of the year we are invitedto gatherings etc which ideally we should attend.
In fact I and Harry get on very well with lots of other relations and in some ways I put up with the fact that he's part and parcel of the family in order to perhaps catch up with others who I have a genuine affection for.

Everyone has different tolerance levels and I do think that perhaps most of my husbands family just accept thats the way this guy is...rude ,obnoxious and any of the other descriptions that you've come up with etc etc !!

I'm not frightened of my mother in law...I dont like her much but then again I didnt choose her...and my comments about taking a "braver person than me to say something to her"..were certainly taken out of context...of course I would be more than happy to challenge her if needed.

By nature we are perhaps a non confrontational family and tomorrow is a special day for 2 very dear members of my husbands family...I dont want the day remembered more because we chose to confront an unpleasent relation who has also been invited over the true reason we have have been invited to attend...

Harry is happy to stay away and yes we are happy to explain his abscence.

Dunroamin

LEJC wrote: »

Harry's not attending tomorrow...its a decision he's made and as parents we fully support that.

We will attend for a short while and should the subject of his abscence be raised we will explain that he's made the decision not to atternd as he feels uncomfortable in the precence this relation.

Thanks all for you comments...I have to admit its a mixed bag..some people seem to have the handle on this guy spot on and others perhaps have imagined the worse case senario.

We are not bad parents whatever some may like to think and I like to think that we have bought Harry up in a way that if he has reservations about something we will discuss those with him...
The situation was that yesterday he did feel able to ask yesterday whether it was something he could miss...and when he started to tell me about the uncomfortable situatuion of seeing this particular relation again I completely understood what he was getting at...
The man is not my blood relation and yes since the day I met him I disliked him...its true you cant choose your relations and I never married the family I married my husband. However this does mean that at various points of the year we are invitedto gatherings etc which ideally we should attend.
In fact I and Harry get on very well with lots of other relations and in some ways I put up with the fact that he's part and parcel of the family in order to perhaps catch up with others who I have a genuine affection for.

Everyone has different tolerance levels and I do think that perhaps most of my husbands family just accept thats the way this guy is...rude ,obnoxious and any of the other descriptions that you've come up with etc etc !!

I'm not frightened of my mother in law...I dont like her much but then again I didnt choose her...and my comments about taking a "braver person than me to say something to her"..were certainly taken out of context...of course I would be more than happy to challenge her if needed.

By nature we are perhaps a non confrontational family and tomorrow is a special day for 2 very dear members of my husbands family...I dont want the day remembered more because we chose to confront an unpleasent relation who has also been invited over the true reason we have have been invited to attend...

Harry is happy to stay away and yes we are happy to explain his abscence.

I'm sure that's the best solution all round. It's always best not to over dramatise these little family differences.