Separated, how much should I provide?

Mojisola

JackRS wrote: »

No but you know her view will be very different as intend to move south etc. She wrote a while back when I suggested ideas on how to increase her income that it seemed I was keen to for her to find alternative income so I didn't have to pay as much, she doesn't see that as a motivation, obviously....

I think that will go against her because she's not taking any action herself to alter her position. If her financial needs are so important, she should be taking action to increase her income.

Look at how much she has voluntarily given up by not claiming benefits since you left.

JackRS

Mojisola wrote: »

I think that will go against her because she's not taking any action herself to alter her position. If her financial needs are so important, she should be taking action to increase her income.

Look at how much she has voluntarily given up by not claiming benefits since you left.

Indeed, her point is 'well it's only what you normally paid for, why not carry on' reality check require!

JackRS

Found this:

There are 4 types of spousal maintenance orders:

Interim Maintenance Order - known as Maintenance Pending Suit – This is payable by one spouse to another, whilst Proceedings to determine the outcome of the overall financial case are ongoing

Term Maintenance Order – This is spousal maintenance paid for a defined term – this could be 1 year, 5 years, until a child has reached the age of 18, or until the receiving party starts to cohabit. The term can be extendable or non-extendable

Joint Lives Maintenance Order – Maintenance will continue until either party dies, the receiving party remarries, or the Court makes a different order

Nominal Maintenance Order – This provides that the Payer will pay the receiving party maintenance at a nominal level of £1 per year, which is not actually paid, but means that the receiving party can apply to the court for a substantive order, should the need arise. A Nominal Order can either be on a term basis or for joint lives.

There is no automatic entitlement to spousal maintenance for either party. The court is required to consider in every case, whether it can achieve a clean break between the parties so that the financial obligations of each party towards the other come to an end.

Where both parties are working and their incomes from all sources, including benefits, tax credits and child maintenance, are relatively similar then it is unlikely the court would consider making a spousal maintenance order. In some circumstances, one party may be awarded more of the capital, such as the house or savings, which may then reduce their outgoings to such an extent that they cannot show a need for any maintenance from the other.

However, if there cannot be a clean break without undue hardship, then firstly the court must decide what amount it is to be. Both parties will prepare “budgets”, a schedule of their outgoings, and if one party is able to show that there is a shortfall from their income from all sources, then they have shown a need for maintenance. There is then the question of whether the other party has any spare income to meet that shortfall after they have met all of their outgoings in their own budget.

The court will then look at how long that order should last for. The need for maintenance may diminish over time and often some level of support is provided for the duration of children’s minorities. The courts in England and Wales take differing approaches as to the duration of orders for spousal maintenance, with some courts regularly making Term Orders and other usually making Joint Lives Orders saying that it is the payer’s responsibility to bring the matter back to court if the circumstances change in the future.

Many people say that the law as it presently stands in relation to spousal maintenance is unclear and that makes the law inaccessible and creates uncertainty. In America the Courts are starting to apply a mathematical calculation based on the disparity of earnings post-divorce. As with the formulaic calculation applied by the Child Support Agency in relation to child maintenance in the United Kingdom, it provides certainty and it is easy for the parties to apply themselves. However, a formulaic system is also inflexible and does not allow a court to look at family’s individual circumstances as a whole.

Ames

I think the key part is after they have met all of their outgoings in their own budget.

After you see your new solicitor tomorrow, go round some estate agents and find a nice place to rent for yourself. Make sure you get all the insurances you need etc. I wouldn't normally recommend getting into debt, but as she's being so obstructive about letting you have half the furniture from the house, I'd buy new with credit. After all, you need furniture, so it's an unaviodable expense. The alternative - to buy cheap or get on freecycle - could be a very false economy if they start falling apart and your budget doesn't allow you to replace them.

It's not just important that you have bills, but you need as long as you can to be paying them to show how much you're actually spending - you don't want to underestimate things like your food bill. If you've got receipts etc you can prove your outgoings, and that they're reasonable. I very much doubt she'll be able to do the same

Of course, that's just my opinion though.

RAS

JackRS wrote: »

But is that advice based on similar circumstance? The advice I'm getting is always conflicting. Current solicitor thinks if we go with some minimum amount I will have to go to court and end up paying more fees and what they request anyway because even if she looked for a job she's not going to be earning much. I will pay another £200 on Friday with other solicitor to get their view.

Jack

You do know that you do not absolutely need a solicitor and that as a Litigant in Person, the judge will often give you a bit of lee-way re proceedings.

Your could take a Mckenzie friend from something like wikidivorce or Families need Fathers instead; they are not allowed to speak to the court but can act as advisors.

Can you make a list of the actual expenses prior to your split? Based on evidence (old bank statements).

Then show what you have had to cancel already, what extra expenses you now incur?

And make projections for the reductions you would have expected over the next 5 years as the young people in the household start to earn and become more independent?

Then look at her mad claims again? You have already started to budget differently, she has not. You need that to stand out clearly.

Floxxie

Hi Jack,

I haven't managed to read the whole thread as quite honestly I am amazed at how you continue to be controlled by your wife and children.

Biggest suggestion is to pop over to wikivorce and put in your details. There are a number of experienced solicitors over there. There is also a free advice line. Stop worrying over what ifs...it is all about playing a game when it comes to solicitors and the process.

You are no longer part of a couple so stop worrying about what she is/isn't doing. Focus on your life and making it your own. Pay the minimum required CM. Focus on what you want the financial outcome of the divorce to be. And if you can go no contact.

You appear to have got mixed up in other people's thoughts and actions and failed to consider yourself.

JackRS

Floxxie wrote: »

Hi Jack,

I haven't managed to read the whole thread as quite honestly I am amazed at how you continue to be controlled by your wife and children.

Biggest suggestion is to pop over to wikivorce and put in your details. There are a number of experienced solicitors over there. There is also a free advice line. Stop worrying over what ifs...it is all about playing a game when it comes to solicitors and the process.

You are no longer part of a couple so stop worrying about what she is/isn't doing. Focus on your life and making it your own. Pay the minimum required CM. Focus on what you want the financial outcome of the divorce to be. And if you can go no contact.

You appear to have got mixed up in other people's thoughts and actions and failed to consider yourself.

Well it is my first but you are right difficult to know which advice fits me best. Thanks I'm learning, will try wiki ?

I see wikivorce offers the following, I'll try and call them today:

Option 2) Speak to an advisor on our free telephone helpline


Our highly experienced advisors are available to provide free advice on your individual case whether or not you already have a solicitor. We can answer all your questions about divorce, financial settlements and child matters including: How do I start a divorce? How do I deal with divorce papers I have received from court? What is a fair financial settlement? How can I avoid large solicitor bills? etc


Calls are free from a UK landline:

Or use our mobile friendly number:
0800 44 88 66 44

01202 80 50 20

We have expert advisors available to take your call from 9am to 11pm, 7 days a week

JackRS

Ames wrote: »

I think the key part is after they have met all of their outgoings in their own budget.

After you see your new solicitor tomorrow, go round some estate agents and find a nice place to rent for yourself. Make sure you get all the insurances you need etc. I wouldn't normally recommend getting into debt, but as she's being so obstructive about letting you have half the furniture from the house, I'd buy new with credit. After all, you need furniture, so it's an unaviodable expense. The alternative - to buy cheap or get on freecycle - could be a very false economy if they start falling apart and your budget doesn't allow you to replace them.

It's not just important that you have bills, but you need as long as you can to be paying them to show how much you're actually spending - you don't want to underestimate things like your food bill. If you've got receipts etc you can prove your outgoings, and that they're reasonable. I very much doubt she'll be able to do the same

Of course, that's just my opinion though.

Yes appreciate that thanks. Been looking on line for rental for some weeks, looking at properties this weekend.

JackRS

RAS wrote: »

Jack

You do know that you do not absolutely need a solicitor and that as a Litigant in Person, the judge will often give you a bit of lee-way re proceedings.

Your could take a Mckenzie friend from something like wikidivorce or Families need Fathers instead; they are not allowed to speak to the court but can act as advisors.

Can you make a list of the actual expenses prior to your split? Based on evidence (old bank statements).

Then show what you have had to cancel already, what extra expenses you now incur?

And make projections for the reductions you would have expected over the next 5 years as the young people in the household start to earn and become more independent?

Then look at her mad claims again? You have already started to budget differently, she has not. You need that to stand out clearly.

Wow another tact, thanks.

RAS

the other thing Jack that I have been meaning to ask for a while.

Obviously you moved out of the family home because you wanted to end your relationship with your wife.

And you have had to live in basic accomodation since.

However, why is it that you expect your son and daughter to move with your wife?

Have you ever told either of them that you would be prepared to accomodate them if they want to remain locally?

Do they understand that you have ended your relationship with your wife, but that the reason you have not asked them to live with you is that you have nowhere to accomodate them at present?

Or do they understand that you have not abandoned them?

How much of the lack of contact between you and them is their doing and how much is mum pressuring them?

Is there any reason other than lack of space why they could not live with you?