Baroness Thatcher passed away

Graham_Devon

CLAPTON wrote: »

Well, the figures show that the reduction in mining during Thatcher years was less that in the period prior and less that the period after her.

Not really surprising considering the workers were always on strike!

Graham_Devon

Fella wrote: »

I wonder if this will lead to an upsurge in popularity for the Tories. Clearly there are many people who've apparently wasted the last 30 years of their lives waiting for Maggie Thatcher to die & those people have just lost the focus of their hatred. At the same time, lots of regular people are repulsed by those gloating over the death of an 80-something. In particular very many people who know anyone with Alzheimer's are pretty offended.

And I must admit, although I was no fan of Maggie Thatcher, if you judge a person by their enemies she's shown in a very kind light.

Among the brave souls who waited until she'd gone to say how much they hated her we've had Sinn Fein, Derek Hatton, various well-paid union bosses, George Galloway, some tinpot Argentinians who seem to have forgotten who started that conflict, Ken Livingstone & many others. A truly grotesque roll-call of people to be associated with.

I think the comments are certainly starting to backfire.

The telegraph for instance made point of blocking comments across the majority of it's articles (not just on thatcher) due to the content of people "unable to control themselves".

Galloway has undone a lot of respect some had for him. He was seen as a no nonsense person, but vitally, speaking for the people and against hatred. He then went on to spout some vile hatred. Of coure, he's won some backing for this too. Same goes for Ken Livingstone who was particularly nasty.

It's certainly got people questioning the current crop of MP's though. For everything they have done is just massaging figures. We are now being reminded of a time when figures weren't just massaged, but action taken.

This all came on a day when the first benefit changes came into place too, which is bizarre. Parralels are starting to be drawn there, as those throwing abuse to thatcher also started throwing abuse at the Iain Duncan Smith for the benefits changes. However, it also got backing for an MP willing to take the flack and actually start balancing things again. Maybe this time, instead of miners etc, it will be the society trying to protect the welfare system up against the rest.

I guess at the end of all this, opinions will be more polorised, with the left and right becoming further apart, and they may just make it's way through to the parites. At a time like today, the right would probably win this argument (just). Though I'm wondering if it would take another labour government and a hard line tory to take power back....much the same as the end of the 70's.

The unions have certainly made a comeback with labour anyway, putting Ed Milliband in charge. We may well just see it all play out again. Louise Mecnh could always come back as the "lady who will not turn"

Jennifer_Jane

grizzly1911 wrote: »

With what?

She halted the decline of Britain for a time, she didn't reverse it in the long term.

One of the ways she did that was sell off the silver. Selling of utilities, energy, water to many investors that were foreign government backed. Those utilities have been allowed to deteriorate and we as a nation are once again going to have to pay to make them fit for the future.

Giving away the housing stock at undervalue. Enticing people into debt to acquired them, releasing cash into the economy to be frittered away more than once.

If you sold your house tomorrow, spent the money, how would you buy it back?

Yes, I agree about privatisation.

Re selling my house, it's a bit different from a Country, in that I only have one life - it's a finite thing, whereas Countries go on forever.

Nevertheless, selling the house and living off the proceeds is something I've been considering (especially with the costs of maintaining the darn thing). I will be continuing to consider this option.

But, in essence, I agree that privatisation wasn't good. Whether or not this is with the benefit of hindsight, I can't say.

Fire_Fox

holidaysforme wrote: »

'and when they finally put you in the ground. I'll stand on your grave and tramp the dirt down'

Elvis costello wtote this classic. I believe he wrote it about thatcher.

Always like this song. Seems very appropriate today:D

I prefer
"When England was the w***e of the world
Margaret was her madam
And the future looked as bright and as clear as
The black tarmacadam"

Jennifer_Jane

dryhat wrote: »

It would be ironic if the gravediggers went on strike now as they did in the "winter of discontent"

Ah, she's being cremated, though!

Fella

Let's not go overboard about Elvis Costello. He does, after all, dislike England and has no time for the English:

"I don't care if I ever play England again. That gig made up my mind I wouldn't come back. I don't get along with it. We lost touch. It's 25 years since I lived there. I don't dig it, they don't dig me"

Personally I like some of his music but I've always thought he was a pretentious tw*t.

Mrs_Bones

Old_Git wrote: »

yes but maggie is dead and doesn't really need security now .

The security won't be for Margaret Thatcher it will be for the Queen, all the other heads of state attending from other countries and all of the current government and the rest that will be attending what will be a major televised event.

The fact it's going to be a ceremonial funeral doesn't really reflect that much on the costs. Even if it was held behind closed doors, with the amount of people and who they are, the venue would still have had to be one of the major places of worship to hold them all. The security would still have to be the same and arrangements would still have to be made to accommodate the worlds media who will be attracted to the event.

The actually procession part of the funeral is relatively small in cost compared to what would have to be done anyway. This isn't about personal feelings it's about practicalities. Her funeral was never going to be able to be a small private family affair even if that was the wishes of the family themselves. What ever anyone thought of her doesn't alter the fact that she was the UK's first women PM, the longest serving PM in modern times and an international figure head in her prime. All those things mean that her funeral is a national PR media exercise rather than the simple laying to rest of an elderly woman.

chewmylegoff

I'm currently on the train home from London in the quiet carriage of the 20.20 to Reading. There are three people on the phone, one of them is basically shouting and everyone has got a bag next to them so there are no empty seats and one person (who is on the phone) is having to stand up.

I blame Maggie for this ingrained selfishness. I blame Tony Blair for the fact that I've just put my headphones in and ignored it rather than saying something.

BobQ

Fella wrote: »

I wonder if this will lead to an upsurge in popularity for the Tories. Clearly there are many people who've apparently wasted the last 30 years of their lives waiting for Maggie Thatcher to die & those people have just lost the focus of their hatred. At the same time, lots of regular people are repulsed by those gloating over the death of an 80-something. In particular very many people who know anyone with Alzheimer's are pretty offended.
.

Indeed, I recall on another thread some months ago stating that I felt that the recent film was quite cruel to focus on her declining years. I doubt that her death will affect support for the Tories except to highlight the inadequacies of Cameron (and for that matter Clegg and Milliband).

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

Often through change there is hardship.
There needs to be a period of acceptance and adjustment.

I can understand your points about destroying communities whilst going through the change but let me ask you one thing in your opinion.

Did these communities fare better in 1990 when she departed when compared to 1979 when she took office?

Lets also not forget the many fronts she addressed / support / achieved

CLAPTON wrote: »

Well, the figures show that the reduction in mining during Thatcher years was less that in the period prior and less that the period after her.

Coal mining was declining from the late 50s with cheaper imported coal and then north sea gas.

Its true that mining communities were already in decline anyway but it was not just mining villages. For one who has been credited with having a clear vision, Thatcher simply focussed on accelerating the decline of skilled employment and replaced it with low skill/pay service jobs. The strategy was based on increasing social divisions rather than improving the economy.

BobQ

chewmylegoff wrote: »

I'm currently on the train home from London in the quiet carriage of the 20.20 to Reading. There are three people on the phone, one of them is basically shouting and everyone has got a bag next to them so there are no empty seats and one person (who is on the phone) is having to stand up.

I blame Maggie for this ingrained selfishness. I blame Tony Blair for the fact that I've just put my headphones in and ignored it rather than saying something.

Try moving into first class and tell the guard George Osbourne said it would be OK.:)