Rang Ebay today.....

theonlywayisup

marie-20 wrote: »

Most buyers are aware of the 4 day NPB anyway and 9 times out of 10 the NPB's still don't pay once a case has been opened.

The buyer is expected to pay within a reasonable timeframe which eBay have decided is 4 days.

For those that missed the Spring Update news, this is changing in the Autumn to 2 days.

StacFace

marie-20 wrote: »

eBay buyers receive numerous payment reminders from eBay i.e. you have bought this time, my invoice and then a payment reminder and if, after those 3 messages, they still can't be bothered to pay then so be it.

:wall:

"Hello XXX,
We hope you enjoy your XXX. The next step is to pay. Pay now to get your item as quickly as possible."

"Dear XXX,
Thank you for shopping on eBay! Your total amount due is £x.xx. More details about your purchase are included below."

"Hello XXX,
Thanks for your recent purchase on eBay! Please remember to pay for your item so that the seller can send it to you as soon as possible.
Note: If you've already made payment arrangements with your seller, please disregard this reminder.
Thanks again for shopping on eBay!"

Exactly which part of the above says clearly to you "I need paying by X date or to be informed if you will need longer to pay"?

The wording doesn't say it as the only timeframe mentioned is 'now' and that's to 'get your item faster', not because the seller wants/needs it now. The frequency isn't either as those all appear to be generic messages automatically sent by eBay, meaning they'd be sent even if they buyer couldn't care less how soon you paid.

If the buyer pays after the NPB case is opened then that's not a buyer who "couldn't be bothered to pay", if they couldn't be bothered to pay they still wouldn't do it after the case was opened.

I wouldn't mind if you disagreed and presented a valid argument but every post (including OP's here) against what I've said has included the asssumption that the buyer wasn't going to pay when if that was truly the case they wouldn't have paid when a NPB case was opened.

chancesare_2

StacFace wrote: »

:wall:

"Hello XXX,
We hope you enjoy your XXX. The next step is to pay. Pay now to get your item as quickly as possible."

"Dear XXX,
Thank you for shopping on eBay! Your total amount due is £x.xx. More details about your purchase are included below."

"Hello XXX,
Thanks for your recent purchase on eBay! Please remember to pay for your item so that the seller can send it to you as soon as possible.
Note: If you've already made payment arrangements with your seller, please disregard this reminder.
Thanks again for shopping on eBay!"

Exactly which part of the above says clearly to you "I need paying by X date or to be informed if you will need longer to pay"?

The wording doesn't say it as the only timeframe mentioned is 'now' and that's to 'get your item faster', not because the seller wants/needs it now. The frequency isn't either as those all appear to be generic messages automatically sent by eBay, meaning they'd be sent even if they buyer couldn't care less how soon you paid.

If the buyer pays after the NPB case is opened then that's not a buyer who "couldn't be bothered to pay", if they couldn't be bothered to pay they still wouldn't do it after the case was opened.

I wouldn't mind if you disagreed and presented a valid argument but every post (including OP's here) against what I've said has included the asssumption that the buyer wasn't going to pay when if that was truly the case they wouldn't have paid when a NPB case was opened.

Sellers do not need T&C outlining ridiculous time frames.

Buyers bid or buy on the site. Ebays T&C are clear. A buyer should send full payment WHEN they win - not days after, not later, not next week, but WHEN they win. Ebay now give you 2 days grace. No ambiguity, no additional excuses, not at all unclear. I suspect they only give grace as some are not at their PC when they might win.

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/unpaid-item.html

When a buyer wins an item or uses Buy it now to purchase an item, the buyer is obliged to complete the purchase by sending full payment to the seller.

If a buyer doesn't pay within 2 days, a seller can open an unpaid item case in the Resolution Centre. If the buyer still doesn't pay or reach some other agreement with the seller, eBay may record the unpaid item on the buyer's account.

soolin

Seriously? As a seller I am supposed to go and hold the poor simple minded little buyers hand so the poor little fellow can struggle with the requirement to pay.....

Nope, I do not believe my buyers are stupid or dim and expect them to be professional. They win they pay- that's it , it is not rocket science.

On day 4 I open an NPB and close it 4 days later. If that is too complicated for a buyer then with respect I would suggest that they perhaps should not be using eBay without supervision.

theonlywayisup

Michael272 spam off.

StacFace

chancesare wrote: »

Sellers do not need T&C outlining ridiculous time frames.

Buyers bid or buy on the site. Ebays T&C are clear. A buyer should send full payment WHEN they win - not days after, not later, not next week, but WHEN they win. Ebay now give you 2 days grace. No ambiguity, no additional excuses, not at all unclear. I suspect they only give grace as some are not at their PC when they might win.

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/unpaid-item.html

When a buyer wins an item or uses Buy it now to purchase an item, the buyer is obliged to complete the purchase by sending full payment to the seller.

If a buyer doesn't pay within 2 days, a seller can open an unpaid item case in the Resolution Centre. If the buyer still doesn't pay or reach some other agreement with the seller, eBay may record the unpaid item on the buyer's account.

eBay is clear that you are obliged to pay but not clear on WHEN YOU NEED TO PAY. A buyer will not be looking at the help pages for sellers so that link is irrelevant, the link you want to be reading is this one:

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/pay/pay-on-ebay.html

The paragraph on when to pay does not say you have to pay within 2 days or give any timeframe you have to pay within. It merely suggests you pay as soon as possible to get your item quicker and advises you to check seller listings to see if the seller expects to be paid within a certain timeframe. So if you do mention it in your listings buyers who are trying to find out when they should pay by will check your listings and know.

soolin wrote: »

Seriously? As a seller I am supposed to go and hold the poor simple minded little buyers hand so the poor little fellow can struggle with the requirement to pay.....

Nope, I do not believe my buyers are stupid or dim and expect them to be professional. They win they pay- that's it , it is not rocket science.

On day 4 I open an NPB and close it 4 days later. If that is too complicated for a buyer then with respect I would suggest that they perhaps should not be using eBay without supervision.

Once again a post ignoring the actual issue. THE REQUIREMENT TO PAY IS NOT THE ISSUE, IT IS THE REQUIREMENT TO PAY WITHIN A SET TIMEFRAME YOU HAVE NOT MADE THE BUYER AWARE OF.

The fact you open a NPB case and close it 4 days later isn't complicated. But the buyer doesn't know that's what you're doing because you haven't told them. The buyer could have bidded:
- on holiday and not able to pay until their return.
- shortly before payday and unable to pay until then.
- without the money in their current account but available in their '7 day notice' savings account.
- without the money currently but with a cheque to cover it that they need to pay into the bank.
- plenty of other valid reasons.

If you actually tell them you need payment within 4 days then at least you are being fair and those with valid reasons can choose not to bid or message you and ask if they could pay a little later if they win (which you could of course say no to).

It is so quick and simple to do, doesn't cost a thing, makes your expected timeframe for payment clear, is fairer to buyers and I don't see why it's such a big deal to do it. The only thing I can think of is that you actually enjoy opening NPB cases.

theonlywayisup

StacFace wrote: »

eBay is clear that you are obliged to pay but not clear on WHEN YOU NEED TO PAY. A buyer will not be looking at the help pages for sellers so that link is irrelevant, the link you want to be reading is this one:

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/pay/pay-on-ebay.html

The paragraph on when to pay does not say you have to pay within 2 days or give any timeframe you have to pay within. It merely suggests you pay as soon as possible to get your item quicker and advises you to check seller listings to see if the seller expects to be paid within a certain timeframe. So if you do mention it in your listings buyers who are trying to find out when they should pay by will check your listings and know.




Once again a post ignoring the actual issue. THE REQUIREMENT TO PAY IS NOT THE ISSUE, IT IS THE REQUIREMENT TO PAY WITHIN A SET TIMEFRAME YOU HAVE NOT MADE THE BUYER AWARE OF.

You clearly missed my post.

StacFace wrote: »

The buyer could have bidded:

I rest my case, that comment explains why you cannot grasp this.

theonlywayisup

Stacface, when you go into Tesco, do you pay at the checkout or do you hunt around looking for their instructions on how, when and why you need to pay?

soolin

I fail to see how anyone can defend a position which is based on the idea that a buyer is unaware they need to pay for an item?

I find it insulting to suggest that buyers are that stupid.

StacFace

theonlywayisup wrote: »

You clearly missed my post.

Which one? There was one I didn't quote about the spring update news but that is about how soon you can open a NPB case, which is nothing to do with when a buyer has to pay by.

theonlywayisup wrote: »

I rest my case, that comment explains why you cannot grasp this.

What case? How does the buyer bidding have anything to do with them knowing when they have to pay by?

theonlywayisup wrote: »

Stacface, when you go into Tesco, do you pay at the checkout or do you hunt around looking for their instructions on how, when and why you need to pay?

If you're going to make comparisons you need to make them like for like.

With Tesco the contract is formed at the till and you are required to pay at that point. If you want this with your eBay items you need to set a buy-it-now price and select the option to require immediate payment when you list it.

With eBay auctions or buy-it-nows without the requirement for immediate payment ticked you are allowing the buyer to 'buy now pay later'. You will not find any business that runs on a 'buy now pay later' model without informing its customers of when 'later' is. There is a good reason for that and I'm honestly surprised people are having such trouble seeing it.

soolin wrote: »

I fail to see how anyone can defend a position which is based on the idea that a buyer is unaware they need to pay for an item?

I find it insulting to suggest that buyers are that stupid.

I'm sorry but this is just getting ridiculous now.

I AM NOT SAYING BUYERS MAY BE UNAWARE THEY NEED TO PAY FOR AN ITEM. I AM SAYING THEY MAY BE UNAWARE OF THE PAYMENT DEADLINE.


Opening a case against an eBayer, whether it's a seller opening a NPB one or a buyer opening an SNAD one, is supposed to be there as protection when your buyer/seller is not co-operating. You should only open one after attempting to remedy the issue directly with them. For SNAD cases this is telling the seller that you are unhappy so they can try to remedy the situation, for NPB cases this is telling the buyer you need payment by X date so they can ensure they pay you by your deadline.