Flight delay and cancellation compensation, Ryanair ONLY

boatman

JPears wrote: »

Simple now then. I won't be flying Ryanair.
Does this mean ESCP can no longer used against Ryanair?

What is the point of having the ESCP if a company just negate it writing in their terms and conditions? Surely this is not legal?

Hard to believe it has to the Irish courts. I think Bott and Co don't want the hassle of EU, maybe just want to work ok UK cases.


Ryanair's General Conditions of Carriage should really say Ryanair's General Conditions of Carnage.


https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/713715/ex725-eng.pdf

EX725 says:
However, there are exceptions to this so some claims can be brought in another Member
State other than where the defendant resides. These exceptions mainly occur in matters
relating to:
; a contractual obligation;
; actions for damages;
matters relating to maintenance;
consumer contracts


This would over ride Ryanair contract.

ForeverMancunian

Hi all,

I've recently submitted a claim for compensation with Ryanair due to a cancelled flight (using Resolver); yesterday they declined the claim.

The flight was cancelled due to the recent Ryanair strikes, their response says "We regret to advise you that in this situation we do not consider that any compensation is payable under Regulation EU261."

When we were notified of the cancellation we were offered 1) refund 2) same route on an alternative date 3) re-routing but you must call the call centre to do this and 4) alternative flights on another day.

We opted for option 2 or 3.

For option 2 unfortunately the same route on an alternative date meant we would be stranded in Spain for 2 extra days without confirmed accommodation, and no way of knowing if Ryanair would cover the cost of the accomodation and lost earnings.

For option 3, I tried contacting Ryanair via phone and was continually cut off. I tried social media and was ignored completely. I tried web chat and kept getting cut off, or put into a queue for over 200 minutes and eventually cut off. At this point I was at my wits-end, let me add that I'm pregnant and do not need this stress.

So we ended up choosing option 4, going for an alternative flight, which we could arrange on their website free of charge. We had to choose a different departure airport and a different arrival airport, we also lost a day of our holiday. Our return flight was supposed to be going to Manchester, but the alternative flight took us to London. We incurred the cost of 2 taxis, 2 trains and 1 tube journey - this is all I wanted to claim back from Ryanair, but they have said no.

Where do we stand legally with regards to the EU compensation and/or reimbursement for additional expenditure?

Thank you!

JPears

As usual Ryanair are being their usual disgusting and unlawful self.
The regulation clearly states that the airline has a duty of care irrespective of the reason for the delay or cancellation.
This inlcudes any expenses incurred in getting from your original departure airport back to your original arrival airport.
As long as you have receipted expenses these are payabkle by Ryanair.
Bear in mind every airline, almost without exception will try to deny most claims even though they are perfectly valid.
Download Vauban's guide.
Downlaod EU regaultion 261/2004. Article 8 is the relevant part. In your reply not accepting RAs decision quote the relevant part of the regualtion.
A seperate issue is compensation due to you over and above expenses. Whats time did you get back to Manchester airport, compared to your original scheduled time?
Put your flight details here - dates numbers to/from etc so we can check.

Tyzap

ForeverMancunian wrote: »

Hi all,

I've recently submitted a claim for compensation with Ryanair due to a cancelled flight (using Resolver); yesterday they declined the claim.

Thank you!

Hi FM,

Well the first thing to say is that the CAA don't agree with RA's opinion about the strike exempting them from having to pay compensation. It looks like this difference of opinions could run for a while so I would suggest just a watching brief on this one for now.

It seems that you were forced, by the lack of alternative options, to opt for 3. RA have interpreted this as 'rerouting at a later date' which exempts them from any further duty of care.

Please have a good read of the links below to get an understanding of the regulations.

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/resource.html?uri=cellar:439cd3a7-fd3c-4da7-8bf4-b0f60600c1d6.0004.02/DOC_1&format=PDF

https://ec.europa.eu/transport/sites/transport/files/themes/passengers/news/doc/2016-06-10-better-enforcement-pax-rights/c%282016%293502_en.pdf

Have a read also of Vaubans Guide, details just below here.

Please come back with any further questions once you have read these articles.

Good luck.

steakmaster

Tyzap wrote: »

Not seen that before from Bott, can you wait to see what they say?

boatman wrote: »

This is what I got from Bott & co:
Your Claim Decision
Sorry, it looks like you can't claim
When booking your flight with Ryanair you agreed to their General Conditions of Carriage which contain numerous terms, one of which stipulates that any claim must be brought within the Irish Courts.
In May 2017 a judge at Liverpool County Court ruled that this is a valid term and that the English Courts cannot deal with any Ryanair claim.
Unfortunately, as we are Solicitors regulated in England and Wales only we do not have the necessary jurisdiction to pursue your claim in Ireland....

Just got the same reply from Bott & Co.

JPears

Tyzap wrote: »

Hi FM,


It seems that you were forced, by the lack of alternative options, to opt for 3. RA have interpreted this as 'rerouting at a later date' which exempts them from any further duty of care.



Good luck.

Hi Tyzap. I know your recent experience of RA claims has been positive, in a sense but I do find RAs attitude quite shocking, clearly flouting established law.
Re your comment above, which part of the regulation are you referring to? Or are you saying that RA have interpreted the regulation in their own "special" way?

JPears

Perhaps, if there is anyone from Botts on this forum, could they confirm that ESCP is still a valid route for making a claim against Ryanair, despite their T&Cs?
Perhaps the good Dr has knowledge on this?

Tyzap

JPears wrote: »

Hi Tyzap. I know your recent experience of RA claims has been positive, in a sense but I do find RAs attitude quite shocking, clearly flouting established law.
Re your comment above, which part of the regulation are you referring to? Or are you saying that RA have interpreted the regulation in their own "special" way?

I believe it's the option that RA want the op to choose and thats why they are interpreting it this way. There is a lot of manipulation going on here IMHO.

I also think the op has a very good case if it were put before a judge but Ryanair are doing a very good job of 'muddying the waters' at the moment.

I'm inclined to believe that the best way forwards is to do nothing about the possible compensation claim just yet.

This is the reg I'm referring to...

b. Right to reimbursement, re-routing or rebooking in the event of denied boarding or cancellation
Article 8(1) of the Regulation imposes on air carriers the obligation to offer passengers a triple choice, between (i) reimbursement of the ticket price36 and, in the case of connections, a return flight to the airport of departure at the earliest opportunity, (ii) re-routing to their final destination either at the earliest opportunity or, (iii) re-routing at a later date at the passenger’s convenience under comparable transport conditions, subject to availability of seats. As a general principle, when the passenger is informed about the cancellation of the flight and is correctly informed on the available choices, the choice offered to passengers under Article 8(1) is to be made once. In such cases, as soon as the passenger has chosen one of the three options under Article 8(1)(a),(b) or (c), the air carrier no longer has any obligation linked to the other two options. Nonetheless, the obligation to compensation may still apply according to Article 5(1)(c) in connection with Article 7.

RA are saying the op chose (iii)

JPears

So we are in agreement that even if option iii) is chosen, RA still has the obligation to get the passenger to the original detisnation including additional expenses of travel, such as trains taxis etc?

Its just RA who are applying their alternative universe interpretation = dont' give $**t attitude?

Oasis1

I got a (first and 'final'!) response to my claim... no surprises:

We sincerely regret the cancellation of your flight FR147 from London Stansted to Berlin Schonefeld on the 27/07/2018 which was due to adverse weather conditions.

However, as this cancellation was for safety reasons and therefore outside Ryanair’s control we regret to advise that no monetary compensation is due under EU Regulation 261/2004.

Can I contest this? I believe other flights went ahead, and we also boarded the plane before being taken off.

We will always make best efforts initially to accommodate you on an alternative Ryanair flight. However, if you choose to purchase a flight with another airline, without prior agreement with Ryanair, this may result in you being unable to recover the cost of that ticket from us.

I did have prior agreement with Ryanair and have a Live Chat transcript of this. They also haven't commented on my reimbursement claim for my taxi journey home from the airport.

This letter contains our final position in relation to your complaint. If you are unhappy with our decision, you can take your complaint to Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR)."

Do I try to respond directly with the copy of the transcript or go straight through ADR? Or now that I have been in through their claim system, can I now use Resolver?