Flight delay and cancellation compensation, BA ONLY

eskbanker

sayling said:

eskbanker said:

rnem170 said:

After filing a claim, and BA rejecting it more than once, they are now saying (paraphrasing) "We won't cover the cost of your return flights because their cancellation was not our fault.  We were forced to cancel because Heathrow told us to".

IMHO, the contract was with BA, so BA should pay up and then claim off Heathrow if that is the reason - plus, they should have booked them on the next available flight - even if this was with another carrier and probably the one they ended up on.  The lead has gone back again and is waiting to hear.  

Am I correct that BA should responsible for cost of replacement flights, additional travel costs & incidental expenses due to need to rebook + £200 compensation per passenger, and additional parking costs.  The party was insured, and they have been notified, but clearly an excess needs to be paid and they want a 'final' no from BA before doing anything.  In the meantime, lead passenger is over £2K out of pocket.

However, compensation isn't applicable if the cancellation was due to extraordinary circumstances beyond the airline's control, so if they're asserting that it was caused by Heathrow cutting slots then that can be difficult to counter - if the airport is deemed to be the cause then no compensation is payable.

Have Heathrow actually cut slots, though, or left it to the airlines to CHOOSE the flights they will cancel,  to get departing passenger numbers below the HAL cap?

Sounds as though that makes it BA's choice and BA should still be culpable/ liable to pay out compensation (in GBP, *not* converted Euro rates) for flights they have chosen to cancel (particularly at short notice - they've been adjusting their Winter schedule recently, way outside the 14 days, so that doesn't count)

Same for other airlines

It's not clear to me that airlines choosing which flights to cancel, in order to comply with the HAL cap, would in itself negate the fact that the underlying cause was extraordinary circumstances:

An operating air carrier shall not be obliged to pay compensation in accordance with Article 7, if it can prove that the cancellation is caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken.

I'm not sure that cancelling flight B instead could really be considered a reasonable measure to avoid cancelling flight A - however, I was asking in another thread if it's been tested in court yet but suspect that it's too early for that, especially in a court senior enough to set binding precedents.

The CAA have been listing specific LHR flights that they'd consider to be extraordinary circumstances, but without actually going as far as saying that others are therefore the airline's liability:

https://www.caa.co.uk/passengers/resolving-travel-problems/delays-and-cancellations/making-a-claim/am-i-entitled-to-compensation/

No idea why BA still see converted Euro compensation as appropriate when the UK261 regulations superseded those with sterling figures, I had to take them to task on this earlier in the year too!

YouStayClassySD

Cancellation of Final Journey Leg

Due to fly back from West Coast USA to Manchester on the 16 September. The flight arrives at LHR.
Part of our ticket includes a connecting flight back from LHR to Manchester. This was booked as part of the entire ticket - not independently or as an add-on.
This connecting flight was canceled in July and we were rerouted onto a flight departing LHR 6 hours later back to Manchester.
On Monday, this replacement flight was then canceled and there is no alternative reroute available until 20 September.
We can't accept this as we have family and work responsibilities which we need to return to on the 16th.

Sooooo
After three phone calls, I've now booked independently to return by train from LHR.

This is less than ideal but I cannot wait any longer as the rail fares rise and seats home run out.

I believe I am entitled to a refund of this canceled portion?
Anything else? 

Many thanks for any advice

eskbanker

YouStayClassySD said:

On Monday, this replacement flight was then canceled and there is no alternative reroute available until 20 September.
We can't accept this as we have family and work responsibilities which we need to return to on the 16th.

Sooooo
After three phone calls, I've now booked independently to return by train from LHR.

This is less than ideal but I cannot wait any longer as the rail fares rise and seats home run out.

I believe I am entitled to a refund of this canceled portion?
Anything else?

BA is responsible for getting you all the way to Manchester at no additional cost, so in your shoes I'd claim for the cost of the rail fares, if they're unable or unwilling to reroute you on a flight in sensible timescales.  Alternatively you'd be entitled to a refund of the domestic leg instead, but that may not be worth doing if cheaper than the rail fare - do you have any visibility of what that flight was priced at within your booking?

onashoestring

YouStayClassySD said:

Cancellation of Final Journey Leg

Due to fly back from West Coast USA to Manchester on the 16 September. The flight arrives at LHR.
Part of our ticket includes a connecting flight back from LHR to Manchester. This was booked as part of the entire ticket - not independently or as an add-on.
This connecting flight was canceled in July and we were rerouted onto a flight departing LHR 6 hours later back to Manchester.
On Monday, this replacement flight was then canceled and there is no alternative reroute available until 20 September.
We can't accept this as we have family and work responsibilities which we need to return to on the 16th.

Sooooo
After three phone calls, I've now booked independently to return by train from LHR.

This is less than ideal but I cannot wait any longer as the rail fares rise and seats home run out.

I believe I am entitled to a refund of this canceled portion?
Anything else? 

Many thanks for any advice

When a flight is cancelled you are entitled to choose either refund or re- routing - not both - in this case flight offered is not suitable so you have purchased train tickets - you are entitled to claim for this expense to get you back to your destination at the earliest opportunity but not a refund as well . 

It’s up to you ( not the airline ) to choose which one you want. 

What might be tricky is working out how much the flight for this leg of the journey cost and therefore how much you will get back if you opt for a refund . 

You will need to provide receipts for the train tickets if you choose to claim for that expense instead of the refund . 

YouStayClassySD

Thanks - I've asked twice for confirmation of the cost of this unused part of the flight.
Just couldnt wait any longer so booked the train. i'll hopefully get this from them and take it from there.
Glad to know that my extra costs can be covered.

rnem170

JPears said:

JPears said:

Small claims submitted yesterday. BA have until 5th September to pay up, put in a defence or request a further 2 weeks.

BA requested an extra 14 days. Responded to Court within 2 days. Shame they didn't do that with my claim which would have avoided the cost and hassle of legal route.

Have you had any movement with this?  We still haven't had anything back from BA after we went back to them for a 3rd time.

JPears

rnem170 said:

JPears said:

JPears said:

Small claims submitted yesterday. BA have until 5th September to pay up, put in a defence or request a further 2 weeks.

BA requested an extra 14 days. Responded to Court within 2 days. Shame they didn't do that with my claim which would have avoided the cost and hassle of legal route.

Have you had any movement with this?  We still haven't had anything back from BA after we went back to them for a 3rd time.

No. BA have until 4pm 19th September to pay up or put in a defence. I check MCOL everyday. (and my credit card balance   )

YouStayClassySD

YouStayClassySD said:

Cancellation of Final Journey Leg

Due to fly back from West Coast USA to Manchester on the 16 September. The flight arrives at LHR.
Part of our ticket includes a connecting flight back from LHR to Manchester. This was booked as part of the entire ticket - not independently or as an add-on.
This connecting flight was canceled in July and we were rerouted onto a flight departing LHR 6 hours later back to Manchester.
On Monday, this replacement flight was then canceled and there is no alternative reroute available until 20 September.
We can't accept this as we have family and work responsibilities which we need to return to on the 16th.

Sooooo
After three phone calls, I've now booked independently to return by train from LHR.

This is less than ideal but I cannot wait any longer as the rail fares rise and seats home run out.

I believe I am entitled to a refund of this canceled portion?
Anything else? 

Many thanks for any advice

Just updating that several calls later I am still no nearer to knowing what the refund portion is. 
The last customer services rep suggested I keep checking while I'm on holiday as a flight home may turn up!

YouStayClassySD

My outbound flight booked with BA has also hit problems.
My arrival from MAN at LHR was just 3 minutes late.
Turned up to board our connecting flight at the AA desk to find BA had removed us from the flight and put us on one leaving 4.5 hours later.
AA believe that BA thought their flight would arrive late enough for us to miss the connection. 

If all goes well we will arrive at our destination about 3 hours later on a 3.5km+ flight.

does this scenario enable us to claim anything at all? 

Needless to say we had no idea this was happening and been assured on our connecting flight and through security there were no issues….

JPears

YouStayClassySD said:

My outbound flight booked with BA has also hit problems.
My arrival from MAN at LHR was just 3 minutes late.
Turned up to board our connecting flight at the AA desk to find BA had removed us from the flight and put us on one leaving 4.5 hours later.
AA believe that BA thought their flight would arrive late enough for us to miss the connection. 

If all goes well we will arrive at our destination about 3 hours later on a 3.5km+ flight.

does this scenario enable us to claim anything at all? 

Needless to say we had no idea this was happening and been assured on our connecting flight and through security there were no issues….

Probably not. You need to be 4 hours late or more even for 50% compensation. Keep an eye on the clock.