So - your 8 year old is having a tantrum... do you?

Luciferswench

Im sorry but if i had been hit by a child having a temper tantrum regardless be it accident or purpose having any disability is not an excuse. I am not a punchbag for any persons even if they have ASD/Autism or any other child having a temper tantrum whilst i appreciate that these children need extra support the bystander in this situation is innocent. If a grown up accidentally bumped into a person they would automatically apologise in most cases anyways. Its a bit annoying when you hear oh they have xyz wrong with them erm how does that affect them being taught manners even if you do have to reinforce it all the time. (I am a mum to a 13 year old boy with Aspergers)
I'd have expected an apology off the parent at the very least.

make_me_wise

CHRISSYG wrote: »

can you tell by looking that someone is/isnt autistic? i doubt theres any real evidence girls are less likely to be autistic , autistic children do attend mainstream schools surely as a teacher you must realize that !

I am a teacher of year 3. Yes autistic children do attend maintream schools. The spectrum of Autism is huge so in some children it is very obvious that they suffer from it. In other children it is not obvious just by looking at them. In school we are trained in all manner of techniques to help the children achieve as much independance as possible. We believe this involves them feeling happy and comfy in their environment and being able to manage their behaviours. Whether this be small visual prompts, timers, stickers etc. As most parents will know when you go out and eat with kids you take things to keep them entertained, colouring books and the like. With an autistic child you could take things to help them cope also.

Had this child in the restaurant been autistic then the whole situation could very easily have triggered the reaction and incidents described. However from the sounds of it, at best the OP got very short and rude shift from the mother. Assuming she has no learning difficulties there is absolutley no reason for her to have been rude or offensive back to the OP. Apart from anything else it would not help the child to see or hear their parent become aggressive or nasty.

I got the impression from the OP that the main problem was with the mothers handling of things not what the child did.

adelight

A! I'm guessing you're the one who got hit and this woman had a go? Even if the child does have a disability it doesn't make the behaviour "ok", I hate how autism etc have become excuses (for some people) for a child to misbehave without punishment or even a sorry to an innocent bystander who gets affected.

I once had two women shout at me in a shopping centre because ones kid rode their scooter into the back of me and fell off it. Am I supposed to look behind me at all times and jump out of the way of rampant toddlers? It was stupid on so many levels, they shouldn't even have been on the scooter and why would you let your kid just zoom off in a busy shopping centre?

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

One of my brothers has Aspergers and one of my friends' sons has ASD severe enough for him to have been educated in a special school.


Neither one of them would ever have dreamed of kicking off because they didn't get their way. My friend says she would be in some way pleased if he had done something he shouldn't at some point, because he, like my brother, accepted the rules are 'you do as you are told by Mum/the teacher' and that trumps anything else.

Anyone would think that ASD=uncontrollable, aggressive, dangerous in all cases. It doesn't. Sometimes it does, and there is a man who lives with his elderly mum near me - he had a meltdown on the bus a month ago and, because he is about six foot eight and 19 stone, there were seven police officers sitting on the bus with him to help her get him home.


But I think we should be very clear that going ballistic isn't strictly reserved for children with ASD and conversely, a child with ASD isn't by definition going to be walloping strangers caught in the crossfire.

*********

However, whilst having at go at you for complaining (quite rightly), she *could* be displacing anger felt towards her child for ruining her day yet again. I'm the type of person who would tell her that very clearly, too.


So yes, she's in the wrong, but I wouldn't brood upon it.

ETanny

My FOUR year old would be made to appologize... I'd like to think at 8yr old she'd have a lot more respect and manners then to act like a toddler.
BUT if I was in that sinario...It would definatley be A.

Padz_2

make_me_wise wrote: »

I am a teacher of year 3. Yes autistic children do attend maintream schools. The spectrum of Autism is huge so in some children it is very obvious that they suffer from it. In other children it is not obvious just by looking at them. In school we are trained in all manner of techniques to help the children achieve as much independance as possible. We believe this involves them feeling happy and comfy in their environment and being able to manage their behaviours. Whether this be small visual prompts, timers, stickers etc. As most parents will know when you go out and eat with kids you take things to keep them entertained, colouring books and the like. With an autistic child you could take things to help them cope also.

Had this child in the restaurant been autistic then the whole situation could very easily have triggered the reaction and incidents described. However from the sounds of it, at best the OP got very short and rude shift from the mother. Assuming she has no learning difficulties there is absolutley no reason for her to have been rude or offensive back to the OP. Apart from anything else it would not help the child to see or hear their parent become aggressive or nasty.

I got the impression from the OP that the main problem was with the mothers handling of things not what the child did.

Yes I agree with everything you have posted. The attitude of the mother is the issue here.

Padz_2

Jojo_the_Tightfisted wrote: »

One of my brothers has Aspergers and one of my friends' sons has ASD severe enough for him to have been educated in a special school.


Neither one of them would ever have dreamed of kicking off because they didn't get their way. My friend says she would be in some way pleased if he had done something he shouldn't at some point, because he, like my brother, accepted the rules are 'you do as you are told by Mum/the teacher' and that trumps anything else.

Anyone would think that ASD=uncontrollable, aggressive, dangerous in all cases. It doesn't. Sometimes it does, and there is a man who lives with his elderly mum near me - he had a meltdown on the bus a month ago and, because he is about six foot eight and 19 stone, there were seven police officers sitting on the bus with him to help her get him home.


But I think we should be very clear that going ballistic isn't strictly reserved for children with ASD and conversely, a child with ASD isn't by definition going to be walloping strangers caught in the crossfire.

*********

However, whilst having at go at you for complaining (quite rightly), she *could* be displacing anger felt towards her child for ruining her day yet again. I'm the type of person who would tell her that very clearly, too.


So yes, she's in the wrong, but I wouldn't brood upon it.

No I wouldn't describe myself as brooding on it but sometimes you are so gobsmacked by something that happened that you need to talk to others about it just to reassure yourself that you haven't totally lost the plot.

balletshoes

dizziblonde wrote: »

Wondered how many posts before the "must have a disability" line came out. Disability or not - you apologise to someone who's been physically hit by your child - even just a "sorry, she's autistic" or whatever - because other people have the blooming right to be able to stand in a queue without being caught in the crossfire anyway!

No-one has said "must have" a disability - just that it was a possibility - and we've all said an apology was in order too to the lady who had been hit accidentally, haven't we? Or am I reading a different thread?

moomoomama27

If that had have been my child, they would have been made to apologise, if the temper tantrum was too far advanced, but I mean at age 8? Honestly, then I would have done it on their behalf, and marched them home! I would not have a child DEMAND what they would and wouldn't eat, or DEMAND to go somewhere else with a carvery!

I also hate the line of disability being trawled out! Yes there's a chance, but most good parents would explain that should that be the case, especially of a child of that age! More than likely she was just a little s!!t, with no manners, spoilt rotten.

Gingham_R

The sweatshirt from the local school just means that the child goes to the local junior school, not that she doesn't have special needs.

Lots of children are unable to deal with disappointment or sudden change at that age.

She flailed her arms when she was standing very close to you and was clearly very upset, angry or confused - enough to cause an overflow of emotion to that extent.

It's not talked about much, but it's true that there are lots of children who simply don't learn how to regulate their emotions as quickly as other children do. There are lots of reasons for this and none of them are down to parenting.

Whereas bad parenting can certainly cause a child to kick up a fuss to try to get their own way, a child who has lost control of their emotions in this situation is not at a stage where they can self soothe. That's common in ADHD, to some extent in dyspraxia and in asynchronous development as well as, obviously, asperger's syndrome. It can also happen in otherwise developmentally average children. Some children take more time to learn how to deal with such things as change, disappointment, surprises, even having to do something they don't want to do.

In this case, it sounds to me like a child unable to manage her emotions in a socially acceptable way and that's as much as we can tell about her. We have no idea why.

Her mother sounds like she was handling it badly and maybe that's because she doesn't have good parenting skills, or maybe she's at the end of her tether with no idea how to deal with an explosive child.

Either way, we all know what she should have done with regard to the OP and maybe we all think we know how we'd deal with the daughter in that situation but unless we've actually been there, living her life with that girl, we really don't know at all.

Anyone who recognises the melt down from their own child might want to read 'The Explosive Child' by Ross Greene.

Incidentally, I would have left WAY before the stage it got to in this sad tale, but I also accept that if I was in that sort of situation on a regular, even daily, basis, I would probably just accept that's how it was going to be and go out anyway, rather than be stuck inside which is what so many parents of children whose behaviour is seen as socially unacceptable end up doing.

Edit - children do well if they can.