Is this assault?

JenJen70

My 21yr old son went to the local with friends last night, in the pub was the uncle of my son's best (female) friend, the uncle does not get on with this friend (she wasn't in the pub) or her family due to petty squabbling between his daughter & this friend who are cousins.

The first incident, which I don't think was assault, happened when my son went to the loo, this 20 stone(ish) 50yr old(ish) guy went up to my son in front of a full pub, pointed his finger in my sons face and told him to "stop f***king texting his f***king daughter or he would smash his f***cking face in" - my son pointed out that he hadn't text the daughter, didn't have a problem with the daughter & infact he had been out drinking with her on Wednesday just gone.

My son was humiliated/upset/scared by the incident and wanted to leave but was persuaded by friends to stay in the pub and just ignore this bully. Unfortunately my son the decided to vent his frustation on Facebook and wrote a status saying "fat c***", this status update was reported to the uncle who then got hold of my son by the scruff of the neck, lifted him from his seat and told him he was going to "put his face through the f**king window".

My son then left the pub and was on the phone to me when the landlady ("lady" is most certainly not the correct word for this women) came out & told him "he'd best not be phoning the f***ing police - landlady is very friendly with the uncle and denies the incident took place.

I went to the pub topick my son up, spoke to a couple of people who had witnessed the incident and decided to report what Iconsidered to be an assault to the police.

Police finally called to see my son this evening and, according to my son, the officer was very hostile & quite agressive in her manner.

The officer told my son it wasn't assault as he wasn't hurt.
That she had viewed CCTV footage and the uncle hadn't touched him - a lie as I spoke to witnesses just after who confirmed it happended.
Asked my son what he expected her to do about it.
Told my son that if she went to speak to the uncle she would be making it clear my son had requested she do this.
Also told him to expect repercussions if she did go to see the uncle.
Told my son that it was his fault for writing the Facebook status.
Asked him where he worked and would he be happy for his employers to find out about this.

I am completely at a loss with her attitude, I honestly didn't expect the uncle to face any repercussions other than a visit from the police advising his behaviour was unacceptable but she didn't seem to think it was.

What is classed as assault?
Do I just let this go and forget about it?
Should I pout in a complaint about her?

McKneff

I understand your frustration, but he isnt a baby, back him up by all means but he is an adult, let him deal with it.

To be honest, he shouldnt have vented on face book he has exacibated the situation
But you are fanning the flames.

I would just do your best to help him move on.

And stay away from the pub.

JenJen70

I normally would advise him to deal with it himself but this was a 50 yr old guy who is 3 times the size of my son.

Lotus-eater

He was a prat for putting something like that on facebook to start with.

I would advise him not to go back in that pub.

I can understand your annoyance at the female officer, but when you consider she may be out right now dealing with something really nasty, your sons little moment is a molehill.

If anything else happens I would tell the police again and you may get someone else. And tell your son to grow up, anything you write or say about someone, nearly always gets back to them.

Emmzi

and your son needs to learn how to be safe around prats, of which the world is full.

I wouldn't make a call on the dynamics of the situation without knowing how aggressive, drunk or irritating son was - and since neither of us were there, neither of us know.

let him get on with it. If he makes everything in life a battle, he won't get far.

McKneff

But if you go in all guns blazing protecting your son all your going to do is humiliate him.

I learnt that when I did it once at the school of one of mine, I vowed never again.

Just move on and tell him to watch what he's saying on face book and use some of the security offered on there by using the
privacy settings.

McKneff

I really would just move on with your life.

There could be repercussions, you dont know, but leave it now while its still on a low heat.

jumpedtheshark

JenJen70 wrote: »

My 21yr old son went to the local with friends last night, in the pub was the uncle of my son's best (female) friend, the uncle does not get on with this friend (she wasn't in the pub) or her family due to petty squabbling between his daughter & this friend who are cousins.

The first incident, which I don't think was assault, happened when my son went to the loo, this 20 stone(ish) 50yr old(ish) guy went up to my son in front of a full pub, pointed his finger in my sons face and told him to "stop f***king texting his f***king daughter or he would smash his f***cking face in" - my son pointed out that he hadn't text the daughter, didn't have a problem with the daughter & infact he had been out drinking with her on Wednesday just gone.

My son was humiliated/upset/scared by the incident and wanted to leave but was persuaded by friends to stay in the pub and just ignore this bully. Unfortunately my son the decided to vent his frustation on Facebook and wrote a status saying "fat c***", this status update was reported to the uncle who then got hold of my son by the scruff of the neck, lifted him from his seat and told him he was going to "put his face through the f**king window".

My son then left the pub and was on the phone to me when the landlady ("lady" is most certainly not the correct word for this women) came out & told him "he'd best not be phoning the f***ing police - landlady is very friendly with the uncle and denies the incident took place.

I went to the pub topick my son up, spoke to a couple of people who had witnessed the incident and decided to report what Iconsidered to be an assault to the police.

Police finally called to see my son this evening and, according to my son, the officer was very hostile & quite agressive in her manner.

The officer told my son it wasn't assault as he wasn't hurt.
That she had viewed CCTV footage and the uncle hadn't touched him - a lie as I spoke to witnesses just after who confirmed it happended.
Asked my son what he expected her to do about it.
Told my son that if she went to speak to the uncle she would be making it clear my son had requested she do this.
Also told him to expect repercussions if she did go to see the uncle.
Told my son that it was his fault for writing the Facebook status.
Asked him where he worked and would he be happy for his employers to find out about this.

I am completely at a loss with her attitude, I honestly didn't expect the uncle to face any repercussions other than a visit from the police advising his behaviour was unacceptable but she didn't seem to think it was.

What is classed as assault?
Do I just let this go and forget about it?
Should I pout in a complaint about her?

Technically: first incident might have been assault, depending on how it was perceived by your son; second incident was battery. IF the police officer said it turns on whether or not your son was physically harmed, she is wrong. I'd be very surprised if she actually said that. Anyway, the CPS definitions are available here: http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offences_against_the_person/ (scroll down to the section on "Common Assault").

JenJen70

My son wasn't drunk - he didn't have time to get drunk! He's a fairly quiet lad which is what I find so frustrating, he didn't mouth it to the guy, has nothing what so ever to do with this family dispute and according to others in the pub what happened was unprovoked (the first incident) and totally out of order.

I appreciate the police have a lot to contend with, however surely they can't just ignore less serious incidents because of this?!?!

Oldernotwiser

JenJen70 wrote: »

I normally would advise him to deal with it himself but this was a 50 yr old guy who is 3 times the size of my son.

Most people would say that a young man had a big advantage over an overweight middle aged man.

JenJen70

jumpedtheshark wrote: »

Technically: first incident might have been assault, depending on how it was perceived by your son; second incident was battery. IF the police officer said it turns on whether or not your son was physically harmed, she is wrong. I'd be very surprised if she actually said that. Anyway, the CPS definitions are available here: http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/l_to_o/offences_against_the_person/ (scroll down to the section on "Common Assault").

Thank youfor that info, I did try Google but was unable to find clear clarification.