Argos won't give me my item paid for with gift cards

Optimist

mcbain wrote: »

I thank everyone forvtheir comments but I was rather hoping for a definitive answer on wether a contract has been formed & not a debate about the ethics of the lead up to going to buy the item.

It is my opinion that a contract has been formed under consumer regulations. If it were a b2b transaction then it is more debatable.

You have a couple of options. Wait until they have concluded their investigations or write a letter before action giving them say a week to pass over your goods or you will take action in the Small Claims Court. However you will then need to raise a claim do not just threaten.

Either way you have a wait.

If in the unlikely event it did go as far as court it would be up to Argos to show that their actions were reasonable.

Note that my area of expertise is more criminal law and consumer related law is more of a hobby. (Sad I know)

DVardysShadow

NCISROCKS wrote: »

I pay for gift vouchers with a dodgy cheque and get vouchers, contract concluded. I attempt to use vouchers and the merchant detects a problem and retains them pending investigation. Is that reasonable?

You really are missing the point.

OP has provided goods in accordance with the games for vouchers deal. So the 'dodgy cheque' you mention is a red herring. OP has provided good games for gift vouchers. Contract concluded. Everyone has what they expected to have. No reason whatsoever to reopen the games for contract deal. It is just down to Argos to stop defaulting on their own vouchers.

Honestly, Argos are fools. They are devaluing their own vouchers because you cannot be sure to get value for them.

highstx

I know Mcbain personally, and do what he's done regularly to make my purchases cheaper. I told him the following. A consumer rights program was on tv a while back and educating people of their rights. They took an item in a shop and priced it wrong at a silly cheap price. They then waited for a customer to spot the mistake or deal and purchased it. They saff was told not to detag the item on purpose to create a reason to bring the guy back.

The guy paid and went to leave with his item got to the doors and the alarm went, they said don't worry tags not been taken of and took him back to the till, where one of the staff then looked closer at the item and realised there was a mistake on their part with the price and said sorry we didn't charge you the correct price, and will need to refund you or charge you the correct price. The guy wasn't having it at first but in the end folded with pressure and took a refund.

Then someone came out and explained once that item wa paid for a contract had been made and that item was his and regardless of the shop making an error they had no legal right to take it back and refund it with his express agreement.

I see the above no different in this case, Mcbain made and completed a sale, he has a Recipt to show he now owns a iPad and Argos need to for fill that agreement/sale.

The gift cards are not stolen, or fake but intact aquired legally.

texranger

highstx wrote: »

I know Mcbain personally, and do what he's done regularly to make my purchases cheaper. I told him the following. A consumer rights program was on tv a while back and educating people of their rights. They took an item in a shop and priced it wrong at a silly cheap price. They then waited for a customer to spot the mistake or deal and purchased it. They saff was told not to detag the item on purpose to create a reason to bring the guy back.

The guy paid and went to leave with his item got to the doors and the alarm went, they said don't worry tags not been taken of and took him back to the till, where one of the staff then looked closer at the item and realised there was a mistake on their part with the price and said sorry we didn't charge you the correct price, and will need to refund you or charge you the correct price. The guy wasn't having it at first but in the end folded with pressure and took a refund.

Then someone came out and explained once that item wa paid for a contract had been made and that item was his and regardless of the shop making an error they had no legal right to take it back and refund it with his express agreement.

I see the above no different in this case, Mcbain made and completed a sale, he has a Recipt to show he now owns a iPad and Argos need to for fill that agreement/sale.

The gift cards are not stolen, or fake but intact aquired legally.

well i have told Mcbain he needs to contact Argos HQ and provided a contact for him, but he seesm reluctant to contact Argos HQ

highstx

texranger wrote: »

well i have told Mcbain he needs to contact Argos HQ and provided a contact for him, but he seesm reluctant to contact Argos HQ

How many times have we called cs or hq to speak to a monkey on the other end reading from a screen. Told one thing to then ring back and be told something else by the next it's a roll of the dice at best of times. Half the staff don't even know the company they work for trades games in or how to do it. So I can see why. Although info believe he is going to email instead which is a better way you can get your case put across in detail and if some moron at the other end doesn't know what your talking about they can forward it to someone else without you having to repeat your self.

Me personally I would of kicked off big time in that shop if they refused to give me my goods after payment, I would of called the police, not 999 but 101 and wouldn't of left that store without something. Like mentioned some staff like to make rules up to make them feel important.

I've had a supermarket call the police on me because the thought the 18 games I traded in where stolen, all different titles over 3 console formats. They paid me and everything, I thought all was well until 2 miles down the road I had 2 cop cars pull me over pin me in and ask me in the back of the cop car while another was sent to the store to see what was going on.

Lucky for me I had recipts for all the games and explained what I was doing, it took 45 mins to check everything but the copper let me out saying I'm not doing him for working the system to his advantage to earn some extra money, he's not broken any laws. Why this company didn't just pull me to aside when in the shop and ask me I don't know.

My car plate is now marked and when ever checked will show the incident of what happend.

texranger

highstx wrote: »

How many times have we called cs or hq to speak to a monkey on the other end reading from a screen. Told one thing to then ring back and be told something else by the next it's a roll of the dice at best of times. Half the staff don't even know the company they work for trades games in or how to do it. So I can see why. Although info believe he is going to email instead which is a better way you can get your case put across in detail and if some moron at the other end doesn't know what your talking about they can forward it to someone else without you having to repeat your self.

Me personally I would of kicked off big time in that shop if they refused to give me my goods after payment, I would of called the police, not 999 but 101 and wouldn't of left that store without something. Like mentioned some staff like to make rules up to make them feel important.

I've had a supermarket call the police on me because the thought the 18 games I traded in where stolen, all different titles over 3 console formats. They paid me and everything, I thought all was well until 2 miles down the road I had 2 cop cars pull me over pin me in and ask me in the back of the cop car while another was sent to the store to see what was going on.

Lucky for me I had recipts for all the games and explained what I was doing, it took 45 mins to check everything but the copper let me out saying I'm not doing him for working the system to his advantage to earn some extra money, he's not broken any laws. Why this company didn't just pull me to aside when in the shop and ask me I don't know.

My car plate is now marked and when ever checked will show the incident of what happend.

the email i gave is direct to the Argos Parent companies Exec Office, so you wont get higher in the group

CynicalScotsman

Lol! You are the guy profit protection have been briefing us on!!

Unfortunately, I think you have have been stung by the real-time data mining software on the tills! Chances are your games will be returned, as Im sure they have been collected centrally.

DVardysShadow

CynicalScotsman wrote: »

Lol! You are the guy profit protection have been briefing us on!!

Unfortunately, I think you have have been stung by the real-time data mining software on the tills! Chances are your games will be returned, as Im sure they have been collected centrally.

I doubt it. Even if they tried it, Argos have had their opportunity to refuse the voucher trade, so too late for them to pass the games back - even if they could find them. And OP can demonstrate by receipts that the games were acquired individually. So no breach of T&C's.

Yes, it may have been data mining - but if it is it is poorly thought through. What should the system do if - at the stage of presenting the vouchers - there is a suspicion of the presenter being anything other than a private individual? Voiding the vouchers is totally unacceptable.

rochja

McBain sounds a lot more sensible and reasonable than a number of the correspondents here. He has gone to effort and expense to try and take advantage of a store offer. Yes it does look like a commercial enterprise in breach of both the terms and spirit of the game trading part of the offer and yes over generous offers by companies in the past have threatened commercial viability - see some of the groupon discussions. Offers are about market share and profitability and GUS are not doing too well in some parts of their operation. It is easy to see why a store manager would not wish to see the spirit and terms of an offer abused. Both sides could take an entrenched position leading ultimately to a costly civil settlement in which I suspect GUS could find themselves the losers. In the longer term that could make us all losers. Who wants to waste time effort and money trying to rid themselves of dead computer games on ebay or a Sunday market? McBain would you be prepared to write to the store detailing the argument and your current losses and offering to negotiate a lesser settlement? I suspect if you stick to your guns you will at the expense of lots of effort and stress 'win' but you are fighting a store manager who had to make a snap decision and one that will have only been one facet of his workload. I think your argument is more to do with fairness than 'RIGHTS' and you just want a fair outcome. Perhaps you can come to a 'without prejudice' agreement of some kind either for the purchase of the i thingy or recompense for your loss and leave the legal arguments aside

DVardysShadow

rochja wrote: »

McBain sounds a lot more sensible and reasonable than a number of the correspondents here. He has gone to effort and expense to try and take advantage of a store offer. Yes it does look like a commercial enterprise in breach of both the terms and spirit of the game trading part of the offer and yes over generous offers by companies in the past have threatened commercial viability - see some of the groupon discussions. Offers are about market share and profitability and GUS are not doing too well in some parts of their operation. It is easy to see why a store manager would not wish to see the spirit and terms of an offer abused. Both sides could take an entrenched position leading ultimately to a costly civil settlement in which I suspect GUS could find themselves the losers. In the longer term that could make us all losers. Who wants to waste time effort and money trying to rid themselves of dead computer games on ebay or a Sunday market? McBain would you be prepared to write to the store detailing the argument and your current losses and offering to negotiate a lesser settlement? I suspect if you stick to your guns you will at the expense of lots of effort and stress 'win' but you are fighting a store manager who had to make a snap decision and one that will have only been one facet of his workload. I think your argument is more to do with fairness than 'RIGHTS' and you just want a fair outcome. Perhaps you can come to a 'without prejudice' agreement of some kind either for the purchase of the i thingy or recompense for your loss and leave the legal arguments aside

NO!!!

Even if McBain was a commercial enterprise, there are only 2 courses open to Argos here - return the games or provide the value on the vouchers. And even returning the games depends on Argos being able to prove that McBain is a commercial enterprise. Anything other than these 2 remedies, and Argos are acting ultra vires [beyond their powers] in effectively confiscating the games and denying McBain the value that is rightly his.

Now on some arguments there is a case for trying to broker compromise. But in this case, if McBain does this - certainly at this stage - it will entrench Argos's petty [in the sense of local] manager in her position and make any resolution hard to achieve short of a total loss the McBain.

Really, this would be a disastrous tactic. He should write a Letter Before Action and take this to the small claims court. Argos would not wish to fight this or be seen to go forward and defend it.