Feeling rich and lost...

poet123

Despera wrote: »

A very useful perspective. And I really like the auburn kitten on your picture.

I agree, children do not need all those trimmings while they are young - they will be happy with whatever we offer. But as they get older it gets trickier. They want to go on holidays abroad like their friends, they want gadgets like their friends’, they ask questions why Johhny's dad has a bigger car than ours. They too want to feel adequate. I felt it very clearly when I changed schools at the age of 12 and found myself in a much posher crowd than my previous friends. Kids feel it too, not just parents. And a lot does come down to pure evil money.

My son has a football table (not hugely expensive, £50) and I also succumbed to buying him the play station. And it did help him to be more sociable and confident because when he invites friends over he knows they will have fun. Of course, my home-made cottage-cheese pancakes are contributing too.

As for education - I still believe that even if a child is happy at school it doesn't necessarily mean that he is getting good education academically. So it is my job as a parent to make those choices for him while he is too young to understand.

And on your salaries you can provide all of those things and more.

What you cannot do (rather, would not be wise to try to do) is "buy" into the ever increasing cycle of perceived "upward mobility" via ever bigger houses and cars which you kill yourself to pay for, and sacrifice family time to get.

There will always be those who have more, who seem to have it all, (the reality may be somewhat different) where do you stop and actually enjoy life?

Our salaries would have supported a much bigger mortgage than we have ever had. We live in a lovely leafy suburb, in a great house, with lovely neighbours. We chose not to overstretch ourselves, which having had three sons to put through university and another yet to go was a good decision.

Bricks and mortar are just that, go on good family holidays, make memories. Losing your parents so very young will have taught you that life is finite, don't waste it striving for something that will always seem out of your grasp.

If you parents could come back and give you some advice what do you think that might be? Carry on as you are or relax, kick back, and enjoy what you have? My guess is the latter, so if you want to make them proud, enjoy your career, enjoy your family, make their legacy, your happy family.

blue_monkey_2

Despera wrote: »

A very useful perspective. And I really like the auburn kitten on your picture.

I agree, children do not need all those trimmings while they are young - they will be happy with whatever we offer. But as they get older it gets trickier. They want to go on holidays abroad like their friends, they want gadgets like their friends’, they ask questions why Johhny's dad has a bigger car than ours. They too want to feel adequate. I felt it very clearly when I changed schools at the age of 12 and found myself in a much posher crowd than my previous friends. Kids feel it too, not just parents. And a lot does come down to pure evil money.

My son has a football table (not hugely expensive, £50) and I also succumbed to buying him the play station. And it did help him to be more sociable and confident because when he invites friends over he knows they will have fun. Of course, my home-made cottage-cheese pancakes are contributing too.

As for education - I still believe that even if a child is happy at school it doesn't necessarily mean that he is getting good education academically. So it is my job as a parent to make those choices for him while he is too young to understand.

I have noted the bold bits FROM YOUR POST. Your kids want to go abroad - I thought they already go abroad?

Look, sod paying the mortgage in 7 yeas and give them a life, pay it off in 15 years. In 7 years your son will have left home and you'll be left with 'I wish we had done more together' and then it will be too late.

Children have no conept of adaquecy. This is what YOU have put on them, you have placed YOUR feelings of inadaquecy onto them and they are only young - what on earth are they going to be like when they are older? YOU are the one damaging them and I am sorry if you did not want to hear but this is true.

When your son asks why Johnnys dad has a bigger car you say 'because he wants it, he does a lot of driving for his job and we do not need a bigger/newer car so we have the car that we have'. Do not teach them to be ashamed of the things you can afford without resorting to a ligfe on credit. You CANNOT give your children everything they want or everything their families have - or should that read, what YOU want and what YOU want to have, you need to give them a life that is comfortable and that you can afford. You are making excuses now. And they are poor ones.

In an ideal world my son would like the entire Lego City range. I can afford it but he is not having it. I am not having him be a spoilt brat who thinks he asks for something and he gets because someone at school has it. He gets to understand the value of money, he gets pocket money (which they - I have 2 kids - have to earn) and he can see the money mounting up so he can see what goes into earning that money to afford he things he wants. I think this is a lesson your kids need tbh.

You risk your children growing up to be as hung up on money as you are and it is not a nice trait. Deal with this now - and get your son out of those posh after school clubs you think are doing him the world of good, you are damaging yourself and him. If they are for education, get him a home tutor instead.

I did love the way you said you mixed with 'normal people and they were nice too' with the smiley face as if they were some kind of 2nd class citizen but you would mingle with them anyway. I am pretty sure that anyone who read that comment saw the same thing.

You cannnot keep on making excuses about this. Get some help for this before it screws your family up even more.

balletshoes

BugglyB wrote: »

Unfortunately resentment, along with jealousy, bitterness and anger, is one of those emotions we can't help feeling! Telling people not to feel the way they do is pretty much one of the most unhelpful things you can do!

I disagree with this - because jealousy, bitterness and resentment especially are totally negative emotions, and only eat up the person feeling this way. They don't change anything, whereas learning to let go of these feelings does make a huge difference to having a positive state of mind.

sarahs999

Hi Despera

I've read the whole thread and I have a lot of sympathy for you. We have quite a few similarities but some big differences too. Namely that I don't have 90k in the bank!

I do, however, live in London, have a joint income like yours and often find myself wondering where on earth our money goes. We seem to have very little disposable income. Though you have yours in the bank - I think I've misunderstood something somewhere. Can't you afford private school with the money you've got from your monthly salary?

ANyway, I think you are suffering very much from a feeling of being inadequate that has its roots in your childhood experiences and parental expectations, from what you've written on here.

But also, in running with a crowd who have more than you, materially, you are always going to be in danger of feeling so inadequate. I can sympathise. I went to a state school but got into Oxbridge. My first few weeks were an eye-opener. I couldn't believe how other people lived, what they thought was normal, the privilege that they casually brushed over but that clearly they had felt entitled to all their lives. These people were the haves. Before I met them, I was pretty sure I was a 'have' too - I had a nice childhood, a nice house, went to a good local school and holidayed in Devon each year. Suddenly I was unhappy with my lot, and insecure. What was this alternative life I'd had no idea about, these people who all 'knew' the schools they had gone to but had never heard of mine, and who glazed over when I talked about my life? It was life-changing and it took a long time for me to come to terms with it. I had a boyfriend who was a 'have' and I struggled, in retrospect, to try to keep up with the expectations, the lifestyle, everything that his class took for granted. it was a pretty toxic relationship but I found it hard to escape once I was in the grip of it - the aspiration thing is a powerful drug.

So I understand a little of what you're feeling. But I'm worried that you're teetering on depression. In your posts, though you are thoughtful and measured, even with people who have been harsh to you, there is very little 'soul' or spirit coming through. You don't talk about your kids or your husband in a joyful way. Do you like working? Do your children bring you happiness or do you feel you need something more for you (it's a very un-PC question but an important one)? Is your husband supportive and kind, and does he know how you feel?

Just some thoughts. Plus I think it's brave of you to come on here with your problems - you always risk the wrath of the 'you should be grateful' brigade. I just wish you could be plucked out of your life for six months and popped into something madly, radically different (camp in the rainforest? Musicians' co-op in San Francisco?) to see that there are so many ways to get happiness, and that the place you're searching isn't going to lead to it. I don't have the answer (I'd be doing it myself if I did) but I do have to agree with the other posters that your kids will adore you for time, not money, spent, and soon, much too soon, they will be gone.

Also, you mention your mum and dad died a short while ago. My mum died last year and I so wish I'd spent more time doing all the things with her that I kept thinking 'I must take mum here, do that, try this'. But I never had time, because I was working, living away from home, blah blah. Sure, I did some of it, but I should have done more. I bet your mum would tell you to enjoy your life now and stop living for the future, especially as she died relatively young.

Hope you find some peace.

blue_monkey_2

Sarah, what an excellent post. Thank you for sharing your story. I felt there was no soul to her posts too, the smiley faces are there, the 'post' is not there with it so the smiley faces seem weird and expressionless (I did write that in my last post but thought it sounded stupid so I took it out, LOL).

Despera

blue_monkey wrote: »

I have noted the bold bits FROM YOUR POST. Your kids want to go abroad - I thought they already go abroad?

Look, sod paying the mortgage in 7 yeas and give them a life, pay it off in 15 years. In 7 years your son will have left home and you'll be left with 'I wish we had done more together' and then it will be too late.

Children have no conept of adaquecy. This is what YOU have put on them, you have placed YOUR feelings of inadaquecy onto them and they are only young - what on earth are they going to be like when they are older? YOU are the one damaging them and I am sorry if you did not want to hear but this is true.

When your son asks why Johnnys dad has a bigger car you say 'because he wants it, he does a lot of driving for his job and we do not need a bigger/newer car so we have the car that we have'. Do not teach them to be ashamed of the things you can afford without resorting to a ligfe on credit. You CANNOT give your children everything they want or everything their families have - or should that read, what YOU want and what YOU want to have, you need to give them a life that is comfortable and that you can afford. You are making excuses now. And they are poor ones.

In an ideal world my son would like the entire Lego City range. I can afford it but he is not having it. I am not having him be a spoilt brat who thinks he asks for something and he gets because someone at school has it. He gets to understand the value of money, he gets pocket money (which they - I have 2 kids - have to earn) and he can see the money mounting up so he can see what goes into earning that money to afford he things he wants. I think this is a lesson your kids need tbh.

You risk your children growing up to be as hung up on money as you are and it is not a nice trait. Deal with this now - and get your son out of those posh after school clubs you think are doing him the world of good, you are damaging yourself and him. If they are for education, get him a home tutor instead.

I did love the way you said you mixed with 'normal people and they were nice too' with the smiley face as if they were some kind of 2nd class citizen but you would mingle with them anyway. I am pretty sure that anyone who read that comment saw the same thing.

You cannnot keep on making excuses about this. Get some help for this before it screws your family up even more.

That was very harsh and deeply offensive. You have no right telling me that I am damaging my children just because you read my posts through your perspective. Posh after-school clubs? Life on credit? Making excuses? Oh my God!

blue_monkey wrote: »

I did love the way you said you mixed with 'normal people and they were nice too' with the smiley face as if they were some kind of 2nd class citizen but you would mingle with them anyway. I am pretty sure that anyone who read that comment saw the same thing.

What do you mean, where in my posts could you ever see that?

blue_monkey wrote: »

Children have no conept of adaquecy.

You are wrong.

KiKi

sarahs999 wrote: »

ANyway, I think you are suffering very much from a feeling of being inadequate that has its roots in your childhood experiences and parental expectations, from what you've written on here.

But also, in running with a crowd who have more than you, materially, you are always going to be in danger of feeling so inadequate. I can sympathise. I went to a state school but got into Oxbridge. My first few weeks were an eye-opener. I couldn't believe how other people lived, what they thought was normal, the privilege that they casually brushed over but that clearly they had felt entitled to all their lives. These people were the haves. Before I met them, I was pretty sure I was a 'have' too - I had a nice childhood, a nice house, went to a good local school and holidayed in Devon each year. Suddenly I was unhappy with my lot, and insecure. What was this alternative life I'd had no idea about, these people who all 'knew' the schools they had gone to but had never heard of mine, and who glazed over when I talked about my life? It was life-changing and it took a long time for me to come to terms with it. I had a boyfriend who was a 'have' and I struggled, in retrospect, to try to keep up with the expectations, the lifestyle, everything that his class took for granted. it was a pretty toxic relationship but I found it hard to escape once I was in the grip of it - the aspiration thing is a powerful drug.

I completely agree.

It's all very well looking back to your childhood for answers, but rarely is that the only answer. The OP explained that she felt very proud owning her first car, and moving to a 3 bed house from her flat, so I *don't* believe it all stems from childhood and pleasing her parents (I think we can be all too quick to jump to those sorts of conclusions!).

When you live in an area where everyone *seems* to have more than you, you're bound to want what they have, or feel like you're not good enough. When 'extravagant' is 'normal', it's hard to take a different perspective.

A number of people have suggested the OP move areas, take her DS out of the weekend educational club, or take some time for her to get some perspective. But I think right now she's so taken up with what she doesn't have, and is so blinded by this ideal of what her money should be able to achieve that I don't think she can see past it.

KiKi

Despera

sarahs999 wrote: »

I've read the whole thread and I have a lot of sympathy for you. We have quite a few similarities but some big differences too. Namely that I don't have 90k in the bank!

I do, however, live in London, have a joint income like yours and often find myself wondering where on earth our money goes. We seem to have very little disposable income. Though you have yours in the bank - I think I've misunderstood something somewhere. Can't you afford private school with the money you've got from your monthly salary?

My 90K in the bank are a house deposit (we are buying now) so I won't have them very soon. Your house may have the same or more in equity so it's the same thing really.

I can afford private school on my salary alone - but my daughter didn't get a place in Reception so will go to the state school. And I am reluctant to move my son from the school he likes (he is year 3) to an independent one. So probably no private education for now, until it's time for junior/secondary.

KiKi

Despera wrote: »

That was very harsh and deeply offensive. You have no right telling me that I am damaging my children just because you read my posts through your perspective. Posh after-school clubs? Life on credit? Making excuses? Oh my God!

Despera - you asked for a different perspective. This was someone else's perspective.

Don't jump down their throats if you disagree with something they're posting - they're simply responding to what they see, based on what you've posted. That's all anyone can do on here.

You might not like people's responses, nor agree with them, but you asked for a different view, and so you will get some of those!

KiKi

Despera

KiKi wrote: »

I completely agree.

It's all very well looking back to your childhood for answers, but rarely is that the only answer. The OP explained that she felt very proud owning her first car, and moving to a 3 bed house from her flat, so I *don't* believe it all stems from childhood and pleasing her parents (I think we can be all too quick to jump to those sorts of conclusions!).

When you live in an area where everyone *seems* to have more than you, you're bound to want what they have, or feel like you're not good enough. When 'extravagant' is 'normal', it's hard to take a different perspective.

A number of people have suggested the OP move areas, take her DS out of the weekend educational club, or take some time for her to get some perspective. But I think right now she's so taken up with what she doesn't have, and is so blinded by this ideal of what her money should be able to achieve that I don't think she can see past it.

KiKi

No, I am considering everything I have read here.

I really wouldn't like to move. It is always difficult to create a new circle and it's taken me a long while to start feeling at home here - and I had lots more time to go out and make friends back then.

The educational club is really nothing, it's 1 hour and my son loves going there, it's not really an issue.

Making time for myself though is something I must do. Just don't know how.

Suppose I am not quitting my full-time job because it brings twice as much as self-employment. On the other hand, if I start turning down jbb offers from my clients to free up some time they will soon turn elsewhere. My industry is very competitive and it's taken me 4 years to build up my client base so I wouldn't like to lose it. Should something go wrong with my full-time job the self-employment will still be there for me as my safety net.

One solution though would be to start delegating work to my colleagues - that way I would keep the client but wouldn't need to work unconvenient hours.