Redten Internet offer FREE computer woth £500 if you sign up for 3 years @ £19.99 pm!

firstclassidiot

He may not be a director but he is still the proprietor/trader and he holds the consumer credit licence.

mac0

firstclassidiot wrote: »

He may not be a director but he is still the proprietor/trader and he holds the consumer credit licence.

I have a better name for him but that would breach this sites rules i should reckon :rolleyes:

alexajx_2

dont know if anyone has come across this page, will paste below

http://www.moneysupermarket.com/c/broadband/consumer-rights/2/

1. Communications Act 2003 im not sure on this one because they are a "re-seller" but i believe they are legaly required to be a member of either OTELO or CISAS, they do not appear to be a member of either, which i believe are regulatory bodies that handle complaints formally if the providers complaints system does not handle satisfactorily(in redtens case non existant) IN ANY CASE THEY ARE BREAKING THE LAW by not complying with the Communications Act, and by not providing a complaints system or any reliable form of communication whatsoever

2.Sale of Goods & Services Act: Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and The Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 retailers AND service providers must sell goods that are:

• Of satisfactory quality
• Are fit for purpose
• Service is delivered as described
• Provide services to a proper standard of workmanship.

we may have rights under the sale of goods act as i dont believe the 8mbps UNLIMITED (upto 8mbps-5kbps- - 5gb capped) service meets any of the above

3.Unfair Contract Terms Act we may have grounds on the fact that they have changed the terms and conditions unfairly in an attempt to rip us off basicly i refer to redtens contracts old and new

Termination and Cancellation of Contract
(printed from redtens website around jan07)
12.10.if at any time BT ceases to provide services to us such that we are unable to continue to provide the services, to you, we may immediately terminate our contract with you. You will be given the option of retaining the PC, with no refund, or canellation of of any finance agreement; or returning the PC and recieving a refund for whole months remaining or cancellation of the credit agreement as applicable.

(current copy taken from redten website 20/3/08)

12.10 If at any time our Broadband supplier ceases to provide
services that we are unable to continue to provide any of
the Services to you, we shall seek alternative to provide and
you will then need to transfer to the new Broadband supplier.
We will not be liable for any costs incured by yourself during
this process. You will continue to pay the monthly charges
for PC/hardware you have purchased.

and there is also the old get out clause

6.8 Redten Internet reserves the right to switch from BT

Wholesale to an alternative broadband network offering an equivalent or better level of service.

12.12 Should we increase the Charges or make any Contract
modification, which is likely to be of material detriment to
you we shall provide you with 14 days written notice and
the increase or modification will take effect from the end
of that period. If this occurs you may be entitled to
terminate your Contract by giving us written notice
detailing the proposed modification at any time on
providing us with 10 working days notice, such notice to
expire before the price increase or detrimental contractual
modification takes effect. If you terminate your Contract
in these circumstances the relevant provisions of this
clause 12 shall apply.

12.13 If you give us notice to terminate the Service, you will be
responsible for transferring to another service provider. If
you fail to arrange this before our Service to you ends,
you may be left without any broadband service.

i think most companies try to fob you off with this clause they can claim that you were notified in writing, but we the customer have not recieved anything post or email and therefore they have covered themselves (companies who give these kinds of ongoing contacts are required to notify you of ALL contract changes) although we were not actually notified until AFTER service went down, we should be entitled to cancel our contracts under this clause 12.12 as per their CURRENT contract clause 6.8 (this clause does not exist in the previous contract) they have swithed and are not providing equal or better service, but slower and not unlimited as described, we may possibly have to pay a cancellation fee (i have broadband only and have a letter stating the cancellation fee for broadband only is £29.99, which it does not state anywhere on either contract) and with regards to the pcs they will have 30 days to arrange their collection from you at a time that is convenient to you, and judging by their track record they arent going to do anything about this. (can they keep an appointment?)

Consumer Law Relating to Broadband

Communications Act 2003: Within the Communications Act it states that all communications providers, (including broadband providers) must implement and comply with a dispute resolution scheme. This means that all broadband providers must be a member of either OTELO or CISAS in order to comply with the Communications Act regulations.
This means that every consumer is protected in some form by one of the two alternative dispute resolution schemes. Please be aware that an ADR is there if you can’t get a problem resolved using the providers normal complaints procedure and does not act as a replacement for it.

Sale of Goods & Services Act: Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and The Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 retailers AND service providers must sell goods that are:

• Of satisfactory quality
• Are fit for purpose
• Service is delivered as described
• Provide services to a proper standard of workmanship.

How this relates to broadband in the Act is that a consumer can claim a full refund or compensation if they can prove that the service was not delivered as described, was not fit for purpose beforehand, or is not to a satisfactory level of quality or workmanship.
Using these points in an argument with your broadband provider may give you some credibility but you would still need to find proof in an ADR meeting or legal challenge against a broadband provider and this could prove tricky.
The only way to argue the case for the Act is by looking at the terms of service within the broadband contract and seeing whether they have offered the service as advertised or referring to the “deadlock letter” and what the provider has done to resolve your problem. This may help you if you take the matter to an ADR or court.
Unfair Contract Terms Act: The original Unfair Contract Terms Act was in 1971, but has since been updated in 1995 to include a section on Consumer Contracts, (broadband providers contracts fall under this). What this means is that a consumer can submit a court action stating that they think their broadband contract is unfair and cite the Act.
The Act says that a consumer is not bound by a standard term in a contract with a seller or supplier if that term is unfair. This gives the Office of Fair Trading and others powers to stop the use of unfair standard terms, if necessary by obtaining a court injunction. Ultimately, only a court can decide whether a contract term is unfair, but in many cases broadband contracts are some of the most unfair terms of all, it’s useful to know that there is a legal precedent to protect consumers from poor contract terms.

Ironside

I know hindsight is a wonderful thing,

But I know others must have wondered why we had to pay the £19.99 monthly through a loan agreement with a third party, rather than direct to RedTen each month.

I would have had no hesitation in stopping my £19.99 DD if it was paid direct to RedTen and there was no Clode involvement.

As I've said previously, I consider myself a fairly light user of the internet, but have just found out that I need to download some big files, never had to download this amount before - so it's a one-off, but it's going to smash 5GB.

It has been mentioned that RedTen are still advertising for new business stating UNLIMITED broadband.....perhaps new users will have a different backbone supplier which IS unlimited?

It seems fairly clear that RedTen want us all to leave them for the broadband service and pay-off Clode. :mad:

I'm a fair person, but I feel aggrieved at having to pay Clode off at about £420 outstanding just for the computer, when I should be getting another 21 months of broadband AND the computer for the same amount.

I would be okay if they will allow me to stop paying now, leave their broadband service and collect their computer...but no way am I going to be penalised with a £150 re-stocking/admin fee. :mad:

benjimoron_2

Just been down memory lane and thought I would share some interesting posts with you:

A_Nice_Englishman wrote: »

Doesn't sound like a sound business plan to me.

If you're willing to take a gamble on losing your Internet access and perhaps having your leased PC reposessed if they go bust and don't think the cost of Internet access will come down over the next three years it's probably worth a go.

Avallon wrote: »

I've registered but having 2nd thoughts.

The arrangement seems to be as follows:

You take out an Interest Free loan with v12 for £769 which you then repay over three years. As this is a separate company I wonder what would happen if the Broadband Service goes belly up...

Also, if you end your contract early you have to pay a hefty £150 restocking fee, or you have to pay a substantial part of the pc's value back.

And finally, if you move you have to pay £49.99...

valli2 wrote: »

I thought being locked into a 12 month contract was bad enough but 3 years is bolted in.
Seems unsustainable to me i guess we will know in about 3 years time or maybe 6 months.

Anarchist wrote: »

Might be worth reading through terminations due to breach of contract. If they do fail to provide an adequate service, or any at all, or if they put the price up because they can't keep it at such a low price,

Then just terminate the contract due to the breach. Depending on policy wording (or advertising - if they state its a 'free PC' when you sign up...) you will be able to leave penalty free, plus keep the PC as that was free, the contract was for the broadband.

benjimoron wrote: »

My experience has been very similar to yours, I have been without internet for two days, I phoned straight away and was told that it would be on the next day, it wasn't so phoned again and asked to speak to the manager, they were busy so would phone me back that day, well they didn't but it's working this morning so I'm reasonably happy. Speed only came out as about 700kbps but I was happy with 576kbps before. Don't think it makes much difference unless you're downloading huge files or streaming video from a web site. I use emule sometimes and it never goes at broadband type speeds anyway. Anyway back to the topic at hand, looking forward to receiving the pc in a few weeks, would be interested to know what graphics slot it has. Customer service doesn't seem that great so far but then I had exactly the same problems with AOL, worse in fact so they gave me two months free broadband. Wonder if Redten will give anything?

Remember to keep the pc (and all packaging) in very good condition just in case it needs to be returned for any reason. (read their terms and conditions)

rizla01 wrote: »

I agree, great lot at Watford but the problems arise when this part of the company get's sold off to another company that milk their purchase for all it's worth and cause mayhem for existing customers who are tied in for the next three years and they refuse to relinquish MAC numbers and then make a loss for their own company that they can then write off as a tax loss!!

Nah, Could never happen.

Perhaps I have too vivid an immagination.

firstclassidiot

I agree with your views on hindsight and certainly wont go down this credit partner business again. Apart from anything else, it restricts you to no choice of the credit firm or manner of the credit. I fully intend to follow this through legally and legitimately.

I am not a heavy user, dont download films etc. but use the net for business, work, banking, shopping, etc and I use far in excess of 5GB a month.

The PC was an added bonus for me; I went with redten for the speed and the bandwidth and all in cost of 19.99. I was on 4mb/s previously and wanted 8.

The difference between 4m/s and 8m/s is phenominal. I can only get 8m/s on my line at the moment but will be enabled to 24m/s in September which was why this was a good deal for me. The free upgrade to 24m/s was why I signed.

If I can get them to restore and honour those conditions, then I shall stay.

If I cannot do that, then they have broken the contract and I shall leave. I shall pay only the outstanding worth of the PC or they can uplift it.

I have advised Clode of this by leter and have given them 5 days to get it sorted with redten.

I think it is important that a decision is made before 11.4.2008 as that is when you can get a mac from NJP as despite what anyone says I think the whole business has been transferred to NJP and if you want or need more than 5GB you wont get it unless redten pay the difference each time. redten are buying the whole services from them on each of our behalfs.

The money is therefore going from us to clode to redten to NJP.

If I do not get a response from redten in the 5 working days; I will notify clode of their formal default and my withdrawal from the contract as a result.

I will then seek a mac and move.

I will offer to buy the remaining PC worth only or alternatively they can uplift it.

I will be quite happy to defend myself in court if they push it.

I have the evidence of slow connections and kept record of my attempts to contact all parties to this transfer.

More importantly I have given them formal warning that they have breached the contract and given them the opportunity to fix it.

Thats what the law requires me to do. If they do not do it, they are at fault and are not entitled to rely on any of the terms of the contract.

Wil let you know how I get on.

Have a connection just now of 6.2m/s and the difference is wonderful --will only last til about 9 o'clock though.

regards all

UPDATE --Spoke too soon --speed down now to 5.01m/s and falling.

edgyalbert

"I would be okay if they will allow me to stop paying now, leave their broadband service and collect their computer...but no way am I going to be penalised with a £150 re-stocking/admin fee"


I second that. All I want to get out of this fiasco is a clean getaway!!

Ironside

Hi Firstclassidiot, I first thought that I would like to pay the residual value of the PC to them and clear off.

But I saw the T&Cs posted on here re residual values.
In the first 12 months of contract it is £500
12 months to 24 months is £400
24 to 36 months is £250

I am 15 months in, so they deem the residual value to be £400 (I would have thought £250 to be fairer)

That's why I made the point, though -not very clearly - that I am loathe to pay them £400 just for the computer, (whether its by paying off Clode, or paying the residual value) when for about the same amount I should be getting broadband access for a further 21 months AND the computer.

alexajx_2

the more i think about this whole thing the more i think something fishy is going on with redten, i mean the trading history alone isnt looking good.

does anyone have a copy of clode/v12 finance contract?

im up for legal action against these cowboys, i feel sorry for everyone that has a pc.

professa

my connection is too slow now for me to look back through this thread to the post that mentioned this, but someone listed the directors of redten and njp. i noticed at the time they shared a director. has anyone managed to find a list of directors for clode to see if any of the usual suspects are on it.