Bitter sister in law

Alittlesad

dizziblonde wrote: »

Both sides of this sound hideous - you're all "ME ME ME ME ME and she's bitter cos she didn't worship ME ME ME ME ME" and she behaved hideously inappropriately as well.

I've lost two pregnancies and three babies since one set was twins this year - most of my family break pregnancy announcements incredibly sensitively to me (doing things like letting me know prior to big "let's toast the good news" type dealies and things so that I can prepare myself, know to take a deep breath, fix the smile to my face and then head to the loos to sob afterwards)... is that "tiptoeing around someone" as well? Am I a "bitter twisted old spinster" since I struggle to go massively enthusiastic about news and just manage a quiet smile while I'm ripped to shreds inside? I suppose I'm evil for not buying a Xmas gift for my cousin's baby but instead sending money in a card with a note saying "look, I'm in no mental shape to cope with gift shopping for a baby right now - buy what she needs."

You're equally as spiteful in that you're ignoring all others' feelings and assuming they'll drop everything to rejoice over your announcement. You've not considered her views in how you broke the news - like she didn't consider your feelings in how she reacted.

On a more general note - To those who sit there and are just mocking those who are involuntarily childless and do struggle horrifically with these announcements - would you accept someone who'd just lost their mother and was grieving having a rough time on Mother's Day? Those who can't have kids, or who are struggling, or who've had miscarriages have to grieve too - in exactly the same kind of way but a less tangible (and less tolerated) way... you might not have to grieve for one lost person (or in my case three - gawd 2010 sucked), but you have to grieve essentially for your entire OWN lost life, for all that planned path you had, for all those hopes and dreams you have and it's a hellish experience and takes a blooming long time... then you have to have one heck of a lot of guts and resillience to start to make the road less travelled the path you take your life along... sometimes you find a shortcut to scramble back onto the more conventional highway, sometimes you don't. I'm sure my own sister in law would think I'm the bitter one - I haven't rejoiced in her pregnancy announcement which came between the two miscarriages I've had this year... I've just stayed the heck out of the way as a self-protection mechanism for myself - no insensitivity, no outspokenness... but at the same time as she, rightly has the right for her feelings to be considered and valued - so does her brother and myself and we needed that distance ourselves to heal up. If I ever find out she's sat there complaining about that (she's the sort who probably would) - THEN I would rip her to shreds.

But, and I acknowledge this is a more distinct situation but various posters jumped on the stereotype so I'm jumping in to counter that, to sit there and refuse to acknowledge in general the hideous awfulness that pregnancy announcements are for those who got a bum deal when life handed out the cards... to sit and label them all as bitter because they smiled, said well done and then sat quietly, without an appreciation for the fact that raising that smile required every ounce of emotional strength - that's not on either. To give you an example of how hard it can be - a family friend, who knows about the crap that we've gone through (years of infertility followed by repeated miscarriages) made a quip (he's the sort with the sensitivity of a brick when there's a witty comment to be made) about how he "expected diz to be getting on and producing a kid sooner rather than later" - it knocked me so far down I cried myself to sleep for a good couple of nights over it - it can really hurt, you can react in what might seem to be very "bitter" ways - but that's self preservation and one of the stages of grieving for things... it's really quite amazing how spot-on the stages of grief are when dealing with this all actually (I was quite cross when I realized I was being completely typical!).

Don't judge us all too harshly - it's a pain that many of you thankfully don't know and you can never really imagine or empathise with.

I am truly sorry for your losses and have some experience of those losses myself. Lets just say that this pregnancy didn't come easily to me. My sister in law has not suffered such losses so I can't explain her behaviour by that. I am sorry that you think I am "hideous" and " me me me" and all I can do is assure you that I have made every effort with my SIL.
If I didn't care for her feelings I would not be in this dilemma of how to deal with this situation and would take the advice of some of the posters who have advised me to tell her exactly what I think.

shellsuit

Dizzie, it's not fair to have a pop at the OP as your situation is completely different and I can't see anyone say they would think the same of the SIL had she not had any children, but wanted children.

If you were the SIL, then of course it would have been awful, but this is a lady who just has a very strong opinion on anyone wanting more than 2 children.

andrealm

Dizziblonde,First of all, I'm very sorry for your losses, you have been through a lot. We don't know whether the SIL is childless through choice or not. Maybe she would have loved children and is sad that she was never in a position to have them, or maybe she is happily childfree, we just don't know. Given her views on overpopulation I don't think anyone expects her to rejoice about the pregnancy, but they do feel that she has behaved very badly by throwing a hissy fit about it. She could have wished them well or just sat quietly and said nothing? Instead she has made it all about her.

The difference is, you try to be nice to be others even though it's very upsetting for you and nobody would think you bitter and twisted in the slightest for struggling to deal with it. I have not lost a baby myself, but would totally understand if someone who had lost one stayed out of the way if a pregnancy was being toasted, I wouldn't think badly of them at all.

andrealm

Dizzi, just to add, I'm sure no one is mocking you or anyone else in your situation. Unfortunately some people can be very tactless.

You mentioned how someone who'd lost their mum might feel on Mother's Day, well I lost my mum when I was 15 and that's something you never get over, and you often find yourself in a situation where someone who doesn't know assumes you still have a mum. Or you hear someone talking about their mum and it hurts and maybe you feel they're taking their mum for granted and don't know how lucky they are. But I wouldn't throw a hissy fit and take my feelings out on someone who's lucky enough to still have their mum.

flower24

coolcait wrote: »

Isn't 'being polite' very much part of 'conforming to conventional opinion'?

No I think it's more about keeping your unconventional opinion to yourself if you know it may hurt somebody!

k.o.d

andrealm wrote: »

Dizzi, just to add, I'm sure no one is mocking you or anyone else in your situation. Unfortunately some people can be very tactless.

You mentioned how someone who'd lost their mum might feel on Mother's Day, well I lost my mum when I was 15 and that's something you never get over, and you often find yourself in a situation where someone who doesn't know assumes you still have a mum. Or you hear someone talking about their mum and it hurts and maybe you feel they're taking their mum for granted and don't know how lucky they are. But I wouldn't throw a hissy fit and take my feelings out on someone who's lucky enough to still have their mum.

Have to agree with all of that.
My mum died earlier this year, quite a short battle with cancer, I miss her like mad, but I really don't expect anyone to walk around on tippytoes because they may upset me.
She is missed every day, but I see my dad coping and opening himself (they were married for 49 years) up and talking, so you have to look to the living, they are the people that need the love and affection.
I don't think I am insensitive, just accept that this is the natural order of things.
Dizzi, can't even begin to know how you feel as that must be utterly devastating.

Plans_all_plans

I'd previously posted about IVF and how I disagreed with it (but certainly wouldn't reiterate my feelings to someone who was announcing an IVF pregnancy) Coolcait responded thus:

coolcait wrote: »

But I think there is a difference between someone telling you something like that, and the situation the SIL was put in.

If someone tells you, one to one, you have the opportunity to make a non-comittal comment.

If someone says, in a group, "oh, we must toast so-and-so, because...", then you have no way to be non-committal.

If everyone in the group knows how you really feel, there has to be a chance that they'll be watching to see how you react.

Not a comfortable situation.

.

You do have a way to be non-commital in a group situation where a toast is proposed: quietly don't raise your glass and if someone asks you why you didn't (unlikely in my experience) then you could say "you know my opinions on this subject" and if pushed, just say "I don't want to spoil a happy moment for my relatives, so I wish to say no more on the subject."

Going back to the IVF: if a friend of mine proposed a toast when announcing an IVF pregnancy, I wouldn't be so ignorant as not to raise a glass. Whatever my (deeply held) views on the subject, it is not for me to spoil someone else's happiness, particularly when reiterating my feelings has no purpose as the child has already been conceived. I certainly wouldn't think them insensitive towards me if they did raise a glass in my presence (and under such circumstances) either.

I agree with seven day weekend's comments on abortion too. I feel exactly the same on the issue and would have reacted to her friend in the self same way, as sometimes your principles are not as important as supporting others. It doesn't make you a hypocrite, but an empathetic human being.

c_l_a_i_r_e

This thread has been an interesting read, but in the end I'm not sure what the OP wanted to achieve by posting.

Its clear that you're not really close to your SIL, and that you don't particularly think very highly of her (both before and prior to this incident) so I am not sure why in all honesty you are seeking to scrutinize her behaviour and seek out a reason for it.

You knew her views on the issue, and presumably knew she wouldn't be the sort to fall over herself congratulating you so why prolong your own misery by dwelling on it. Just let it be - as long as you and your husband are happy ( and your parents in law as well) does it really matter that the SIL isn't. Not everyone cares when someone else announces a pregnancy or birth - some are just not maternal, or are just carrying their own emotional baggage and imo by seeking to over analyze the situation like this you are only going to make matters worse for all of you.

I would just let it be. Its not tip toeing around, or pandering to SIL to acknowledge that her views and attitude are different to yours. Its also ok to wish she would have reacted differently, and to be disappointed that she didn't but unfortunately thats just life and you have to deal with it and move on.

Plans_all_plans

Claire I dont think the OP is so much upset that the SIL wasn't happy for them, more that she was so blatantly rude by saying she'd treat the 3rd child differently, as some sort of misplaced nod to her principles.

Indeed the OP should let things lie as you suggest, but I think the OP was looking for ways to approach the situation going forward (given the SIL's presents comment) rather than cause an overpopulation debate.

DogsBody

A very good friend of many years announced her (only) pregnancy to me thus - 'I know you'll think I'm mental, but....', to which my response was 'you know I think you're mental but I'm happy that you're happy'. We are good friends and have had many a full and frank exchange of views, no harm, no foul, all good. If it was someone I didn't know well (eg our lads SIL), and I found myself in the position of the OP's SIL, I'd probably just smile vacantly, say nowt and drink nowt. The difference being, we are not good friends and have no need to be.

There's no need to fall out just because you have different opinions - unless you want to. The OP should not feel that she has to hide her happiness, tiptoe around SIL etc, but neither should the SIL. If you don't want to fall out, can't you just agree to disagree? Just because you can argue ferociously with someone doesn't mean you have to take umbrage/fall out/start feuding Rise above it, it can only upset you if you are willing to let it :A