Bitter sister in law

Alittlesad

Also, you keep saying that it is not right that she was put in that position. Why then is it right that we who are so very happy about this pregnancy should be put in the position we were?

Alittlesad

coolcait wrote: »

Or is it an indication that your SIL's family doesn't care about her feelings as much as they care about her brother's?

Without going into too much detail her family have put up with alot from her over the years. She has been prickly, difficult, insulting and overly opinionated to her family for many years. She has caused upset on a great many occasions and acted in a very spoiled way if people disagree with her or get attention for what she considers to be the "right" reasons. Maybe my FIl just decided to stand up to her and be allowed to express some joy for a change.

whitewing

I don't think her timing was right but I really don't think you should dwell on it.

When I had DD some relatives wrote on the card that they were so happy that our family was now complete (I already had DS). I was slightly surprised as I didn't particularly remember that I'd made that decision, lol, but it changes nothing and I'm pretty sure they meant it in a postive manner.

coolcait

Plans_all_plans wrote: »

I personally disagree with IVF for ethical reasons, but I certainly wouldn't tell my opinion to a colleague announcing an IVF pregnancy for example. Also, all my friends know my opinion on it from when we were at uni and discussing such things, but I certainly wouldn't reiterate it to them if they announced an IVF pregnancy later in life!! This would be total bad manners and show an appalling lack of taste.

We can all have differing opinions, but it's best to be polite and tactful when we put these forward.

But I think there is a difference between someone telling you something like that, and the situation the SIL was put in.

If someone tells you, one to one, you have the opportunity to make a non-comittal comment.

If someone says, in a group, "oh, we must toast so-and-so, because...", then you have no way to be non-committal.

If everyone in the group knows how you really feel, there has to be a chance that they'll be watching to see how you react.

Not a comfortable situation.

The OP has been at pains to explain how she is in a good financial situation to have a third baby. It has already been mentioned on this thread that she might not have received such a positive reception on here if she was on benefits. The SIL might have received more support for her views under those circumstances.

Maybe etiquette books do need to consider advice for people who find themselves unable to wholeheartedly and honestly toast a pregnancy - cases where the mother is on drugs or addicted to alcohol, for example. Those addictions will have a physical impact on the unborn baby, even before you consider the risks and dangers he or she may face growing up in those circumstances.

I'd be hard-pushed to raise my glass (although cowardice would probably over-rule my principles - not something I'd be proud of).

If an etiquette book could come up with a way for me to keep my principles under those circumstances, without having to make an obvious stand, I'd be very grateful.

The method could then be transferred across to predicaments such as the SIL's.

If the person who made the toast was fully aware of the circumstances, I'd also have a serious word with them, in private, afterwards about how I felt.

treliac

Alittlesad wrote: »

I started this thread to see how other people would react. I don't want to cause a family rift and don't want my husband or inlaws to be hurt.

You and your husband can provide a happy, secure and stable family life for your children and it's up to you both to decide how many children you want and feel able to care for. I'd say your children are very lucky to have you as their parents.

What ever problems any of your inlaws have, I hope you don't let them affect your marriage and plans for your own family. If any member of my family declared they would treat one of my children differently from another, I would ensure they didn't have sufficient access to my children to convey their discrimination. If anyone else in the family didn't like that, then tough.

What you and your husband can give your children will more than make up for the loss of any extended family.

Good luck. Hope you have a good pregnancy and continue to enjoy your family.

Rockporkchop

Not impressed with your SIL at all, she should definitely have kept her opinions to herself. I have a different analogy to the slightly bemusing slavery and drug taking ones posted. I tried for children myself for well over a decade and have spent more evenings than I could possibly count raising a glass to whatever happy couple had just announced their pregnancy that day. Even though sometimes it nearly killed me to do so, I always smiled and made sure I looked happy for them. You don't ruin someone else's moment with your miserable thoughts and opinions, it's just basic adult manners.

I eventually had triplets so I wonder what your SIL would make of me - would she only pick two to buy for?!

coolcait

Alittlesad wrote: »

Also, you keep saying that it is not right that she was put in that position. Why then is it right that we who are so very happy about this pregnancy should be put in the position we were?

As I said in post 199:

"I simply do not understand why - in a family which knows about the SIL's views, and has often described her among themeselves as 'bitter', and is well aware that she is 'outspoken' at best, but more often described as 'rude' - her own father would put her, his son, his pregnant daughter-in-law and the rest of the family in this situation.

He could have made the toast when she wasn't present. Avoiding the awkward situation.



Your SIL did not behave well. I don't believe anyone on this thread has said otherwise - even those who take the view that she was put in a difficult situation.

However, everyone present was put in a difficult situation the minute your FIL decided to propose that toast in her company. There was no need for him to choose that occasion to 'stand up to her', as you put it. The rest of you could have shared your joy, and toasted your happiness, when she wasnt' present.

treliac

coolcait wrote: »

He could have made the toast when she wasn't present. Avoiding the awkward situation.

On the other hand, toasting the parents to be and their good news is an entirely normal thing to do. Why should the whole family feed into the dysfunctional behaviour of one member?

purplerose

The whole over population thing concerns me too. I think if you're going to have kids at all you should have 2; one to replace yourself and one to replace your partner. I have fairly strong views about this kind of thing, I don't even want kids myself because I think the future isn't looking too rosy. However, if any family member or close friend of mine wanted to have more than 2 kids and got pregnant then I would congratulate them as it's something that's important to them and I realise not everyone shares my views and I respect that. For the SIL to say she isn't going to buy gifts for the 3rd is just being petty. It might be an offhand comment born of jealousy or it might be an opinion that changes once she's met the wee one, you never know. If her attitude doesn't change I'd either avoid her or not accept gifts for any of the children from her. It's all very well caring about the environment and all that but this is a real live future family member she's talking about excluding and family should come first.

LilacPixie

treliac wrote: »

On the other hand, toasting the parents to be and their good news is an entirely normal thing to do. Why should the whole family feed into the dysfunctional behavior of one member?

this is pretty much my thinking too.. From what I have understood from the thread, I may have missed something but MIL so i guess the mum of both the dad to be and his sister ( the SIL) called a few days before Christmas and told the SIL that the OP and the OP's husband were to be parents again. MIL and FIL both excited about new addition to family due in 2011 etc etc.

Christmas day arrives and family is all at MIL & FIL home for the day/occasion. FIL chooses in his own home/domain/ perceived position as head of family to make a toast to the baby, sounds pretty normal to me TBH. SIL then kicks off, refuses to raise a glass and announces she will not acknowledge baby number 3.

Sorry to me that does not sound like a knee jerk reaction the the 'news' it sounds like a contrived attempt to either 'hurt' her brother and the OP or her parents. The other option is it was some sort of attempt to seek attention.

Not quite the same and maybe not even similar but Christmas lunch was in my home this year, my dad did the toast because it is important to him as he views himself as head of our 'family'. My parents are devout catholics, I am somewhat lapsed and my husband follows no religion at all. There were no religious references in his toast out o respect for our beliefs in our own home, in his home there would of been and we accept as adults that he holds views that differ from ours but respect his right to have those views just as he respects our wishes.