Parking - The great debate

bromsgrovebarry

PPC Guy
Just one more thing, the Parking 'industry' needs to do something to improve its image and that is support a ban on clamping. You seem to want to manage car parks and prevent abuse and derive an income from providing a service. Clampers merely exist to prey on the unsuspecting. They do not prevent abuse but actively encourage it by entrapment. They practice extortion. Clampers scare people away from car parks and therefore damage trade. If your trade wants a future, get rid of the chancers, scammers and thugs. Anyway, time for others to speak their mind but have a good new year.

ppc_guy

As i have said and am trying to shw by entering into a sensible discussionIi dont operate on these methods. Yes i issue tickets but for sensible infractions as i see them. Ie if a car is in a 500 car site and there are only 4 cars in who cares if he parks on 1,2,3... bays its not like they are goign to be needed anyway. On the other hand at a seaside resot on a site with 30 spaces during peak season the vehicle turnover would be massive so it is only selfish of a person to take 2 bays BUT this would be decide on is the offending vehicle actually rendering the other space totally useless?
Charging for loss is always a funny subject because loss could be determined on any number of factors. If for example i patrols a site which had just one space but sold fine art then the loss could be thousands due to a customer not being able to get in. So does this mean i would be fair to charge £1000 for a ticket at this site?

Sir_Roger_deLodger

ppc_guy wrote: »

Simple. The small guy has to have business insurance or there would be issues if the place was ever broke into. The carpark on the other hand doesnt have to have barriers. The cost of a barrier can be a few grand which is money a small guy would not be able to afford and never have any way of recouping. As a result his customers would not be able to park over time and get annoyed thus going elsewhere to shop and eventually causing him to lose custom to a level he has to shut.

If a small business really had problems with unauthorised parking then unfortunately he would have to find the money. Equally if the same business had problems with frequent break ins he would have to find the money for huge steel shutters and massive insurance premiums, or as you say shut down. Thats life I'm afraid.
As you run a PPC and my views on PPCs are well known we are never going to agree on this. I have no intention of going around in circles as has happened on other threads.

ppc_guy

bromsgrovebarry wrote: »

PPC Guy
Just one more thing, the Parking 'industry' needs to do something to improve its image and that is support a ban on clamping. You seem to want to manage car parks and prevent abuse and derive an income from providing a service. Clampers merely exist to prey on the unsuspecting. They do not prevent abuse but actively encourage it by entrapment. They practice extortion. Clampers scare people away from car parks and therefore damage trade. If your trade wants a future, get rid of the chancers, scammers and thugs. Anyway, time for others to speak their mind but have a good new year.

I HATE clampers. I am sure on operating in this area is operating on some Savills land without consent but as its bank holiday Savills are shut. If he is i will be reporting him to the local media in order to aid some of his customers away from him. He also charges £95+V.A.T per year per sign and keeps all money from the clamps!!!!! So nto only is he extorting the people he clamps but indeed he may be doing so without consent and whre consent is given he is extorting the companies too.

Last i saw was that clamping was meant to be outlawed in mainland England and wales which was due t be announced in the November 10 freedom bill but im not sure what the situation is on that however i am willing to say i would be glad of the day them cowboys are gone (however again there are SOME ethical clampers who have a very low release fee)

ppc_guy

Sir_Roger_deLodger wrote: »

If a small business really had problems with unauthorised parking then unfortunately he would have to find the money. Equally if the same business had problems with frequent break ins he would have to find the money for huge steel shutters and massive insurance premiums, or as you say shut down. Thats life I'm afraid.
As you run a PPC and my views on PPCs are well known we are never going to agree on this. I have no intention of going around in circles as has happened on other threads.

Nor would i ask you to go round in circles. I am simply hear to find out what you guys think will work.
I know some people on here will never see eye to eye and thats life

bromsgrovebarry

PPC Guy- I know you do not do clamping. It may be difficult to determine 'reasonable loss' but if overstayers and abusers are to be invoiced, that it what you will have to do. The word 'reasonable' is always the subject of hot debate but perhaps somebody can suggest something. I am not against motorists being charged to park, I am strongly against the use of bogus 'fines' to rob the vulnerable and gullible.

PS I missed your reply, glad you want clamping banned too.

iolanthe07

I think your problem is that more and more people are becoming aware that private penalty charges have no force in law and can therefore be safely ignored. We know that civil proceedings are just not worth your expense and hassle. If I inadvertently over stayed in a private car park I would be prepared to pay a charge of £10 - £20, but any more than this and the county court judge can decide, in the unlikely event that it ever got that far.

ppc_guy

lately UKCPS have taken a liking to the court system and they seem to be winning some cases. people think this is a set up but im not sure i havent gone in depth on the reviews but maybe court will soon become a regular occurences?

Driver8

ppc_guy wrote: »

lately UKCPS have taken a liking to the court system and they seem to be winning some cases. people think this is a set up but im not sure i havent gone in depth on the reviews but maybe court will soon become a regular occurences?

Prove it.

Prove just one court case where a judge as fined someone for breach of a so called PPC's terms of contract. Go on prove it.


Who the hell do you think you are to go around "fining" people?

The PPC industry must be really on it's knee's if it comes to coming on here seeking advice.

As with the link with those idiot's with "fast track law degree's" setting up another scam firm.

I left this for people to peruse;


PRIVATE PARKING TICKETS - DON'T PAY!
IT IS NOT A FINE! YOU HAVE DONE NOTHING ILLEGAL!

This is an information page for the thousands of people who receive "tickets" from private companies in the UK ever day at supermarkets, retail parks, and in any other privately-owned carpark.

We are NOT encouraging anybody to openly flout parking restrictions on private land, or to refuse to pay reasonable charges for parking. Landowners have a right to make reasonable charges for the use of their land.

For advice specific to your case, you should visit the forums at http://forums.pepipoo.com or http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/parking-traffic-offences.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=163

1. What you should know about these companies

It is important to remember that private parking companies (or PPCs as they are often called) have NO OFFICIAL POWERS - that's right, none at all! They give out their "tickets" on the basis that you have seen the signs in their car park and that you have therefore agreed to a contract obliging you to pay a certain sum of money.


2. What happens to people who don't pay?

In 99.9% of cases, absolutely NOTHING! The company pays the DVLA £2.50 to get your address, and then sends lots of threatening letters. In the main, these letters can be safely IGNORED. The only way the company can actually force you to pay is by taking you to the small claims court, which costs them even more money. And they are by no means guaranteed to win! And they practically never do.

The two main reasons for this (among others) are the following:

- Only the person DRIVING the car could ever have agreed to any such parking contract. The company can only get the Registered Keeper's address from the DVLA: you don't have to tell them who was driving.

-Many of these charges are so extortionately high that they constitute a penalty, which is unenforceable in a consumer contract.


3. Can they affect my credit rating?

NO! The only way your credit rating could be affected by ignoring private parking companies is if you were taken to court, lost, and then still refused to pay. But they will not take you to court.


IN SHORT

The vast majority of the time, you can safely IGNORE tickets from private parking companies, they are not official fines.

The vast majority of the time, you can safely IGNORE the threatening letters, including those from debt collection agencies.

You DO NOT have to pay a penny of your hard-earned money to these companies. Remember that the chances of being taken to court are very slim indeed.

DO NOT IGNORE COURT PAPERS!
If you receive real court papers from a private parking company (very rare) then you should go to http://forums.pepipoo.com or http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/parking-traffic-offences for help defending the claim. Do not be afraid to sign up and ask questions regarding any paperwork you are not sure about.



Don’t believe the above? Watch a solicitor on Watchdog advising you what to do with the scam invoices.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAIcdi9niHA

THEY ARE NOT FINES

Only the Police, Courts or Council’s can fine you. NOT a private company, please remember that.


When the weather is better i will continue to stick that on hundreds upon hundreds of car's to get the message out.


Absolutely nothing you say on here will convince me PPC's are not doing it for money or providing a "service".

robredz

ppc_guy wrote: »

lately UKCPS have taken a liking to the court system and they seem to be winning some cases. people think this is a set up but im not sure i havent gone in depth on the reviews but maybe court will soon become a regular occurences?

If it is a Tesco site or one that uses Retail loss Prevention, to bill shoplifters for Civil Recovery remedies, and innocent people who they mistakenly pursue ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_8403000/8403379.stm ), maybe the ppc will go in with RLP and they will extend the "Database Of Dishionest Actions" to include parking charge evaders by treating it like alleged shoplifting, and issuing an invoice for £135 or so for "investigating" the evasion on top of the £80 unenforceable charge, and then test the edifice in court?

Were the UKPS cases undefended and therefore won by default?