ive resigned from work

bigmacman

SarEl wrote: »

Oh - you think? Really? Wrong. Oh yes I have been a victim of crime. Sorry statement on these days - who hasn't? Despite that - if you were to give the Howard League (for Penal Reform) a ring and give them a few basic details you have garnered about me from this site - it will take them less than 3 minutes to work out who I am. The same goes for Prisoners Abroad. Add to that the fact that I am an indepndant inspector of prisons (including young offenders institutions and immigration detention centres) and I do this in my "spare time".

You may have noticed -not my area of law. This is a commitment over many years. Oh, should I add that each year my practice ( which is a small employer - less than 10 permanant employees) takes an offender (not an ex- offender) for a one year work experience (with pay) to give them a chance - how many legal practices do you think do that? How many do you think are prepared to have the argument with their professsional body to allow it?

So you want the truth? I have nothing at all against the vast majority of convicted criminals. And I will lay bets that I know a lot more than you do. Some of whom are serving life sentences and are actually really not very nice people - although that doesn't include all people serbving life sentences.

So what do I have against the OP. Here it is. Well for a start off, I did not pass any judgement him in my original post. He had lost his job due to his own dishonesty (fact) and his "incapacity to work" was a direct result of his own actions (fact). No opinon - fact. On this basis I could see no way that the benefits agency would see this as anything other than a "voluntary" unemployment (also fact). Because the OP did not like this, he chose to have a go at me for this opinion. He may not have liked it, but it was all fact.

And then some peope come along and think that because you say something hard (not harsh) then you don't understand.

So let's have a good look at our "reformed character". He was dismissed in December, I believe, for a sustained theft from his employer. The employer found out - so he didn't have a "Road to Damascus" and realise what he did wrong and own up - and sacked him for gross misconduct and the employer called the police in. But heh, he immediately had his Road to Damascus and realised that he was an addict , had done wrong, and needed to put his applecart in order. Great.

Only - a month later he is on this site trying to get advice on how to lie to potential new employers about what he "didn't do" by claiming that he may have been "travelling" for the odd five or six years! Check out his history - it's all in the threads! But ok, maybe his "Road to Damascus" was a little later than that.

Two months ago he was on the threads again - check it out. He'd decided to becaome a student, and wanted to know if he could get a student loan. Not because he needed one (he lives off his parents - he says) but because he owes money on loans and he thought that maybe he could get a student loan (which won't be due to be paid off for years - in his words) for being a student, and then use it to pay off other debts he has. Now what is the word I am looking for? Begins with F. Taking money for one legitimate purpose, but using it for something else entirely. Oh yes - fraud. But maybe he hadn't had his "Road to Damascus" yet. Fair enough.

He was bloody lucky not to be sent to jail last Thursday. I really wouldn't recommend jail. And I have been in more than the OP has and probably more than you have - although unlike you I do not make assumptions based on not a shred of evidence, so maybe that isn't true. But as I stated before - it takes more than a few months ( or a few days) to be "rehabilitated". The OP stole money from his previous employer and was only "found out" seven months ago, and since then he has on this site demonstrated a willingness to continue to be dishonest. Have you any idea how many people "do the right thing" like 'fess up after the event, and do some voluntary work, to avoid being held fully reponsible for what they have done - and then go on to do it again?

There are people on this site who have ended up out of work and unable to claim benefits - or narrowly getting benefits - due to dishonest employers. More who are getting close to that. They deserve sympathy. Have a look at someone like Boopops - sacked for gross misconduct on trumped up charges because she was off sick too long. Did she lie to potential employers - no. Did she have an easy time of it - no. Did she get a job and show what she was made of - yes. Do I expect something more of the OP than conveniently forgetting that he has continued to at least think about continuing to be dishonest (and in some instances has been dishonest) - well if he wants to be considered a "changed person", then yes I do. Do I expect to see this "changed person" for more than a few weeks - well yes, I do.

But unlike you, I am willing to put my money where my mouth is. I have no idea why it was a daft and impossible suggestion to say that if you were so convinced, you should let him know what vacancies were going at your workplace. So here's the thing. Our curent "placement" has nine more months on contract with us. If the OP would like to PM me then at the end of that placement I will personally contact his probation officer and make an offer of 12 months work experience, on a fair wage, provided he has stayed out of trouble in the interim.

I will not guarantee that nobody is going to make reference to his "background", and I can positively guarantee that nobody will be accepting any excuses for it. And I can absolutely guarantee that nobody will be in the least bit ready to sit back and accept any further dishonesty. It won't be glamourous. It won't always be a bundle of laughs. And not a single excuse is will be accepted. But if the OP wants to take this up the offer is there, and not a single one of our "success stories" (and I admit - we have failures) has ever failed to go on to full and meaningful employment.

There's a lot of crap around aboit "rehabilitating" criminals. It's cute sitting around on the edges and telling people what they ant to hear, or "forgiving them" 15 years on. It is a damned sight harder doing it when you are taking risks - and the OP is a risk. He is living off "mummy and daddy", he'd prefer not to own up to what he has done unless he has to to, and he'd think about a "wide chance" if it pays him. Not even close.

there is some fair points to be honest but when your got bills to pay you do think of silly things to do but wether you do them is a different thing when common sense kicks in. Yeah we discussed them things but did i do them i dont think so.I think we just need to leave it as a difference of opionions really.

SarEl

viktory wrote: »

Here's another one who hasn't read the whole thread. The OP was actually offered a 12 month job offer - which he has failed to accept. That is not, in my opinion, 'getting slaughtered'.

Just to confirm, the OP has now contacted me. If it works out it won't be for some time as the vacancy is currently "occupied" and there are some conditions which have to be met - we had to argue long and hard with our professional body to allow offenders into a chamber in the first place. But lets see how it goes.

bigmacman

SarEl wrote: »

Just to confirm, the OP has now contacted me. If it works out it won't be for some time as the vacancy is currently "occupied" and there are some conditions which have to be met - we had to argue long and hard with our professional body to allow offenders into a chamber in the first place. But lets see how it goes.

Just to confirm im taking this offer into consideration as it wont be until next year that it will be vacant.Aswell i need to see if college is right for me aswell. I would like to thank Sarl e for the offer its nice to see people putting there money were there mouth is.

bendix

Could I politely advise SarEl to make sure everything in his office is firmly nailed down to the desk, or locked in drawers.

We wouldn't want any more unpleasant incidents, would we?

SarEl

bendix wrote: »

Could I politely advise SarEl to make sure everything in his office is firmly nailed down to the desk, or locked in drawers.

We wouldn't want any more unpleasant incidents, would we?

She has been doing placements for offenders for many years. The office security is high because it has to be - our clients expect it. But whilst I cannot claim that every one of our placements has worked out - we have never had an incident in the office or connected to the office as a result of taking on offenders. That's the difference between being realistic and being prejudiced. We assume people can change, but we require more than their word for it.

bigmacman

bendix wrote: »

Could I politely advise SarEl to make sure everything in his office is firmly nailed down to the desk, or locked in drawers.

We wouldn't want any more unpleasant incidents, would we?

so so so funny...........
NOT

tiny bit narrow minded people are

SarEl

bigmacman wrote: »

so so so funny...........
NOT

tiny bit narrow minded people are

Can I make a suggestion? Don't react. You got into this entire thread by doing so! You are understandably touchy, but you do have a tendency to fly off and assume that anyone who refers to your conviction is having a go, and as you are now aware, they aren't always having a go. Anyone who is, well - live with it and rise above it. You did the crime and some people will never change their minds about you - just as some criminals never change! Such is life. You don't have to sepnd your whole life apologising for what you did when you were young and stupid. But right now, since you only just "qualified" you may have to swallow your pride and stay calm.

bendix

Blimey . .talk about Road to Damascus conversions. Just a page or two ago, you were ripping into this guy calling him a thief and a liar. Not only that but you did a fantastic job investigating his previous threads to expose him as a liar.

Now - suddenly - you're the archetypal good samaritan, offering this wayward youth a second chance to atone for his sins and offering him wise counsel to be patient with those who . . ummmm . . are following your example.

So which is it, my dear do-gooder. Is he a liar and a thief, or is he just misunderstood now that you've offered to give him a job? Make your mind up.

Savvy_Sue

bendix wrote: »

So which is it, my dear do-gooder. Is he a liar and a thief, or is he just misunderstood now that you've offered to give him a job? Make your mind up.

To be fair, SarEl put certain very clear conditions on the offer, because she's not in a position to know whether the OP is a reformed character or not. None of us are, not even the OP at this stage, IMO.

bendix

Savvy_Sue wrote: »

To be fair, SarEl put certain very clear conditions on the offer, because she's not in a position to know whether the OP is a reformed character or not. None of us are, not even the OP at this stage, IMO.

Well, I'll put money on the table in a bet, if you like . . . .

(and I'll keep a keen eye on it in the meantime too . . . . ) ;-)