What happened to getting married before having children?

weezl74

qetu1357 wrote: »

Plenty of stuff here.

http://www.centreforsocialjustice.org.uk/default.asp?pageRef=266

I can't see it saying they are differentiating between married parents and together but not married parents though?

qetu1357

weezl74 wrote: »

I can't see it saying they are differentiating between married parents and together but not married parents though?

Over the past 12 years the Government has consistently undermined the institution of marriage
specifically and the importance of two-parent families in general.
In adopting their stance to family form and process, the Government has failed to act in the best
interests of society, it has failed to set policy according to what the evidence shows: family form
matters, and married two-parent families produce the best outcomes for both adults and children.
Despite a wealth of national and international evidence demonstrating the devastating impact of
family breakdown on children and adults, and the protection that marriage provides against such
outcomes, the Government has actively sought to disincentivise marriage and disadvantage married
couples.

qetu1357

qetu1357 wrote: »

Over the past 12 years the Government has consistently undermined the institution of marriage
specifically and the importance of two-parent families in general.
In adopting their stance to family form and process, the Government has failed to act in the best
interests of society, it has failed to set policy according to what the evidence shows: family form
matters, and married two-parent families produce the best outcomes for both adults and children.
Despite a wealth of national and international evidence demonstrating the devastating impact of
family breakdown on children and adults, and the protection that marriage provides against such
outcomes, the Government has actively sought to disincentivise marriage and disadvantage married
couples.

and so on

Five ways in which marriage matters:
(1) Marriage brings stability: just one in 11 married couples split before their child’s fifth
birthday compared to 1 in 3 unmarried
couples.5
(2) Marriage is directly linked to better
mental and physical health amongst
adults.6 The same benefits are not found
amongst co-habiting couples, it is specifically a
‘Marriage Effect’.7
(3) Marriage reduces the risk of violence
and abuse. Children growing up in lone
parent or broken families are between 3 and
6 times more likely to suffer serious abuse
than those growing up with both biological parents,8 and the risk of domestic violence is
significantly increased for co-habiting women than married women.9
(4) Marriage leads to better mental health for children. Children of lone parents are
more than twice as likely to suffer mental health problems than children of married couples,
and those of co-habiting couples are 75 per cent more likely to have mental health problems
than their peers with married parents.10
4 Gardner, J., and Oswald, A., Is it Money or Marriage that Keeps People Alive?, 2002
5 Benson, H., 2006, The conflation of marriage and cohabitation in government statistics – a denial of difference rendered
untenable by an analysis of outcomes, Bristol Community Family Trust
6 Married people are less likely to be depressed, commit suicide, develop acute and chronic conditions and die early;
Ross, C.E., Mirowsky J. and Goldsteen, K., 1990, ‘The Impact of the Family on Health, A Decade in Review’, Journal of
Marriage and the Family, Vol 52, No.4; Lamb, K., Lee, G. And Demaris, A., 2003, ‘Union Formation and Depression:
Selection and Relationship Effects’, Journal of Marriage and the Family, 65; XXXX; Anson, O., 1989, ‘Marital Status and
Women’s Health, the Importance of a Proximate Adult’, Journal of Marriage and the Family, Vol. 51
7 Hughes, M. and Gove, W., 1981, ‘Living Alone; Social Integration and Mental Health’, Journal of Sociology Vol 87, No. 1
8 Cawson, P., 2002, Child Maltreatment in the Family: The experience of a national sample of young people, NSPCC
9 Kiernan, K. And Estaugh, V., 1993, Cohabitation: Extra-Marital Childbearing and Social Policy, Family Policy Studies
Centre; Mirrlees-Black, C., 1999, Domestic Violence: Findings from a new British crime survey self-completion
questionnaire, Home Office
10 Meltzer, H., Green, H., McGinnity, A., Ford, T. and Goodman, R., 2005, Mental Health of Children and Young People in
Great Britain, 2004, Department of Health
Polling for Breakdown Britain found that if you are
not brought up in a two-parent family you are:
• 75% more likely to fail at school
• 70% more likely to be a drug addict
• 50% more likely to have an alcohol
problem
• 40% more likely to have serious debt
problems
• 35% more likely to experience
unemployment/welfare dependency
7
(5) Marriage leads to better life outcomes for children. Children of married parents are
more likely to achieve at school, less likely to use drink and drugs and less likely to get
involved in delinquent or offending behaviour

weezl74

qetu1357 wrote: »

Over the past 12 years the Government has consistently undermined the institution of marriage
specifically and the importance of two-parent families in general.
In adopting their stance to family form and process, the Government has failed to act in the best
interests of society, it has failed to set policy according to what the evidence shows: family form
matters, and married two-parent families produce the best outcomes for both adults and children.
Despite a wealth of national and international evidence demonstrating the devastating impact of
family breakdown on children and adults, and the protection that marriage provides against such
outcomes, the Government has actively sought to disincentivise marriage and disadvantage married
couples.

yes I saw this too, I just can't see the evidence differentiating between the two, other than on page 17 of 'every family matters' where twinkliestar's point is made and validated with evidence. (Kiernan 1999)

I would like to see it though.

POPPYOSCAR

Interesting who the chairman of this report is.

weezl74

qetu1357 wrote: »

and so on

Five ways in which marriage matters:
(1) Marriage brings stability: just one in 11 married couples split before their child’s fifth
birthday compared to 1 in 3 unmarried
couples.5
(2) Marriage is directly linked to better
mental and physical health amongst
adults.6 The same benefits are not found
amongst co-habiting couples, it is specifically a
‘Marriage Effect’.7
(3) Marriage reduces the risk of violence
and abuse. Children growing up in lone
parent or broken families are between 3 and
6 times more likely to suffer serious abuse
than those growing up with both biological parents,8 and the risk of domestic violence is
significantly increased for co-habiting women than married women.9
(4) Marriage leads to better mental health for children. Children of lone parents are
more than twice as likely to suffer mental health problems than children of married couples,
and those of co-habiting couples are 75 per cent more likely to have mental health problems
than their peers with married parents.10
4 Gardner, J., and Oswald, A., Is it Money or Marriage that Keeps People Alive?, 2002
5 Benson, H., 2006, The conflation of marriage and cohabitation in government statistics – a denial of difference rendered
untenable by an analysis of outcomes, Bristol Community Family Trust
6 Married people are less likely to be depressed, commit suicide, develop acute and chronic conditions and die early;
Ross, C.E., Mirowsky J. and Goldsteen, K., 1990, ‘The Impact of the Family on Health, A Decade in Review’, Journal of
Marriage and the Family, Vol 52, No.4; Lamb, K., Lee, G. And Demaris, A., 2003, ‘Union Formation and Depression:
Selection and Relationship Effects’, Journal of Marriage and the Family, 65; XXXX; Anson, O., 1989, ‘Marital Status and
Women’s Health, the Importance of a Proximate Adult’, Journal of Marriage and the Family, Vol. 51
7 Hughes, M. and Gove, W., 1981, ‘Living Alone; Social Integration and Mental Health’, Journal of Sociology Vol 87, No. 1
8 Cawson, P., 2002, Child Maltreatment in the Family: The experience of a national sample of young people, NSPCC
9 Kiernan, K. And Estaugh, V., 1993, Cohabitation: Extra-Marital Childbearing and Social Policy, Family Policy Studies
Centre; Mirrlees-Black, C., 1999, Domestic Violence: Findings from a new British crime survey self-completion
questionnaire, Home Office
10 Meltzer, H., Green, H., McGinnity, A., Ford, T. and Goodman, R., 2005, Mental Health of Children and Young People in
Great Britain, 2004, Department of Health
Polling for Breakdown Britain found that if you are
not brought up in a two-parent family you are:
• 75% more likely to fail at school
• 70% more likely to be a drug addict
• 50% more likely to have an alcohol
problem
• 40% more likely to have serious debt
problems
• 35% more likely to experience
unemployment/welfare dependency
7
(5) Marriage leads to better life outcomes for children. Children of married parents are
more likely to achieve at school, less likely to use drink and drugs and less likely to get
involved in delinquent or offending behaviour

ok that's fine we are talking about different things, I like you, agree that parents being together is better.

My point is simply that in newer research, cohabitees are found to be also offering the same stability to their children and step children.

POPPYOSCAR

I can only speak from my own personal experiences and I have not found amongst my social circle any advantages to the married families than those that are not.

coco1980

qetu1357 wrote: »

and so on

Five ways in which marriage matters:
(1) Marriage brings stability: just one in 11 married couples split before their child’s fifth
birthday compared to 1 in 3 unmarried
couples.5
(2) Marriage is directly linked to better
mental and physical health amongst
adults.6 The same benefits are not found
amongst co-habiting couples, it is specifically a
‘Marriage Effect’.7
(3) Marriage reduces the risk of violence
and abuse. Children growing up in lone
parent or broken families are between 3 and
6 times more likely to suffer serious abuse
than those growing up with both biological parents,8 and the risk of domestic violence is
significantly increased for co-habiting women than married women.9
(4) Marriage leads to better mental health for children. Children of lone parents are
more than twice as likely to suffer mental health problems than children of married couples,
and those of co-habiting couples are 75 per cent more likely to have mental health problems
than their peers with married parents.10
4 Gardner, J., and Oswald, A., Is it Money or Marriage that Keeps People Alive?, 2002
5 Benson, H., 2006, The conflation of marriage and cohabitation in government statistics – a denial of difference rendered
untenable by an analysis of outcomes, Bristol Community Family Trust
6 Married people are less likely to be depressed, commit suicide, develop acute and chronic conditions and die early;
Ross, C.E., Mirowsky J. and Goldsteen, K., 1990, ‘The Impact of the Family on Health, A Decade in Review’, Journal of
Marriage and the Family, Vol 52, No.4; Lamb, K., Lee, G. And Demaris, A., 2003, ‘Union Formation and Depression:
Selection and Relationship Effects’, Journal of Marriage and the Family, 65; XXXX; Anson, O., 1989, ‘Marital Status and
Women’s Health, the Importance of a Proximate Adult’, Journal of Marriage and the Family, Vol. 51
7 Hughes, M. and Gove, W., 1981, ‘Living Alone; Social Integration and Mental Health’, Journal of Sociology Vol 87, No. 1
8 Cawson, P., 2002, Child Maltreatment in the Family: The experience of a national sample of young people, NSPCC
9 Kiernan, K. And Estaugh, V., 1993, Cohabitation: Extra-Marital Childbearing and Social Policy, Family Policy Studies
Centre; Mirrlees-Black, C., 1999, Domestic Violence: Findings from a new British crime survey self-completion
questionnaire, Home Office
10 Meltzer, H., Green, H., McGinnity, A., Ford, T. and Goodman, R., 2005, Mental Health of Children and Young People in
Great Britain, 2004, Department of Health
Polling for Breakdown Britain found that if you are
not brought up in a two-parent family you are:
• 75% more likely to fail at school
• 70% more likely to be a drug addict
• 50% more likely to have an alcohol
problem
• 40% more likely to have serious debt
problems
• 35% more likely to experience
unemployment/welfare dependency
7
(5) Marriage leads to better life outcomes for children. Children of married parents are
more likely to achieve at school, less likely to use drink and drugs and less likely to get
involved in delinquent or offending behaviour

I think this i the biggest load of rubbish I have read in a long time, and going by it then I will have to prepare for my son being an underachieving alcoholic drug addicted delinquent !!!!!!!
and hes only 10 years old,

if this is what we tell children of unmarried couples then what kind of start are we giving them, i encourage my child to be the best that he can, he has been told the dangers of drugs and drink and I actually had a lady in a shop last week approach me and tell me how polite and well mannered my ds was, she is the 2nd person to do this in the lat month

Mojisola

thesim wrote: »

My parents arent married, never have been married to each other.

My dad got married before he met my mum, apparently the women was awful- I've met her son once and judging by the way he turned out and stuff he was telling me I can see why my dad never remarried.

He's not named on my birth certificate either.

HOWEVER,

My dad has gone above and beyond what alot of married couples have. My mum is permantly ill as a result of 3 stroke. He didnt have to stay- they were planning on splitting shortly before this happened, but he stayed. He gave up his job, his dreams so that I could continue my education and he became a f/t carer for her.

There are some things that happen automatically if you are married. For example, I hope your parents have written wills as neither will inherit from the other if they haven't. They will not be considered as "next-of-kin" for each other regarding medical issues. Have they nominated each other on their hospital and GP notes?

I know of an unmarried couple who had been together for many years but, on his death, his blood relations arrived, refused to let her have anything to do with arranging the funeral and, under intestate rules, inherited everything that was in his name.

qetu1357

coco1980 wrote: »

I think this i the biggest load of rubbish I have read in a long time, and going by it then I will have to prepare for my son being an underachieving alcoholic drug addicted delinquent !!!!!!!
and hes only 10 years old,

if this is what we tell children of unmarried couples then what kind of start are we giving them, i encourage my child to be the best that he can, he has been told the dangers of drugs and drink and I actually had a lady in a shop last week approach me and tell me how polite and well mannered my ds was, she is the 2nd person to do this in the lat month

I don't think either this report, or indeed me, is saying that your son will be an underachieving alcoholic drug addicted delinquent.

The report just says that when you look at the factor of whether a child's parents are married or not it is just more likely (not certain by any means) if they are not married!

This is a fact whether any of us like it or not.