What happened to getting married before having children?

kittendothroar

I've been with my fiancee for over 7 years, lived together over 5 and trying for our first child - we have not married yet as do not think its important. Both our parents our divorced. We are in a stable, loving relationship and in a comfortable financial position, if we get married first then it will leave us in a worse financial position to raise a child in and so we plan to marry, some point in the future when money allows, a piece of paper and the title mr and mrs would not make us any better as parents or partners. I think stability is the most important thing for a child, not whether its parents share the same surname.

swingaloo

I wasnt suggesting that living together makes you a worse parent. I also appreciate the comments posters have made in reply to my thread Im not trying to offend anyone.

Unfortunately a piece of paper does not constitute a stable household or upbringing

Of course it dosnt, there will always be unhappy marriages and divorces but why should that be a reason not to marry. If you believe you ahve a good relationship and will always be together then why not marry.

Marriage is just a ritual humans invented, it is just a piece of paper (even if it does have a legal standing)

But that dosnt make it a bad thing, there are many rituals humans invented tht are still popular and going strong.

I also see from your post that you are not opposed to that ritual!

22 year old Mummy to a gorgeous son

Getting married to my beautiful fiance 25th August 2010

balletshoes

I am married, but only because, in our circumstances, it was really the only way we could all be settled together as a family in the country of our choice. If it hadn't had been for that red tape, I wouldn't have got married. I still would have had my child though, and I still would live with my partner. I consider a marriage to be a bit of paper, thats all - certainly not the basis for a stable home life for children, with 2 parents around. You can do that happily without a marriage certificate.

Similarly, although its maybe not ideal, I believe children can be brought up to feel loved and secure from both parents, even though they may have separate households. And personally, I think its a vast improvement that there no longer is the stigma of a "broken home" - as it means that kids don't get picked on because of how their family is made up.

merlin1

i know of many young couples who have made the decision to have a child 'out of wed lock'.

to me they have made the ultimate commitment to each other in bringing a new life into the world, they are all brilliant parents and enviously stable and (hopefully) they will remain so and committed to their child/ren even if the relationship goes pete tong. a child really is a life long thing.

i personally dont think marriage holds the weight that it used to for many people.

Fang_3

swingaloo wrote: »

Before I start I just want to say that this is in no way aimed at any of the posters on this forum.
The question just came to mind because of reading through some of the threads.

OK.

swingaloo wrote: »

So many young people are choosing to try for a family and dont appear to have given a thought to getting married.

Why should they? Marriage is a religious construct and religion is dying. As long as people are in a committed relationship, why should a piece of paper matter?

swingaloo wrote: »

I know that no one would want to go back to the dark ages when being an unmarried mother brought shame upon the family but dont you think we are going too far the other way.

No. I think a very small minority of people don't adequately plan properly for children, but marriage isn't a pre-requisite. Marriage doesn't automatically make someone a better parent.

swingaloo wrote: »

One lady in our street is waiting till her three girls are a bit older so they can all be bridesmaids!

That sounds lovely. Why the mock outrage?

swingaloo wrote: »

Children are now growing up thinking that its the norm to have parents who dont live together, maybe for financial reasons and have different surnames.

Maybe where you live. Where I live the vast majority live as a family unit. And guess what - many women don't feel the need to take on their husbands surname now. We're not in the dark ages where men own women. So quite often you wouldn't know if someone was married or not.

swingaloo wrote: »

Maybe Im wrong, maybe it dosnt matter, but I do worry about the disposable world we live in. Ive heard people say they wont marry because it may not work out, yet they will produce children together and not worry about it working out.

I agree that some people will not marry for those reasons, but they are in a very small minority. Perhaps you should look at the people around you as clearly your morals don't match up?

swingaloo wrote: »

Having said that maybe Im being hypocritical because I live with my partner and we are not married. However, Im way past childbearing age and can honestly say that if I was younger I wouldnt give a thought to having a child without marrying. In a strange way I feel we owe it to our children to provide them with a secure family upbringing.

The divorce rate shows that a marriage is not a guaranteed secure family upbringing. Why do you equate the two? Often they are not linked.

swingaloo wrote: »

I know people will jump on this and say that many marriages do not work out. I accept that argument but cant see that as a reason for not trying to make a commitment. I know that having children together is a commitment but then so is buying a washing machine together!.

Now you're equating children with washing machines. Do you not realise how ridiculous that is?

swingaloo wrote: »

Its the same thing when people say they dont live together because they cant afford to. If thats the case then why have children? Surely togetherness as a family is more important than claiming more benefits.

Why has this suddenly turned into benefit-frothing?

swingaloo wrote: »

I can see in the years to come that this 'easy come- easy go' lifestyle will be the norm.

Mystic Meg? Is that you?

swingaloo wrote: »

I just struggle to understand why the baby comes before the commitment to each other. Im not trying to upset anyone with my view, I would just like to understand.

It doesn't. You just can't understand that commitment doesn't mean marriage to everyone.

[Deleted User]

Had to skip past most of this thread as hubbie putting kids to bed and i'm doing our tea, BUT.............

I met my DH about 16m after a my first husband left me for my best friend (at the time). I had vowed never to get married again or be in a serious relationship. Kids for me, even though i had wanted them meant commitment so a big no.

However having met him (March 2002) and realising he was very different, we got into a serious relationship quite quickly and although we waited a while, (he didn't do change that easily i.e. mortgage and responsibility) DS came along Nov 06 and DD Feb 08. We were engaged when DS was born and married April 07. Neither of us had thought our views would change, but we wanted to settle and be a family with the children sharing the same name and us being a unit.

We did get DS birth cert change tho so he would be recognised equally to any inheritance. We don't think anything different between the two, in fact this is the first time i've ever considered it.

I'm lucky, i never thought it would happen twice, as my first wedding day i thought it was forever. But my second as my Gran said before she died "was an upgrade".

sneezyboots

I understand what the OP is saying. A lot of people do not believe that they have to find the 'right' partner to bring a child into the world these days. I was shocked when someone I knew said they wanted a child soon, so they would have it with their current bf but wouldn't consider marrying the bf unless they were still together in a few years time!

I also find it is a class issue which many people don't like the thought of. I went to a state primary but a posh private secondary and through the wonders of facebook I was actually looking the other day and realised of all the people I went to primary school with not one I know of is married, yet over half of them have children (mostly babies) with partners they are no longer with. Of the people I went to secondary with one is married and has children with her husband. Not a single other one has a child but most are now starting to find long term partners. Seems the people from secondary school nearly all went to uni (apart from the one married with children) and are now battling to build their careers first.

I know people will deny it is class and point out exceptions but in general it's true. I know i will get shot down for saying it but an awful lot of girls come out of school, get a job somewhere they don't want to be, get bored and so decide a baby will fulfill them and make them happy with little consideration of who it is with.

Fang_3

sneezyboots wrote: »

I understand what the OP is saying. A lot of people do not believe that they have to find the 'right' partner to bring a child into the world these days. I was shocked when someone I knew said they wanted a child soon, so they would have it with their current bf but wouldn't consider marrying the bf unless they were still together in a few years time!

I also find it is a class issue which many people don't like the thought of. I went to a state primary but a posh private secondary and through the wonders of facebook I was actually looking the other day and realised of all the people I went to primary school with not one I know of is married, yet over half of them have children (mostly babies) with partners they are no longer with. Of the people I went to secondary with one is married and has children with her husband. Not a single other one has a child but most are now starting to find long term partners. Seems the people from secondary school nearly all went to uni (apart from the one married with children) and are now battling to build their careers first.

I know people will deny it is class and point out exceptions but in general it's true. I know i will get shot down for saying it but an awful lot of girls come out of school, get a job somewhere they don't want to be, get bored and so decide a baby will fulfill them and make them happy with little consideration of who it is with.

I agree with some of this. I think class plays a big part in that middle class parents bring their children up with a great deal of go-getting and self-esteem, whereas many lower class parents seem to want their children to 'know their place' and don't seem to equip their children with the required skills to excel alone. That's in my experience anyway. I've noticed that a lot of the people I went to secondary school with have settled in mundane jobs and with mundane partners and have children, and yet are forever moaning about their situations. Whereas I and my more middle class friends are more likely to be bettering ourselves and starting careers rather than jobs, and not settling down with the first person who comes along.

pigpen

and sharing a child is a FAR FAR bigger commitment than marriage.. a marriage can be got rid of.. children can't, you are stuck with them.. forever.. both of you.. and whatever your feelings on the other parents and how that may change you still have the children.

Here's one you will love... I couldn't marry OH if I wanted to as I am technically still married to XH.. our children now have 2 happy parents rather than 2 miserable ones.. 2 new people in their lives and are looking forward to a new baby brother or sister in a few weeks.

If we all lived our lives by other peoples outdated ideals the world would be a very boring place to be.

Marriage is a part of religion. Religion which was thought up by the powers that be to keep the uneducated masses in line before police and laws and justice became a vague concept.. time moves on and I would hope this is now a more civilised society than in years BC. So I am really not sure if religion or marriage actually has a place in our 'developed' society.

janninew

It was so important to me that I was married before we had kids, don't know why though! I think its partly how I was brought up. At the end of the day its a completely personal decision, having kids before you get married doesn't make you a bad parent, and being married and having kids doesn't instantly make you a great parent.

I have friends who aren't married who are wonderful parents, they say they never want to get married and are happy as they are, I can't undertand why you wouldn't want to marry the person you love and have children with, but that's my opinion, it doesn't make me a better person or parent! As long as children are well cared for and loved, I don't think it matters at all!