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Electricity meter going backwards after installing Solar PV
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Just had free solar panels fitted today by a major, reputable, company and the electrician said the meter goes backwards when I am putting power into the grid. He never mentioned anything about it being illegal and he's fitted hundreds of units.
Happy to see it going backwards as it means I can effectively 'store' some of the electricity I am producing.
On a more worrying note (but probably just coincidence) my lawn mower motor burned out whilst using it after the installation. It is about 5-6 years old and probably on it's last legs but I hope it wasn't anything to do with the solar or the meter:(0 -
Just had free solar panels fitted today by a major, reputable, company and the electrician said the meter goes backwards when I am putting power into the grid. He never mentioned anything about it being illegal and he's fitted hundreds of units.
Happy to see it going backwards as it means I can effectively 'store' some of the electricity I am producing.
On a more worrying note (but probably just coincidence) my lawn mower motor burned out whilst using it after the installation. It is about 5-6 years old and probably on it's last legs but I hope it wasn't anything to do with the solar or the meter:(
Hi Stoop,
The lawn mower would have been just a coincidence.
On the point about "backward meters", I have been led to believe that while it does look like a very convenient way to "store" ones unused electricity, that it is, in fact, costing the utility companies to take in your electricity and then supply it back to you - no matter how soon afterwards.
I raised the argument like you have, thinking it was quite fair and reasonable to make this "storage" assumption, but it seems we may be incorrect in this. Please see my other post and the long debate regarding this matter here: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3390074
If, after reading this thread you still believe the utility companies need not provide "stop meters" to prevent such backward metering, then I would be interested to hear you viewpoint.
Also, many utility companies ask if your meter is going backwards before you can claim the FIT, so they will learn and change the meter at some point.
In the post above, I explain that I am currently looking for a battery solution to the storage issue, but preliminary investigations are tending to suggest that such a system may be cost prohibitive, in that the cost of the system to install would be more than what you actually save. However, I am waiting for someone to get back to me efore a final decision.
CYE0 -
Just had free solar panels fitted today by a major, reputable, company and the electrician said the meter goes backwards when I am putting power into the grid. He never mentioned anything about it being illegal and he's fitted hundreds of units.
Happy to see it going backwards as it means I can effectively 'store' some of the electricity I am producing.
Let us take a situation where you have you electricity supplied by a small supplier, say, Ebico.
They don't participate in the FIT scheme, along with other small suppliers. In this case you register and get your FIT from a large supplier, say, EON.
Now for EON it is no problem, the FIT money they pay you is drawn from the 'kitty' to which all suppliers contribute.
To make things simple, let us assume you generate 3,000kWh pa of which you use 1,000kWh in your house and your meter is 'turned back' 2,000kWh. You also use 1,200kWh from the main electricity(supplied by Ebico) at night and when the panels are not generating.
So we have the situation where Ebico are supplying you with 1,200kWh in a year, yet your meter will have a reading 800kWh lower than when that year began.
So for supplying you with 1,200kWh, Ebico have to refund you the cost of 800kWh. Surely you can see that situation cannot continue?
If you found a way to fiddle the electricity meter and turn it back 2,000kWh each year, you would be guilty of stealing electricity.
Whilst I am not suggesting that turning a meter back with PV produced electricity is stealing, it has exactly the same effect.
I suspect that in time those with a backward turning meter will be given an estimated bill for the electricity they have consumed but has been 'masked'.0 -
Thanks for the replies. The thing is that we are guided by the company that fitted the solar panels for free and it is they who benefit from the FIT tariff - not us. As far as I am concerned they have done everything above board and by the book.0
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I've emailed the company that fitted them but also came across an write in the Telegraph. No mention of it being illegal or wrong in any way.
I'm not allowed to post the link but if you google 'our meter is going backwards' you will find it.0 -
Looking around the web the general opinion is that if you let you supplier know that you have fitted the panels then it's up to them to change your meter. They should know what type of meter you have and that it has the ability to go both ways. It seems they are waiting for the roll out of smart meters and are prepared to stand the 'loss' at the moment.
They make enough off us anyway I guess!0 -
i had a meter that was going backwards and after 3 months it had gone back over 300kw.
i told npower 3 times and they changed the meter on 2nd aug.
what i did not want to happen, was when my next meter reading is due in oct and they found out that the meter was going backwards
that they would estimate my usage and give me a bigger bill than what i have actually used.
so i have sent them this info:
Now i have had a new meter fitted on 2/8/11 at 9.00am we need to sort out the bill.
i think the best way to do this, so it is fair is as follows:
taking my last bill metre reading on 03/04/11 72398
and the reading on 11/04/11 72456 total 58kw divide that by the numer of days 8 gives daily average of 7.25 kw
now taking the last reading we have on 11/04/11 72456 up to the day my solar panels were fitted on 23/04/11 which is 12 days.
so 12 days x 7.25 daily average for april = 87kw
then take the readings from the new meter fitted at 9.00am on the 2/8/11 00000
and the meter reading on 5/8/11 00009 = 3 days
daily average of 3kw this is with my solar panels working from 23/4/11
so if we take the figure of 3kw per day and the dates from when the solar was fitted 23/4/11 and the date the new meter being fitted 2/8/11 = 100 days so that is 300kw
so from 11/4/11 to the 2/8/11 i have used a total of 387kw
11/4/11 to 23/4/11 87kw
23/4/11 to 2/8/11 300kw
total 387kw
i hope that we an agree on this as i think its the fairest way as i have done everthing to keep you up to date and tried to let you know about the problem as soon as possible
any thoughts?0 -
I'd say that since they assume you're exporting 50% of what you generate to the grid and using the other 50% yourself, it would make sense to simply add half the units generated onto the end-of-quarter meter reading to estimate what the reading would be if the meter hadn't run backwards.
So in my case that would mean:
Meter reading at beginning of quarter (shortly before panels fitted): 46228
End of quarter: 46103
Total shown on generation meter at end of quarter: 1296
Assumed export (power generated but not used by us, which is what would account for the meter going backwards) = 0.5 x 1296 = 648 units
which would give an expected meter reading of 46103 + 648 = 46751
i.e. Power consumed from supplier = 46751 - 46228 = 523 units
(I know they're now saying that in fact a typical household exports about 75% of what it generates, but the official assumption is still the 50/50 split; if we used the 75/25 split then my figures would be be 46103 + (0.75 x 1296) = 47075, i.e. 847 units consumed.)0 -
Regarding electric meters that go backwards.
I have been pondering over this for a while now and my head hurts!
The FITS terms states that EDF will pay me for 100% of my PV generation and for 50% of what is generated at the export rate.
My meter runs backwards when exporting
Do the FITS terms in effect not allow a meter to run backwards as I am already being paid for what I export?
Is that why they say I must have a meter that is 'Stopped' to prevent it going backwards?
Or are the FITS payments separate from the electricity charges?
Where do I stand legally? I have informed EDF that my meter runs backwards sometimes - They arranged a date to fit a 'Stopped' meter but failed to turn up!
You can see why my head is hurting - now where's the paracetamol.0 -
Yes, for every unit that your meter runs backwards, you're effectively getting a refund on the electricity you've already used (as well as getting your FIT and export payments on top). So it makes sense for the suppliers to prevent this from happening. I think that if you've told them about the meter running backwards then you've done all that can reasonably be expected of you. Maybe drop them an email mentioning that the engineer you were expecting didn't turn up, but it's their lookout really; you may already have waited in all day for THEIR benefit!
According to my bill our reading hadn't gone backwards after all; we did appear to have used an improbably small amount of electricity but British Gas didn't question it. My parents' reading was questioned by their supplier though (not sure who they're with, possibly EDF?) and they ended up sending someone out to replace the meter.0
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