Anyone Child Free By Choice?

Hermia

dizziblonde wrote: »

Try getting told you shouldn't be allowed in your chosen career (which I'm very very good at) because you suffer fertility problems and miscarriages. So yes, I'm not CFBC - but I still get hit with the same inane, rude, offensive, presumptuous, judgemental comments. There would be (and is) an utter outcry if people suggested mothers were unable to do a job

Poor you. I am childfree through choice and work with kids and find that a lot of people who work with kids don't want any. The idea that you have to have/want kids to be any good at working with them is ridiculous.

BugglyB

Hi all,

Just wanted to share this book I have been reading recently. Its called Beyond Childlessness and deals with issues like how to cope with insensitive remarks and societal pressures. Its mainly for women who wanted children but cant have them but its also for women who are CFBC and women who have one child but wanted more. It has really helped me with some issues I have and I hope it could help someone else too:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Beyond-Childlessness-Every-Woman-Wanted/dp/1405077611

katerachel

I am a journalist looking to interview a married couple who are childfree by choice. If you're interested in taking part please email - grahamkate[at]hotmail.com - and I can send over more details! Thanks, Kate

[Deleted User]

Hello everyone,

I thought I would resurrect this interesting thread, after staying up until 4am reading all the posts! Thank you to the original poster. I noticed the sheer amount of 'pregnancy' and 'trying for a baby' threads in this section, so was delighted to come across one for CFBC people like myself. I love being CFBC. My only complaint about it would be other people. Other people who are ignorant and nosey, who pry into your business, make assumptions about you because of your lifestyle, think you should be a certain way, are patronising enough to think they know your mind better than you and who believe your lifestyle could not possibly bring you fulfillment. Some of these people have reared their ugly head on this thread like pantomime baddies, but I was delighted to see that most posters are extremely supportive, especially happy to see support from parents.

Just to disprove some stereotypes: I am not crazily career-focused, I am not rich at all nor do I particularly like travelling or buying expensive things. I don't despise children (I am not a big fan of them however) and I do not go out partying or drinking so my reasons for not having or wanting children aren't because I'd have to give up my wild ways, travelling, career and hefty income, as some people assume. If I wanted children, I'd give up those things without question. I just don't want them. I have put forward numerous excuses/ justifications for my choice through the years, none of which are necessarily true but which I thought would shut up the probing questioner. My reason? I just don't want them, never have and most likely, never will. If by some crazy change in personality, I change my mind, I would try to adopt. For now, my reason for not wanting children should be as acceptable as any reason for wanting them, but I have been met with shocked faces and told it is my obligation as a woman to have them (which escorted me right back to the 1950s!) What really irks me is when someone, as a couple of people have done here, says that their life is more fulfilling or happy than mine because they have children. Because the first look into the child's eyes will bring you more happiness than a lifetime of cruises. Because helping your child when he/she has fallen brings more joy and contentment than any job could ever bring. I am glad you find happiness in these ways but please desist from comparing your level of happiness to mine. You will NEVER know how happy or fulfilled I am, you will never know what it is like to walk in anyone's shoes but your own. You can make assumptions til the cows come home but those are still based on your own experience. The mere fact that you are comparing yourself to someone else in this way and elevating yourself is concerning. It suggests to me that you need to feel better than others in order to be happy. Frankly, for me, I don't rely on other people or external means for my happiness whether other people or material things. I have worked with parents of drug abusers and can assure you that those parents would not be so naive as to say children are the be all and end all of happiness.I have no doubt that first smile from your child brings immense joy but they grow up, move away, become their own people. Relying on having children to give you happiness is a dangerous game in my opinion.

Another thing that annoys me is people (especially those that can't spell) stating that we are all put on this earth to procreate or 'multiply'. Speak for yourself. I for one was not born simply to ensure others were born with my genes. Such arguments in this day and age are ridiculous. No one has the right to act as an authority over your life's purpose or what will make you happy. I also noticed someone had mentioned they couldn't imagine that anyone would want to be child free by choice. What a ridiculous statement to make in a CFBC forum! It's like me going into a pregnancy thread and stating 'I can't imagine anyone would want to get pregnant'. How rude! I'm pretty sure this person probably couldn't envisage anyone making decisions that differed from her own. What a sheltered and ignornant existence.

Anyway, I was hoping my post would be a positive one. I think that people always question things that don't fit with the norm. I have been questionned for not drinking, not eating meat, and most often, not wanting children. Having children is so much a part of modern culture and is so heavily promoted in the media (I am so glad I no longer have to watch those darn Iceland adverts with Stacey Solomon gazing giddily into her young son's eyes) that if you don't think having children will bring you happiness, you are immediately questioned. A lot of parents take the choice not to have children as a personal afront, as if you are a threat in some way. This is nonsense and usually happens with the people who aren't entirely comfortable being parents in the first place. Of the people I know with children, the ones who have accepted my choice without question seem to be the ones most comfortable in their choice and who willingly acknowledge having children isn't all unicorns and rainbows, it is a lot of hard work too. It would be lovely if we could all accept each other's differences and trust that another person's choices were right for them, even if they differ from our own, without making them justify their choice and giving them a hard time about it. As that day will likely never come, it is good to remind yourself that regardless of what others say, only your own opinion about yourself matters and you do not have to answer to anyone.

SandC

I don't know about other CFBC people on here, but I have never set foot in any of the threads on pregnancy, coping with difficulties in conceiving etc. as they are not relevant to me and I couldn't possibly come up with any worthwhile contribution.

So when you get people popping in to CFBC related topics in order to spread the word on the joys of parenthood I find it quite bizarre.

dizziblonde

SandC wrote: »

I don't know about other CFBC people on here, but I have never set foot in any of the threads on pregnancy, coping with difficulties in conceiving etc. as they are not relevant to me and I couldn't possibly come up with any worthwhile contribution.

So when you get people popping in to CFBC related topics in order to spread the word on the joys of parenthood I find it quite bizarre.

It's the fact that quite often parents cannot accept or relate to the fact that not everyone wants (or can - although I'm now pregnant, I had one helluva journey through infertility and had essentially resigned myself to a childless future - and hence still have a lot of common ground and feelings with how those without children are viewed and treated if you get what I mean) to join them in their happy family bubble - and it can get quite bullying at times if you don't want to trott down the same road as them... or you can be viewed as worthless - as if your only contribution to the world that can possibly be of value is the one they define as such - I've fought that particular battle hard with my family, at one point, until I pulled them up on what they were doing to me with it, I felt like despite sticking in at school and uni and paying my way in the world - the only way I'd be deemed to be a "good" child of the family was to make cups of tea well (I make a lousy cuppa) and produce the required grandchildren. For a family who'd always brought me up to believe in education and women's merits based on things other than their role solely as mother - that was quite shocking when they started to act like that and I didn't half fight my corner there!

Think part of it is that people with kids tend to socialise with other people with kids - and forget that there is a fairly large chunk of society that doesn't fit into that box... but the pressure (and we had it on this thread earlier on) and presumptions that people feel they have any right at all to stick their nose into others' reproductive business is insane.

Like I say - I see it from both sides - we'd had to essentially grieve for our planned future with kids and redefine ourselves as childfree before our (hopeful) miracle struck - so I've walked both roads so to speak for many years. The stereotyping of the childfree/less will always always always be like a red rag to a bull to me, as will denigrating people's opinions because they don't have kids (they live in the same society populated by and affected by the behaviour of the children around them - they're allowed opinions too) plus issues like the assumption they'll take the bum deal of the shifts and holidays at work etc etc (for many years we fought hubby's employers who allocated 6 week holiday to parents only... they couldn't get it into their head that, while parents were tied to the school holidays in order to get away - my husband was equally as he was married to a teacher!)

[Deleted User]

dizziblonde wrote: »

It's the fact that quite often parents cannot accept or relate to the fact that not everyone wants (or can - although I'm now pregnant, I had one helluva journey through infertility and had essentially resigned myself to a childless future - and hence still have a lot of common ground and feelings with how those without children are viewed and treated if you get what I mean) to join them in their happy family bubble - and it can get quite bullying at times if you don't want to trott down the same road as them... or you can be viewed as worthless - as if your only contribution to the world that can possibly be of value is the one they define as such - I've fought that particular battle hard with my family, at one point, until I pulled them up on what they were doing to me with it, I felt like despite sticking in at school and uni and paying my way in the world - the only way I'd be deemed to be a "good" child of the family was to make cups of tea well (I make a lousy cuppa) and produce the required grandchildren. For a family who'd always brought me up to believe in education and women's merits based on things other than their role solely as mother - that was quite shocking when they started to act like that and I didn't half fight my corner there!

I have to say I disagree slightly. I think anyone who tries to convince someone else to make a choice that is in line with their own is not fully satisfied with that choice. Take, for example, a girl on a diet who is out with a friend. The friend orders a cupcake and the girl declines, stating she is trying to be good. The friend may feel bad that she's eating a cupcake while her pal is being so saintly and say 'oh come on, one bite won't kill you!' or she might happily chomp away at the cupcake, pleased with her own decision. I feel like parents who do not accept the choice not to have children fall into the former category. Trying to persuade another person to have children is an attempt at validating their own choice. After all, if they cared enough about the person, they would be accepting of their beliefs and choices as opposed to feeling their own choices and expectations of them might suit them better. This has at least been proven among my group of friends. One friend (with two kids) urged me to have children, questioned what my life would be like without them, and basically did not accept I didn't want to have them. After a lengthy discussion, she finally admitted she'd struggled bringing up her son and didn't feel herself sometimes. On the other hand, my male friend who has a lovely 3 year old asked why I don't want children. When I told him, I fully expected a barrage of negative comments but instead, he said how cool it was that I'd made that decision and that having children should certainly not be seen as the default option for everyone. Also dizziblonde, while I think your support for CFBC people is fantastic, I also think that you never actually came into this category. Childless (as you were before you were pregnant, congrats by the way) is a completely different experience to being childfree, the conscious decision not to have children, though admittedly, ignorant people don't differentiate between these categories when they;re making judgements or assumptions about us.

dizziblonde

I stuck more prejudice and ill-informed judgements about my reproductive status than you've probably ever likely to have to deal with in your entire life (see previous comments where my entire professional capability was called into question - purely because of what my uterus had/hadn't been up to - which would be utterly utterly unacceptable to do that to a woman who'd HAD children) - therefore yes, I DO know what the judgements, stereotypes and preconceptions are like, probably more so than yourself. I also know how the world changes treats you when you DO get pregnant - and the hypocrisy involved in that you somehow miraculously suddenly become "worth" more - is sickening.

But nope - you can carry on attacking allies and you can have your thread to yourself. For the bulk of my teens and early 20s I'd made the decision I didn't want children at all (not that I have to justify this to you at all) because the mother-daughter relationships within my family are incredibly destructive as a general rule and I didn't want to perpetuate that cycle and screw up another generation. Things changed for me when I met a man from a very very stable supportive family background and I realised that families screwing you up was not in fact an inevitability - and then we ran into problems... so for well over a decade of my "fertile"(hah hah) life - I've had to formulate a world view and life plan of myself that didn't involve children - in both contexts - via choice and then via choice being made for us.

You've actually been incredibly offensive toward me to be honest. Carry on talking to yourself - because you don't want a discussion, you just want to run your mouth off and pretend you're intellectually superior to anyone else - which you ain't sweetie.

[Deleted User]

dizziblonde wrote: »

I stuck more prejudice and ill-informed judgements about my reproductive status than you've probably ever likely to have to deal with in your entire life (see previous comments where my entire professional capability was called into question - purely because of what my uterus had/hadn't been up to - which would be utterly utterly unacceptable to do that to a woman who'd HAD children) - therefore yes, I DO know what the judgements, stereotypes and preconceptions are like, probably more so than yourself. I also know how the world changes treats you when you DO get pregnant - and the hypocrisy involved in that you somehow miraculously suddenly become "worth" more - is sickening.

But nope - you can carry on attacking allies and you can have your thread to yourself. For the bulk of my teens and early 20s I'd made the decision I didn't want children at all (not that I have to justify this to you at all) because the mother-daughter relationships within my family are incredibly destructive as a general rule and I didn't want to perpetuate that cycle and screw up another generation. Things changed for me when I met a man from a very very stable supportive family background and I realised that families screwing you up was not in fact an inevitability - and then we ran into problems... so for well over a decade of my "fertile"(hah hah) life - I've had to formulate a world view and life plan of myself that didn't involve children - in both contexts - via choice and then via choice being made for us.

You've actually been incredibly offensive toward me to be honest. Carry on talking to yourself - because you don't want a discussion, you just want to run your mouth off and pretend you're intellectually superior to anyone else - which you ain't sweetie.

I am extremely sorry if I came across as offensive, I certainly didn't mean it, sorry. My point was that there is a difference between people who want but cannot have children and those that do not want children. There is probably no difference between the treatment they get however. People have assumed incorrectly that I am unable to have children and not acknowledged that this is a choice I have made myself, so perhaps I am defensive because of this. I did not mean to upset you in any way and am disgusted at the way you have been treated, I certainly do not want to add to this. I actually do want a discussion, a healthy one if possible (but realise I have probably ruined this possibility) and no, I do not believe I am intellectually superior to anyone else, I don't know where you got this from. I apologise if I made this implication and hope you will accept my sincere apologies.

Frugalista

dizziblonde wrote: »

You've actually been incredibly offensive toward me to be honest. Carry on talking to yourself - because you don't want a discussion, you just want to run your mouth off and pretend you're intellectually superior to anyone else - which you ain't sweetie.

I think there is only one person on here who is being "incredibly offensive" and it's certainly not goldilockz .

It would appear that you have had to face a number of issues regarding your prevous infertility and this has had an affect on you. However, I have to agree with goldilockz that this is an entirely different scenario to being childfree by choice.