Baby Milk Price Hike!

SusanC_2

Maybe the government prevent special offers but do the government set minimum prices? Presumably the formula manufacturers set their own prices and can set them at whatever they want. I would expect them to at least cover their costs and make some profit so I imagine that is a determining factor in how they set their prices. If they were allowed to do special offers, I would expect their "regular" price would be higher to make up for the reductions when on special offer. The formula companies are doing it as a profit making exercise - not as a public service.

I planned to breastfeed and use washable nappies (and did do both) but I also drew up a budget which included the worst case scenario (in terms of finance) which was using formula and disposable nappies. Although I have to say that the extra we spent on food in the first few months of breastfeeding probably wasn't far off formula costs but most people don't notice as it is in amongst everything else rather than being obviously separate like formula. With all the benefits available, I find it hard to believe that anyone genuinely struggles to afford formula (unless they have previously incurred debt) as the amount you would need to be earning to not be have all your baby's costs covered by benefits is fairly high.

feelinggood wrote: »

I recognise that it can be hurtful, but I think we need to step away from emotionalising breastfeeding/formula. It is a serious topic, and I think one that should be discussed without emotional, although that is difficult.

If a woman is genuinely unable to breastfeed, she should not feel any guilt. That said, I don't think any woman should feel guilt over her choice. I don't think we should avoid sharing information or ideas for fear of offending though.

I agree. This is why I think the fact that a lot of "support" for breastfeeding is just hitting people over the head with "breast is best" is unhelpful - it doesn't help people who are struggling with breastfeeding and it gives guilt to people who end up formula feeding. I also wonder if people are getting confused between the idea that those who want to breastfeed should be given better support and theidea that everyone should be railroaded into breastfeeding no matter what?

feelinggood wrote: »

I think it would be good if society could detach emotion from it, and really analyze and discuss this issue. We might make good progress that way. Things aren't really working as they are, I don't think.

I don't think guilt should be felt. Women should sometimes feel angry or letdown, but rarely guilt. Not many think 'I can't be bothered' - usually they aren't given the right support, or are given poor information, or don't have the right knowledge to make an informed choice.

I agree but clearly given by the reactions on the thread people do feel guilt and therefore feel attacked by strong statements about breastfeeding. I honestly don't understand why people get upset/angry by discussion of breastfeeding and it's benefits and how to enable more people who want to to be able to do it (as opposed to just bashing people over the head with "breast is best" which even I find annoying) because if I had not continued breastfeeding, I would not. Perhaps it is a way that people who would have liked to deal with how things turned out?

For comparison, I had an epidural with my first labour. There are lots of reasons why this is not best for you or your child (which I won't go into as I don't want to upset people) and I totally regret having done so. Although I knew it wasn't the best choice, I did it at the time and one reason that I ended up making that choice was the compete lack of midwife care and support in the hospital. Whilst I regret that choice and feel angry that I did not receive the support I should have (which would have enabled me to make a better choice) I do not feel guilty about it and I do not feel upset or angry if someone states that it is better for the baby not to have an epidural. Yes, I made a choice which wasn't the best choice but nobody makes the best choice all the time - life isn't like that. I can't redo or change what has happened and I know that anyone criticising epidurals is not making a personal attack on me or saying that I am a bad mother etc. I have moved on and my response is just to do my best to ensure that the same thing does not happen in the future. If I had switched to formula feeding, I would have felt a similar way (and indeed I used an analogy with breastfeeding to explain to my husband how I felt about having had an epidural) and so I find it hard to understand why (aside from the "breast is best" bashing) some people who formula feed get upset by discussion of brestfeeding, its benefits and how if people were given better support then more people would be able to continue. I hope this might go some way to explaining to formula feeders who are upset by breastfeeder's comments why we might appear to be saying things which are insensitive.

winnie81 wrote: »

Ohh that line also made me :mad: My last 2 children were allergic to breast milk and were on a prescribed diet of specialist formulas and supplements so in my case Breast milk was no way superior :mad:. Breast is great if you/baby can have/do it but if not then no-one should feel bad for choosing a formula milk :mad:

I don't think that when a statement is made about breastmilk it is intended as a statement to cover 100% of scenarios. I could say peanuts are a good source of protein and it would be true but doesn't mean that it would be a good idea to give them to my husband who is allergic to them. He wouldn't however be offended by statements about positive nutritional qualities of peanuts.

winnie81 wrote: »

If people want breast to be more normalised EVERY mum should have one on one time with a specialist feeding nurse after giving birth until they can feed easily so both mum and baby are happy.

I agree and I think this is the kind of thing FeelingGood means when she is talking about support and the fact that most (not all) BF problems can be solved with proper support.

skintchick wrote: »

HVs are obsessed with weight gain!I know it's important that babies gain weight but they do seem to take it too far. I have a friend whose baby is not gaining (not losing either) and she wants to BF but they are pushing her to use formula - that's what makes me mad.

If you look even at the weight charts at age one you will find that the centiles above the average are spread further apart than the ones below. (Unlike height where they stay evenly distributed right up to adulthood.) This implies that even at that age some children are overweight and then people are being pushed to live up to expectations of a chart which is already based on some children being overweight. Obviously in some cases, low weight is a genuine problem but it does seem to be a common issue that people are pushed into using formula purely on the basis of the charts. NB I am not saying that all babies above the average weight are overweight but based on statistics it looks like some are.

Glamazon wrote: »

Yet again any mention of Formula milk and it turns into a BF V FF debate - does my head in. :mad:

I think the way the OP was done made it one.

got-it-spend-it wrote: »

I think it's really sad that our society seems to view BF as an elitist thing, as this is ceratinly not the case in most of the world, as you will see if you look at the link I posted. Rwanda has the highest BF rate in the world and I bet it's not the rich women that do it there.

I don't know about Rwanda but (as I mentioned recently elsewhere) in Kuwait it is the poor illiterate women who breastfeed and the rich well educated women who don't.

happyfili wrote: »

Sorry, but I live in Teesside not Rwanda..:rotfl:

I grew up on Teesside and I had no idea until after I had a child of my own that breastfeeding was not the norm.

Glamazon wrote: »

I think it's because some (not all) BF mothers look down their noses at FF mothers and believe they are superior for BF. This is certainly how the BF mothers at my local baby group come across and I live in a really good area.

Knowing how close I was to switching, I personally don't feel like I am better than people who formula feed. I do feel sad when I hear people giving reasons for switching which I know could have been overcome relatively easily but I would never say anything as it would be too much like personal criticism even though it is usually the fault of other people and not the mother.

My_Fathers_Daughter wrote: »

FWIW - NOBODY has a clue how many babies are BF at 6 months in this country - BECAUSE WE DON'T GET ASKED. And at my baby's 9 month check they didn't ask either. It is all made up propaganda (it could be more, it could be less).

They do a national infant feeding survey every five years. (Obviously this is just a sample but it does give an indication.)

tiamai_d wrote: »

I was in asda earlier and I looked at the price of the smart price tissues, 46p. I remembered buying them about 5 years ago for 24p.

Everything has went up in price!

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Becles wrote: »

I used Huggies wipes in hospital. I didn't have any cotton wool, they told me off for not using cotton wool, and when I asked they begrudingly gave me one cotton wool ball and told me to use it sparingly. As I don't have the ability to magic cotton wool out of thin air, I just used the wipes and fell out with the midwives.

Yet in the very same hospital a couple of weeks earlier, the doctor doing the newborn check expected us to produce wipes.

SugarSpun

skintchick wrote: »

I don;t see those first two as 'benefits' exclusive to formula - Bfing gives peace of mind that baby is getting what it needs that is exclusively tailored to the baby thanks to the clever way that breastfeeding works.

Is it really, though? My monster has never had formula. She is six months old and eats a fascinating combination of mashed vegetables and breast milk, sometimes together sometimes not. She's on the 50th percentile for weight and has been merrily bobbing along there since birth. Several people - including a midwife - have asked me whether I'm sure my supply is adequate or suggested that it isn't because she still wakes for a feed in the night. I can't answer them in terms of ml because she gets her milk direct from the source and so I just don't know if she's draining 150-180ml in a session or getting less.

For me, the knowledge that her weight isn't an issue and that she's a robust happy healthy little monster is enough that I've elected not to care about not knowing exactly how much she's eating, and the middle-of-the-night feed is something I just yawn my way through. If the baby wasn't gaining weight properly or was unhappy or distressed the decision would be far more complicated.

I think that those of us who have successfully breastfed are likely not to realise that other people found it harder to get past the struggly bits and therefore there's an element of thinking, Well I managed it through [this problem] and you should have managed too. Having said that, so long as babies are looked after by parents who have their best interests at heart it doesn't matter what's going into them.

Glamazon wrote: »

I think it's because some (not all) BF mothers look down their noses at FF mothers and believe they are superior for BF. This is certainly how the BF mothers at my local baby group come across and I live in a really good area.

My_Fathers_Daughter wrote: »

Personally, I really don't care how anybody else feeds their baby (:o) as long as mine is fed and happy but I do care about other mothers and so will seek to help and support (and not make them feel crap) however I can.

And you know what? I don't care how you feed your baby, so long as it's getting fed. In this world there are bigger issues.

Exactly :T It's best to feed a baby enough of whatever food works best for mummy and baby. If breastfeeding doesn't work out for you (whether that's because the baby won't suck, attempts to tear off the nipple, there's no supply or because BFing would make mummy miserable for whatever reason) then formula exists and can be made use of.

Can I join the Super Bad Mummies Club? The monster is breastfed and eats veg mush, although we do also feed her from jars :eek: We use reusable nappies unless we're travelling or out and about, because I choose not to carry my daughter's revolting spinach poops about with me and make myself a biohazard and a social menace. She has a dummy that she primarily uses for fine motor play, and if it falls on the floor in the house I wipe it off, give it a rinse and hand it back. Her toys live on a mat on the floor, which is cleaned when it looks like it needs it - same with the toys. She dips her fingers in curry and nomnomnoms it off. She gets a bath once a week unless she's covered in something noxious and then she gets a bonus one. We used wipes from the beginning and I ate peanuts, runny eggs and rare steak while pregnant. I also had a glass of wine on at least four occasions and have done so while BFing.

I like happy well fed babies and aside from the one on my lap helping me type and banging the desk it is not my business how others are fed and I hope I've never made any other mummy feel bad for her choice.

MrsTinks

I see some of your points SusanC but we don't go on and on about FFing children so why do a lot of the BFing army have to constantly slate us for our choices? And being as I have on here been told my reason wasn't "a good enough" reason then I beg to differ on the lack of attacks at people for how they choose to feed their babies.

To those who feel a need to lecture or judge us:
We formula feed - now leave us alone if you can't be a grown up and deal with that!


So... the price of formula... gone up huh?
Where's the cheapest place for Aptimal? I feel a need to stock up now

MrsTinks

Sorry SugarSpun you're nowhere near bad enough to join the super bad mummies club I'm afraid You'll have to start a "slightly naughty mummies club"

peachyprice

At the end of the day there is no evidence that says all breastfed babies will grow up to be healthy, correct weight, well behaved, honest, well balanced individuals while all forumal fed babies will grow up to be unhealthy, overweight, badly behaved, dishonest, unhinged individuals, so in the grand scale of things, WHAT DOES IT MATTER?

It's far better to have a happy, healthy mother who has bonded with her baby than a mother who is so stressed she doesn't know what day of the week it is. If that is achived through BF, all well and good, but if it takes FF for a mother to feel content, WHAT DOES IT MATTER?

No mother should be made to feel inadequate for choosing a path that is best for HER family. She should be able to enjoy those precious months, goodness know they pass quickly enough, without being made a failure for making that choice.

I just do not understand why militant BF'ers get so upset by mothers who choose to FF, it isn't harming them or their babies and is frankly none of their business.

jillie1974

my asda still has aptamil at £7.89

not commenting on the bf/ff debate as i gave my opinions last week when i raised a 'thought' on feeding in general. there were several posts on the parents club thread which highlighted how hard bottle feeding can be.

SugarSpun

MrsTine wrote: »

Sorry SugarSpun you're nowhere near bad enough to join the super bad mummies club I'm afraid You'll have to start a "slightly naughty mummies club"

Yes, but when I said there have been some glasses of wine while BFing, at least one of those was while she was latched on... AND she is currently wearing the same socks she had on yesterday.

I propose a Good Enough Mummies Club, where we accept that we're not perfect mummies but are doing what's best for our babies and any other children in the specific circumstances we live in and decide that it's unproductive and stressful to judge anybody else who's doing the same thing. [STRIKE]Judging people who feed their eight week old infants cola from a chav spoon and take them out nudey buff in the snow is still ok, of course.[/STRIKE]

MrsTinks

SugarSpun wrote: »

I think that those of us who have successfully breastfed are likely not to realise that other people found it harder to get past the struggly bits and therefore there's an element of thinking, Well I managed it through [this problem] and you should have managed too.

I know what you mean, and I recognise that this is probably why there is little understanding from a lot of BF mums towards those of us who gave up. And I think this is exactly why we feel judged - like we're rubbish because we're not as good as you because YOU managed to get through it. And I can't describe just how hurtful that is when it's something you have had hammered into you already that you're a failure over is then thrown at you again and again by people.
And to then be told "that's not a good enough reason"... well it was for me, it was at that point in time and it probably will be for others in future. You cannot ever ever ever understand my exact circumstances - you may have felt you were in the same place, had the same/worse problems... but obviously you didn't... because it didn't effect YOU enough to make you give up BFing... DYSWIM?

As for the birth thing... I had an epidural too, I was screaming out for it for an hour before I got it, I was shaking in pain with every contraction... I think they're wonderful! But that was for me - it was the right thing for me! And you know? I wouldn't have another either... as discussed with my husband I will only have another child if I can have an elective C-section. Why? Because I really don't want another forcepts delivery that will cause as much problems down there for me again that I now will probably need corrective surgery... Natural? Sure - if it's the right thing for you - it's not for everyone.

MrsTinks

SugarSpun wrote: »

[STRIKE]Judging people who feed their eight week old infants cola from a chav spoon and take them out nudey buff in the snow is still ok, of course.[/STRIKE]

Seriously? wow... I waited till DD was 10 weeks - I mean sheeeeesh! (I'm kidding I'm kidding! she's not even had so much as a chocolate button yet! I promise! and only organic diluted applejuice!)

xmaslolly76

I should deffo be in the super bad mummy club. Ive always used wipes and disposable nappies, always given calpol and gripe water and when i had my first child 11 yrs ago (ducks for cover before she says this) i dipped her dummy in whiskey when she was teething. I smoked through my first two pregnancies although i did give up after having DS1. I completely weaned my first two on jared food and must admit to having a few jars stashed this time round as well.
I also used to make DD & DS1 milk bottles in the morning and store them in the fridge till needed now i just make water bottles and add the powder later which apparently is just as bad.

Good god reading that lot anyone would think i hate my kids!!