Children Wetting Themselves at school!

tandraig

milliebear I am not having a go at you personally - but I have to take exception to the post which was quoted and the paragraph highlighted in red. I live exactly 8 minutes walk away from my gDs school. If I am phoned (as contact in leiu of parents) It is not always convenient for me to go to the school immediately. I may be in the middle of cooking or have an appointment or in the bath!! Just because a parent lives close to the school it does NOT mean they can drop everything and arrive at school 5 minutes later. Also, the school is acting in locum parentis during school hours - as parents we entrust our kids to the school to act in the KIDS best interests - not the convenience of the staff! tbh - schools sometimes give out the message they would prefer parents to camp outside the school gates all day. parents have lives and other commitments - be it work or aged parents or health problems. If a child is NOT mostly out of nappies then the school should refuse entry until the child is - but then be prepared to deal with accidents!
rant over - and it wasnt directed at you milliebear - but some of those who seem to feel that parents should be on hand to deal with things that teachers used to take in thier stride.

mrcow

tandraig wrote: »

If I am phoned (as contact in leiu of parents) It is not always convenient for me to go to the school immediately. I may be in the middle of cooking or have an appointment or in the bath!!

Are you saying that if the school phoned you becuase your child had soiled themselves and needed your immediate help then you'd finish your cooking first?!

tandraig

well i wouldnt leave it baking in oven or boiling away! and i would have to dress or get arrested!!! I am just saying that you cant always drop everything and arrrive at school within a few minutes!! also, Gds parents live 25 minutes walk away (which is why i am first contact) and their dad is severely asthmatic so 25 minutes for me or anyone else can take him an hour or more as he doesnt have a car. If it was real emergency i am sure i can get there before the ambulance does. even with above circumstances - but - in Gds school for wetting or soiling they are quietly changed and me or mum are handed plastic bag at end of day. but - I have been called down to school to deal with ....grazed knee - needed a plaster and kiss.....K was crying because C had been told off??? K had forgotten her lunch bag (she hadnt it was just in other cloakroom) these are all matters that would be dealt with by the staff when my kids were at school. are you surprised i get peed off?

andrealm

milliebear, how long would your school leave them for before changing them?
Schools always used to be able to deal with the odd accident, I remember children (who were toilet trained) wetting themselves in the first couple of years at primary school and the teachers were able to deal with it despite not having TAs, this was in the early 80s when I started school.

Surely it's unusual to have 4 children in a class not trained? I have read that 80% of children are trained by 3 and by age 4 only about 4% are still in nappies. My DD has just started preschool and the vast majority of children are fully trained, bar the odd accident. My DD is 3 and is using the toilet but is not totally reliable so she goes in a pull up. I'm not entirely sure what their policy is as they said they are used to dealing with the odd accident but if they were frequent they would call a parent in. Now I can understand that it's difficult as they only have 2 members of staff but I'm not very happy with the idea of my child being left for 15-20 mins until I get there.

milliebear00001

andrealm wrote: »

milliebear, how long would your school leave them for before changing them?
Schools always used to be able to deal with the odd accident, I remember children (who were toilet trained) wetting themselves in the first couple of years at primary school and the teachers were able to deal with it despite not having TAs, this was in the early 80s when I started school.

Surely it's unusual to have 4 children in a class not trained? I have read that 80% of children are trained by 3 and by age 4 only about 4% are still in nappies. My DD has just started preschool and the vast majority of children are fully trained, bar the odd accident. My DD is 3 and is using the toilet but is not totally reliable so she goes in a pull up. I'm not entirely sure what their policy is as they said they are used to dealing with the odd accident but if they were frequent they would call a parent in. Now I can understand that it's difficult as they only have 2 members of staff but I'm not very happy with the idea of my child being left for 15-20 mins until I get there.

We would make a phone call to a parent of a regular soiler (not wetters who were largely able to sort themselves out) who lived in close proximity (she could be there within 5 min, but often chose not to be). My point is not that children should be penalised, but that there are often 29 other children who ARE being penalised daily when their learning is disrupted by staff having to take time out to deal with a single child's accident. It is not a simple matter of a TA being free to deal with this. It is TWO free members of staff having to be found/take time out of what they are doing everytime an accident occurs.

I am not talking about the 'odd accident' but the increasing numbers of children who start school who clearly have not been reliably trained. Often, within a few weeks of the school implementing a proper toileting programme, the children ARE trained - but that should not be our job.

Untrained YR children are a growing phenomenon. Nobody is quite sure why this is happening, but it is. Yes, four in a class is unusual (although not that unusual in some areas) but one or two arriving in nappies/pull-ups is not - this is a social issue, not a developmental or medical one, and it is starting to have a real impact on early teaching.

milliebear00001

tandraig wrote: »

It is not always convenient for me to go to the school immediately. Just as it is not always convenient for the teacher/TA/class to stop what they are doing and take time away from the classroom to change a child. Also, the school is acting in locum parentis during school hours - as parents we entrust our kids to the school to act in the KIDS best interests - not the convenience of the staff! It is not about the convenience of the staff, but what is best for the 29 other children we are equally responsible for at that time. If a child is NOT mostly out of nappies then the school should refuse entry until the child is - but then be prepared to deal with accidents! We are not legally allowed to do this!
.

Just a few points.

bylromarha

milliebear00001 wrote: »

It is TWO free members of staff having to be found/take time out of what they are doing everytime an accident occurs.

Any way your policy could be reviewed so it is only one staff member?

Our staff used to stand in the doorway and leave doors open if child need physical help purely because I was not willing to repeatedly penalise the 29 for the 1. My first reception class were in a hut, and the times I had no TA and accidents I just had to get on with it and make sure I was visible in the window as much as possible.

I agree kids in nappies at school is continuing to grow in number and it's a social problem. But equal ops mean they can't be refused entry-schools either need to adapt or be sued.:rolleyes:

milliebear00001

It's the poor TAs at our school. We have an ultra-paranoid Head who insists staff are never alone with a child, and that they only ever deal with soiled children in twos. The wetters aren't so bad as they can take off their own stuff (usually) and then just change into dry, but soiled kids need intimate cleaning. Not sure I'd be happy to do that without the protection of another party being there. This is what the Unions advise also (when they're not instructing us just to flatly refuse to do it). Sad, but probably a sign of the times.

bylromarha

milliebear00001 wrote: »

Ian ultra-paranoid Head who insists staff are never alone with a child,

one of those...

DS's head is like this. Makes me livid the stories I've heard.

Most recent, my childminder's daughter was stung by a wasp-the sting was left in whilst mum was rung and as mum couldn't get there for 35 minutes, the sting was left in as the head wouldn't remove it or let her staff remove it due to "HS." Poor child was left with a massive red welt for days from the prolonged exposure to the sting. My childminder said the head wanted to explain why they hadn't removed the sting before they let her get to her daughter to remove it too-too right that she just pushed her way past to help her daughter.

Just don't understand Heads who put the risk of getting sued before a child's wellbeing. 2 adults removed from a class to aid an accident is sillyness. How is that looking after the entire class and teaching them? 1 accident a day, 10 mins to resolve. That's 100 mins of teaching time lost per week instead of 50 mins. 600 mins instead of 300 per half term. Your head is losing 5 teaching hours per half term due to HS;) Most heads would balk at that:D

Savvy_Sue

JMW77 wrote: »

My son is still having problems at school ,still wet at least twice a week we have tried everything.The school he goes to has the opinion it is normal to be dry at 2 so i am not happy, i have read many other posts who say its common and it helps to feel i'm not on my own,but i left the school today feeling like they have had enough of him so i am dreading next week now.

Have you had him checked out at GP or talked to HV? It is possible there is a physical problem, I am not sure at what point the medics would consider it necessary to investigate but if you've flagged it now it will give you a chance to work through all their suggestions.

And if your son is anxious and that is adding to the problem, then a letter from the GP or HV may get them off his case, and that alone may help!